Best Stereo SACD versions of these albums?

[Lance B]

Hi All. I am new to these forums and have a lot of catching up to do as I have not really dabbled with my sound system or purchased SACDs for quite a while. A bit of background: My Marantz SA7001 KI Signature started to refuse to play some SACDs and CDs and I thought it time to "update". Purchased the Marantz SA8005 as a replacement and have been enjoying it very much. It is hooked up to my Plinius 9200 amp which has 200W rms a side and well over 300W rms into 4 ohms running my (Australian) Orpheus Aurora 3.3 speakers which are 4 ohm. I am using Audio Quest "Columbia" interconnects. The sound is amazing using appropriate material, deep, tight, very dynamic, punchy bass, clean well defined mids and highs, with great sound stage and depth. I love the dynamics, the bass, the sound stage but the system really shines and needs great source material. Telarc recordings sound fantastic like: Papa Doo Run Run's "California Project", Mussorgsky's "Pictures at an Exhibition" on SACD, Bizet's "Carmen Suite" to just name a few of the Telarc recordings I have which are all great. Well recorded SACDs: Roxy Music's "Avalon" which is simply stunning, The Police "Regatta De Blanc" SHM and "Synchronicity" SHM, Deep Purple "Machine Head" is amazing, Elton John "Honky Chateau" amazing sound stage, Moody Blues "A Question of Balance" fantastic dynamics & "On the Threshold of a Dream", Peter Gabriel "Shaking the Tree", Dave Brubeck "Time Out" I cannot believe how unbelievably good this album is for a recording from 1959!! Miles Davis "Kind of Blue" is also excellent. These are some of the great SACDs, IMO, that I have. Some CCR stuff is very good, also, considering it's age. However, there are quite a few ordinary SACDs and CD remasters which is disappointing, many lacking bass and some too bright or thin.

As you may glean, I am a fan of dynamic good bass, with a good sound stage and not too shrill mid high end. With that in mind, what are some top shelf SACD recordings? I know there are a number of different recordings from different labels, but what are good versions? A few albums I am looking at the moment like: Dire Straits "Communique". Beach Boys "Pet Sounds". Cream "Disraeli Gears". Yes "Close to the Edge" - I have 3 versions including an SACD version and none are what I would call much good, IMO. All lack low end and can be a little shrill, probably due to the original source tapes which can be an issue from any source material. Any other thoughts on other music types? New recordings that offer excellent recorded music? Soft jazz? Anything? I have a pretty broad appreciation of music.

I am also setting up a dedicated computer which I will record all of my CDs to on a SSD drive and play them though the DAC of the Marantz SA8005. The computer will also allow me to download 192khz 24bit DSD material from the internet and play it through the Marantz. However, at this stage I wouldn't even know where to begin to look for any of this music source.

Thanks in advance.

 

[MCDave]

Hello and welcome to the forum. I have many of the SACDs you mentioned and agree they are excellent. I think "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road" is as good as, or better than, "Honky Chateau". Both have stellar sound.

One of the best sounding SACDs of classic rock that I have is The Who "Tommy", which is easily the equal to the Elton John titles and the soundfield is incredible. On a really good system like yours (and mine) it's extremely satisfying. Daltrey's solo vocal at times sounds like he's right there in the room with you.

If you're willing to enjoy SACDs in stereo, I highly recommend Muddy Waters' "Folk Singer". It is reference quality and recorded in 1963! The dynamics and guitar work are amazing. Also in stereo is "Friday Night in San Francisco", a concert by Al Di Meola, Paco De Lucia and John McLaughlin. Both the sound and the guitar playing will drop your jaw to the floor. If you must enjoy these in surround, they're also good in Dolby Pro Logic II or IIx.

As for classical, that's my main musical interest these days. I have many, many SACD titles that are superb, but two that stood out recently are:

Beethoven's Razumovsky quartets (Op. 59, his masterpiece) by the Kuijken Quartet - http://www.allmusic.com/album/beeth...-razumovsky-string-quintet-op-29-mw0002120759

Saint-Saens cello concertos, carnival, wedding cake - http://www.allmusic.com/album/relea...-the-animals-africa-wedding-cake-mr0004497348

Both the Beethoven and Saint-Saens are beyond reproach, both in sound and performance, IMO.

