HiRez Poll Simon, Carly - NO SECRETS [Blu-ray Audio (Dolby Atmos)]

[rtbluray]

Please post your thoughts and comments on this brand new reissue of the classic Carly Simon album "No Secrets".
This new Blu-ray Audio reissue from Rhino records contains the original stereo mix, the original 1970s Quadraphonic mix, the 5.1 surround mix previously available on DVDA-V, and a new Dolby Atmos mix.

 

[Dynamic Editor]

Starting listening! First impressions is that it already improves on the stereo mix, as that mix's vocal reverb was horrendous, to my memory.

The spread of instrumentation is pretty good!

The Blu Ray menu is among the ugliest I've ever seen, with text looking like it was ripped straight from an old computer game. Of course, that doesn't matter too much, but it did strike me.

 

[dquad]

Does DisneySpirit only rate HiRez polls a 10?

 

[Juggsnelson]

First impression....does the lead vocal on You're So Vain seem a tad bit recessed....especially once the lead in to the chorus starts? Love being able to switch between all 3 surround mixes on the fly!

 

[Mark Zutkoff]

I listened to the entire Quadio mix yesterday and was VERY pleased. I was only familiar with the radio hits from this album, but the entire listening experience was enjoyable, enhanced by the fabulous surround separation and movement. The songs themselves are sometimes... strange... but the musicianship is superb throughout. (Interesting that Klaus Voormann shines so much playing bass on most tracks of this album, including the stellar "You're So Vain", whereas when working with a Beatle, he sounds more... pedestrian.) I highly recommend this one.

 

[JDeanB]

I got a chance to listen to both the Quadio and the Dolby Atmos. While I liked the Dolby Atmos, it was the Quadio that really appealed to me. I am ready for the rest of the Carly quad albums to be released.

 

[marpow]

The Blu Ray menu is among the ugliest I've ever seen

I can't help myself, that picture of Carly Simon, who's looking at the track list.
I bet you baited someone like me with that statement

 

[jefe1]

Hell I dont even plan to listen to the music just look at the menu.

How many album copies did that cover photo sell.....

 

[steelydave]

@ForagingRhino Sadly the booklet for this release doesn't have a photo of the quad master tape in the gatefold like the dedicated Quadio releases do - is there any chance you could post a picture of it here, or at least confirm whether it was Bill Schnee (or someone else) who did the quad mix?

 

[ForagingRhino]

Yup.
Bill Schnee, March 1973, Sound Labs, Hollywood.

 

[steelydave]

Yup.
Bill Schnee, March 1973, Sound Labs, Hollywood.

Wow, thanks so much for posting this, it's fascinating to see. Seems like WEA kept Sound Labs pretty busy with quad mixes for a couple of years, even if they insisted on NOT USING ELEKTRA QUAD TRACK CONFIGURATIONS!

I recall @fizzywiggs41 posting a photo of an interview with Richard Perry from some CD-4 promotional literature where he said that mixing You're So Vain in quad was one of the best experiences he ever had in a studio - maybe he could share it here if he can find it again...

 

[sjcorne]

Here's an interesting excerpt from an old interview with Schnee where he mentions mixing No Secrets in quad:

TLM: What’s your take on multi-channel audio?

Bill: I love it. I was involved with the old Quad [four-channel] records in the early 70s. I loved it then and I loved it now. The question has always been, what do you do? Do try to put the listener in the middle of the band or basically have the band on stage in front of you, with some things bouncing around and behind you? It’s a new kind of canvas and different people are going to paint with different hues of colours.

Speaking of quad, I remember when I redid the Carly Simon album No Secrets with ’You’re So Vain’ on it, and the studio that I mixed in had a quad panner, a knob I could use to move sound anywhere between four speakers. I kept the mix pretty normal, but when that guitar solo happened, I remember moving it around the speakers; it was just a fun moment. Multichannel is a different palette, and it’s a lot like the complaints you hear from people when the first Beatles or Beach Boys records were in stereo. You get used to what it is and everything else is different – a lot of people love it; a lot of people don’t love it.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

@steelydave
Oh you must mean this one Steely , from CD 4FORUM , September 1975.

Richard Perry , is considered one of the "main men" in the Music business today. Besides the 10 gold albums and five gold singles that adorn his Hollywood Hills home, Perry is more known to the record community as the brilliant independent producer for Ringo Starr , Carly Simon , Barbra , Streisand , Harry Nilsson , and Ella Fitzgerald, among other artists.

Editor : Have you found any problems with CD-4 recording ?
Perry : Well, I'm just beginning to get into it myself but I haven't found any problem. It's just a question of starting to explore the resources available with CD-4.
Editor: How do recording artists feel about CD-4? Do they like it?
Perry : They seem to like it tremendously . I know that one night while working on Carly Simon's "No Secrets" album , we were listening to one of the most driving, up beat tracks on the album and there were quite a few people in the studio at the time , and we had the whole thing playing back in four-channel .
The room started lifting...and it was one of the first times I had heard something back in four-channel that I was working on. I had done some Barbra Streisand albums in quadraphonics , but that was matrix and I was not happy with the results . What I heard made me really believe that CD-4 is the only system to go with.
Editor : Do you decide if a record is matrix or CD-4?
Perry: I have limited decision whether it's CD-4 or matrix . It depends on the recording company and their commitment . In that case I can make the decision. Rarely can a company put out a four-channel product unless I sanction it and unless I do the mixing. At times , I might be too busy to do it or they tell me too late to mix in four-channel. If I make it my business to do something in four-channel, it will come out in four-channel.


(Note these are the highlights of the full page interview.)

 

[steelydave]

Here's an interesting excerpt from an old interview with Schnee where he mentions mixing No Secrets in quad:

"Speaking of quad, I remember when I redid the Carly Simon album No Secrets with ’You’re So Vain’ on it, and the studio that I mixed in had a quad panner, a knob I could use to move sound anywhere between four speakers. I kept the mix pretty normal, but when that guitar solo happened, I remember moving it around the speakers; it was just a fun moment. "


This would almost certainly be the API 480 'Quadrasonic Stereo Panner' which was ubiquitous in consoles back in those days. You can see two on the back cover of Steely Dan's Countdown to Ecstasy right near Skunk Baxter's boots (it's The Village Recorder, where Ed Michel and Baker Bigsby did most of their quad work) and also in that video of BB King at Command Studios in London.

They're also what were used at Sigma Sound for the PIR quad mixes - Arthur Stoppe told me they also used them to do the diagonal 'quad center' pans, because there was no simple way in the console to route a mono signal to two speakers diagonally. So they'd route the mono signal to the two quad panners, and then put an elastic band around one joystick and pull it to one corner and anchor the other end of the elastic to something on the mixing board to hold it there, and then do the same to the other joystick pulling it in the other diagonally opposite direction.

Oh you must mean this one Steely , from CD 4FORUM , September 1975.

Richard Perry , is considered one of the "main men" in the Music business today. Besides the 10 gold albums and five gold singles that adorn his Hollywood Hills home, Perry is more known to the record community as the brilliant independent producer for Ringo Starr , Carly Simon , Barbra , Streisand , Harry Nilsson , and Ella Fitzgerald, among other artists.

Editor : Have you found any problems with CD-4 recording ?
Perry : Well, I'm just beginning to get into it myself but I haven't found any problem. It's just a question of starting to explore the resources available with CD-4.
Editor: How do recording artists feel about CD-4? Do they like it?
Perry : They seem to like it tremendously . I know that one night while working on Carly Simon's "No Secrets" album , we were listening to one of the most driving, up beat tracks on the album and there were quite a few people in the studio at the time , and we had the whole thing playing back in four-channel .
The room started lifting...and it was one of the first times I had heard something back in four-channel that I was working on. I had done some Barbra Streisand albums in quadraphonics , but that was matrix and I was not happy with the results . What I heard made me really believe that CD-4 is the only system to go with.
Editor : Do you decide if a record is matrix or CD-4?
Perry: I have limited decision whether it's CD-4 or matrix . It depends on the recording company and their commitment . In that case I can make the decision. Rarely can a company put out a four-channel product unless I sanction it and unless I do the mixing. At times , I might be too busy to do it or they tell me too late to mix in four-channel. If I make it my business to do something in four-channel, it will come out in four-channel.

Thanks Fizzy, that's the one - you really should get all that stuff scanned on a flatbed scanner so it can be preserved for future generations.

It's kind of amazing how almost all of Perry's major projects from about 1971 through 1976 were mixed in quad: Barbra Streisand, Perry Como, Harry Nilsson, Carly Simon, Ringo Starr, Art Garfunkel and Burton Cummings. Outside of staff producers at RCA (who didn't have any choice in the matter) I don't know if you'd find a more consistent and committed producer of quad albums.

 

[MixerRog]

Fizzy,

Thanks for the very interesting details. Being an Electronics Engineer, I suspect the Quad Stereo Panner would have added phase issues that could be corrected in a digital mix but sometimes that adds to the magic of the mix analog sound also.

I always liked the original quad mix of "No Secrets" while hearing Mick Jagger clearly on "You're So Vain" for the first time that can now even be separated with AI.

Rog

 

[califcab]

A mostly very good Atmos mix - except for Your so Vain, which is not as good as the 5.1 or Quadio versions. Background vocals and guitar solo are mixed a little low. Including an excellent Quadio mix and decent 5.1 mix makes for a great listening experience. I gave it a 9.

 

[Juggsnelson]

I voted a 9. I love the Quad and 5.1 mixes. The Atmos mix is very good except for You're So Vain (as mentioned above). The verses are ok but it seems like it loses power and momentum as it heads into the chorus. Great value for the money here and 3 mostly excellent surround mixes to choose from.

 

[par4ken]

This would almost certainly be the API 480 'Quadrasonic Stereo Panner' which was ubiquitous in consoles back in those days.

Sorry for drifting so far off topic, but where can I find one of those? I actually have a stock of quad joysticks but none with conductive plastic pots, mine are all carbon. I'm toying with the idea of building a new mixer/preamp for quad with extra inputs to accommodate those pesky extra channels. A joystick could be used to pan the centre channel anywhere in the room!

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Thanks Fizzy, that's the one - you really should get all that stuff scanned on a flatbed scanner so it can be preserved for future generations.

It's kind of amazing how almost all of Perry's major projects from about 1971 through 1976 were mixed in quad: Barbra Streisand, Perry Como, Harry Nilsson, Carly Simon, Ringo Starr, Art Garfunkel and Burton Cummings. Outside of staff producers at RCA (who didn't have any choice in the matter) I don't know if you'd find a more consistent and committed producer of quad albums.

Never a problem posting what I have in my library collection , which contains many items of interest for CD-4 , QS , SQ, H , HJ, UHJ, EV-4, DY-4D, ABC, Dolby Surround MP, Circle CS, Shure HTS , Ultra Stereo , Chace Surround Stereo, Spatializer, Holophonics , Various Binaural , and possibly more.

if So, specific questions regarding something I have (or might have),
I'm willing to accommodate.

[The exception would be my Billboard Items of Interest in quad-Discreet, QS or SQ. Those I did not copy but made note of where one can locate the said quad item.]

So if anyone has a question regarding something I posted in the past , you need only ask.
I'm happy to accommodate any and all requests .

 

[Sonik Wiz]

Great reply!