If you can stand 3 channels instead of 5 (left, center, right), the RCA Living Stereo collection of classic performances from the 50's and 60's are a real treat. You said you were impressed with the sound quality of a 1959 recording - you'll be equally impressed with these. They were recorded direct to tape with no EQ originally, and the SACD masteres were made straight from the tapes, again with no EQ and minimal processing. They sound like they were made yesterday. Although not technically surround, the 3 front channels present a nice wide soundstage. The performances are magical, which is why these SACS were made. Orchestras today just don't cut it compared to the greats of classical music's heyday. Give this one a try - https://www.amazon.com/Pops-Caviar-Arthur-Fiedler/dp/B000E1NWGE Orchestral Fireworks is right! It will leave you exhausted...

 

[Lance B]

Hello and welcome to the forum. I have many of the SACDs you mentioned and agree they are excellent. I think "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road" is as good as, or better than, "Honky Chateau". Both have stellar sound.

One of the best sounding SACDs of classic rock that I have is The Who "Tommy", which is easily the equal to the Elton John titles and the soundfield is incredible. On a really good system like yours (and mine) it's extremely satisfying. Daltrey's solo vocal at times sounds like he's right there in the room with you.

If you're willing to enjoy SACDs in stereo, I highly recommend Muddy Waters' "Folk Singer". It is reference quality and recorded in 1963! The dynamics and guitar work are amazing. Also in stereo is "Friday Night in San Francisco", a concert by Al Di Meola, Paco De Lucia and John McLaughlin. Both the sound and the guitar playing will drop your jaw to the floor. If you must enjoy these in surround, they're also good in Dolby Pro Logic II or IIx.

As for classical, that's my main musical interest these days. I have many, many SACD titles that are superb, but two that stood out recently are:

Beethoven's Razumovsky quartets (Op. 59, his masterpiece) by the Kuijken Quartet - http://www.allmusic.com/album/beeth...-razumovsky-string-quintet-op-29-mw0002120759

Saint-Saens cello concertos, carnival, wedding cake - http://www.allmusic.com/album/relea...-the-animals-africa-wedding-cake-mr0004497348

Both the Beethoven and Saint-Saens are beyond reproach, both in sound and performance, IMO.

If you can stand 3 channels instead of 5 (left, center, right), the RCA Living Stereo collection of classic performances from the 50's and 60's are a real treat. You said you were impressed with the sound quality of a 1959 recording - you'll be equally impressed with these. They were recorded direct to tape with no EQ originally, and the SACD masteres were made straight from the tapes, again with no EQ and minimal processing. They sound like they were made yesterday. Although not technically surround, the 3 front channels present a nice wide soundstage. The performances are magical, which is why these SACS were made. Orchestras today just don't cut it compared to the greats of classical music's heyday. Give this one a try - https://www.amazon.com/Pops-Caviar-Arthur-Fiedler/dp/B000E1NWGE Orchestral Fireworks is right! It will leave you exhausted...

Hi Dave. Thank you for your very informative post. I only have a SACD stereo system, not 5.1 surround SACD system. The recommendations look great, but I guess what I am after is which particular versions of the SACDs you recommend as some are sometimes released by different labels with different mixes etc. Maybe not the classical titles you mention and have linked to but "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road", "Tommy", Muddy Waters "Folk Singer" etc are sometimes by different labels - although these may be examples that are available by only one label. There is Mobile Fidelity, SHM Japanese versions etc.

All your info is very much appreciated.

 

[John Svensson]

In almost every case for non-classical ...there has only been 1 SACD release of a title, so your chances of getting the "wrong" one are miniscule. Both the Elton John and Tommy SACDs came out in "Deluxe Edition" packaging, and since both came out in 2003 your biggest obstacle will be finding copies that don't have an inflated price tag. Since multi-channel is not a consideration for you, see what is currently available from Mobile Fidelity and Audio Fidelity as examples. There is also a Stereo SACD section to this forum that may point you in some directions. John

 

[MCDave]

Hi Dave. Thank you for your very informative post. I only have a SACD stereo system, not 5.1 surround SACD system. The recommendations look great, but I guess what I am after is which particular versions of the SACDs you recommend as some are sometimes released by different labels with different mixes etc. Maybe not the classical titles you mention and have linked to but "Goodbye Yellow Brick Road", "Tommy", Muddy Waters "Folk Singer" etc are sometimes by different labels - although these may be examples that are available by only one label. There is Mobile Fidelity, SHM Japanese versions etc.

All your info is very much appreciated.

Just give me a hard slap on the back of the head...I was tires and forgot it was the stereo subforum that you posted in! And there it is right in the title of your original post. Sorry about that.

So anyway, John is correct that there are rarely different versions of SACD titles, except for classical.

All of the SACDs I mentioned, including the multichannel ones, are hybrid SACDs (as are all SACDs being produced now, I'm pretty sure) that have a 2-channel layer. All of my comments on sound quality pertained to fidelity rather than the effectiveness of the surround mix, so they're all still relevant.

I have 3 of the Mobile Fidelity releases of classic rock titles and they are excellent. Can't recommend them enough. MoFi has a long history of audiophile releases in LP, CD and now SACD so they're trustworthy. 99% of what they do is 2-channel. I've had several dozen releases from their catalog dating back to early 90's and never heard one that wasn't excellent. the three I have are Alan Parson's Project "I, Robot", and Doobie Brothers "Captain and Me" and "Takin in to the Streets".

And since we're talking stereo, I'll double up on my recommendation for the Muddy Waters and Friday Night releases. Simply stunning, and GREAT music too!

 

[bmoura]

In almost every case for non-classical ...there has only been 1 SACD release of a title, so your chances of getting the "wrong" one are miniscule.

Except in these cases where there were multiple editions of an album on SACD including:

1. Several of the early Sony Music SACDs which initially came out as Single Layer Stereo SACDs and later were released as a Single Layer Stereo SACD, Single Layer Muitichannel SACD, Hybrid Stereo SACD or Hybrid Layer Multichannel SACD in the US.

2. Albums which were released by Sony Music in the US on SACD and then later reissued on SACD by Sony Japan or one of the reissue labels. Examples of that would be the self-titled album by Blood, Sweat & Tears which has been released on SACD by Sony Music, Mobile Fidelity and Audio Fidelity and Carole King's Tapestry which was issued on SACD by Sony Music US, Mobile Fidelity and Sony Music Hong Kong and some albums by Jeff Beck which have apperared on SACD from Sony Music, Analogue Productions, Audio Fidelity and Sony Japan.

 

[Plan9]

Except in these cases where there were multiple editions of an album on SACD including:

1. Several of the early Sony Music SACDs which initially came out as Single Layer Stereo SACDs and later were released as a Single Layer Stereo SACD, Single Layer Muitichannel SACD, Hybrid Stereo SACD or Hybrid Layer Multichannel SACD in the US.

2. Albums which were released by Sony Music in the US on SACD and then later reissued on SACD by Sony Japan or one of the reissue labels. Examples of that would be the self-titled album by Blood, Sweat & Tears which has been released on SACD by Sony Music, Mobile Fidelity and Audio Fidelity and Carole King's Tapestry which was issued on SACD by Sony Music US, Mobile Fidelity and Sony Music Hong Kong and some albums by Jeff Beck which have apperared on SACD from Sony Music, Analogue Productions, Audio Fidelity and Sony Japan.

There are also the stereo-only single-layer SHM-SACDs from Japan.

Elton John s/t, Roxy Music's Avalon, Steely Dan's Gaucho, among many others were released as SHM-SACDs with a totally different mastering from their "standard" counterparts...

 

[4-earredwonder]

Except in these cases where there were multiple editions of an album on SACD including:

1. Several of the early Sony Music SACDs which initially came out as Single Layer Stereo SACDs and later were released as a Single Layer Stereo SACD, Single Layer Muitichannel SACD, Hybrid Stereo SACD or Hybrid Layer Multichannel SACD in the US.

2. Albums which were released by Sony Music in the US on SACD and then later reissued on SACD by Sony Japan or one of the reissue labels. Examples of that would be the self-titled album by Blood, Sweat & Tears which has been released on SACD by Sony Music, Mobile Fidelity and Audio Fidelity and Carole King's Tapestry which was issued on SACD by Sony Music US, Mobile Fidelity and Sony Music Hong Kong and some albums by Jeff Beck which have apperared on SACD from Sony Music, Analogue Productions, Audio Fidelity and Sony Japan.

Regarding Carole King's Tapestry: SONY Japan is again releasing this classic as a multichannel SACD in 7" Gatefold packaging in September: http://www.cdjapan.co.jp/product/SICP-10120

I will definitely double dip for this title.

 

[Lance B]

Just give me a hard slap on the back of the head...I was tires and forgot it was the stereo subforum that you posted in! And there it is right in the title of your original post. Sorry about that.

Not a problem. Happens to the best of us, LOL.

So anyway, John is correct that there are rarely different versions of SACD titles, except for classical.

All of the SACDs I mentioned, including the multichannel ones, are hybrid SACDs (as are all SACDs being produced now, I'm pretty sure) that have a 2-channel layer. All of my comments on sound quality pertained to fidelity rather than the effectiveness of the surround mix, so they're all still relevant.

I have 3 of the Mobile Fidelity releases of classic rock titles and they are excellent. Can't recommend them enough. MoFi has a long history of audiophile releases in LP, CD and now SACD so they're trustworthy. 99% of what they do is 2-channel. I've had several dozen releases from their catalog dating back to early 90's and never heard one that wasn't excellent. the three I have are Alan Parson's Project "I, Robot", and Doobie Brothers "Captain and Me" and "Takin in to the Streets".

And since we're talking stereo, I'll double up on my recommendation for the Muddy Waters and Friday Night releases. Simply stunning, and GREAT music too!

Thanks again.

 

[Lance B]

Except in these cases where there were multiple editions of an album on SACD including:

1. Several of the early Sony Music SACDs which initially came out as Single Layer Stereo SACDs and later were released as a Single Layer Stereo SACD, Single Layer Muitichannel SACD, Hybrid Stereo SACD or Hybrid Layer Multichannel SACD in the US.

2. Albums which were released by Sony Music in the US on SACD and then later reissued on SACD by Sony Japan or one of the reissue labels. Examples of that would be the self-titled album by Blood, Sweat & Tears which has been released on SACD by Sony Music, Mobile Fidelity and Audio Fidelity and Carole King's Tapestry which was issued on SACD by Sony Music US, Mobile Fidelity and Sony Music Hong Kong and some albums by Jeff Beck which have apperared on SACD from Sony Music, Analogue Productions, Audio Fidelity and Sony Japan.

Thank you for your thoughts.

However, I see there is a Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs SACD of Dire Straits "Communique" and also a Japanese SHM version. Are they the same? The Dire Straits album from MoFi is not available at the moment, it was a numbered pressing. However there seems to be a few of these albums done by MoFi and there are also the Japanese SHM versions. I would have thought the MoFi version would be a different pressing to the Japanese SHM? I see there are other Dire Straits albums from MoFi and others with the Japanese SHM label. There is Santana's "Abraxas" from MoFi but also in other versions as well. So, are the MoFi versions different to some of the other labels? If I understand it correctly, the SHM versions are just other versions but with the SHM "treatment"? It is getting confusing.

 

[privateuniverse]

Thank you for your thoughts.

I would have thought the MoFi version would be a different pressing to the Japanese SHM? I see there are other Dire Straits albums from MoFi and others with the Japanese SHM label..... So, are the MoFi versions different to some of the other labels? If I understand it correctly, the SHM versions are just other versions but with the SHM "treatment"? It is getting confusing.

I don't know all the specifics on the various Dire Straits SACDs, however one thing that I have noticed is that the Japanese SACDs of Alchemy & Brothers in Arms use the LP track listings (i.e. Alchemy does not include "Love Over Gold"; Brothers in Arms has the shorter versions of "Why Worry", "So Far Away", "Money For Nothing" and "Your Latest Trick".) Looking at the Discogs listing for the Mobile Fidelity pressing of Brothers in Arms, it looks like they used the longer (CD) versions of those four songs. So the Japanese and MFSL SACDs of Brothers in Arms would not be identical.

 

[bmoura]

Thank you for your thoughts.

However, I see there is a Mobile Fidelity Sound Labs SACD of Dire Straits "Communique" and also a Japanese SHM version. Are they the same? The Dire Straits album from MoFi is not available at the moment, it was a numbered pressing. However there seems to be a few of these albums done by MoFi and there are also the Japanese SHM versions. I would have thought the MoFi version would be a different pressing to the Japanese SHM? I see there are other Dire Straits albums from MoFi and others with the Japanese SHM label. There is Santana's "Abraxas" from MoFi but also in other versions as well. So, are the MoFi versions different to some of the other labels? If I understand it correctly, the SHM versions are just other versions but with the SHM "treatment"? It is getting confusing.

Depends on the SACD release.
Some use the same DSD tapes as the earlier SACDs. But others do a brand new transfer and mastering.

 

[bmoura]

There are also the stereo-only single-layer SHM-SACDs from Japan.

Elton John s/t, Roxy Music's Avalon, Steely Dan's Gaucho, among many others were released as SHM-SACDs with a totally different mastering from their "standard" counterparts...

Yes, yet another example of multiple releases of the same album.
In addition to different mastering among the SHM-SACDs, some will use the earlier DSD tapes for their source (like Bayou Country by CCR) and others start from a different source than the earlier SACD releases.