All Software SM?

[chucky3042]

Thanks!

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...ni-black-box-pre-amp-master.31261/post-661505

 

[Asklia]

Pity, that it cannot be combined with a CD-4 Decoder or compatible Preamp in any way.

 

[chucky3042]

Pity, that it cannot be combined with a CD-4 Decoder or compatible Preamp in any way.

We intend to extend to a super preamp with all sorts of other facilities but the mini preamp is the start of the journey that gets us into the market to with remarkable features.

 

[Asklia]

If you ever built a Preamp with these capabilities, i.e. like my beloved Bose 4401, it will be mine. At any costs. Phono in, optionally CD-4, your Declicking and SQ/QS decoding, some 4 or 5.1 channel in, volume and loudness control, would be a real dream. This to avoid multiple A/D and D/A conversion.
A Mini-DSP could be added for room correction.

 

[barfle]

Hi Barfle

We have no plans or an evaluation module as it really is not pitched at that end of the market.

One of my bucket list projects is to modernize an Altec 724 tuner-preamp. I’m just gathering up ideas as to what I’ll end up making it do, but tidying up vinyl seems like a good idea.

 

[chucky3042]

Pity, that it cannot be combined with a CD-4 Decoder or compatible Preamp in any way.

Here is the post of what we propose for a super preamp, now adding the scratch and hiss removal. But add any ideas here:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...super-surround-preamp-preliminary-info.25537/

 

[MidiMagic]

Are you talking about DSU or FreeSurrround?

Dolby Surround, PL-I, and PL-II all use the same encoding plan. It is a great circle matrix including L only, R only, F = inphase, B (or S) = antiphase.

The only change they made was to add inputs for LB and RB.

 

[ssully]

Dolby Surround, PL-I, and PL-II all use the same encoding plan. It is a great circle matrix including L only, R only, F = inphase, B (or S) = antiphase.

The only change they made was to add inputs for LB and RB.

And I was referring to functionality updates to FreeSurround.

 

[atrocity]

Even in music mode Dolby is far too front oriented.

It depends on whether your hardware allows you to control the various pieces that go into DPL-II music mode. I had a Pioneer that did not and felt the same way you do. But I've had a Denon (still going great after being on 24/7 for over 20 years!) and Onkyo (a brand I'll never buy again!) that allowed adjustments that made DPL-II Music Mode very close to QS. With test tones, everything goes largely where it should and QS-encoded material sounds great...just not as great as the 100% full proper decoding you'd get from a surround master.

My issue with the current Dolby Surround is that it's mostly OK for movies that I assume are encoded with the original matrix, but, opposite to your complaint, when "decoding" things that aren't necessarily encoded, puts too much into the surrounds, even to the point of making dialog difficult to understand.

In my case, I'm using a NAD T 758 and my complaint about too much surround is mostly based on YouTube, so obviously not everyone is going to have the same experience.

 

[Owen Smith]

My issue with the current Dolby Surround is that it's mostly OK for movies that I assume are encoded with the original matrix, but, opposite to your complaint, when "decoding" things that aren't necessarily encoded, puts too much into the surrounds, even to the point of making dialog difficult to understand.

Yes I find Dolby Surround Upmix is fine, even excellent, with TV and films and in fact I think it does a better job on those than DPL II Movie.

But when decoding music from stereo CDs or FM radio it puts far too much in the centre. And if it weren't for that objectionable behaviour I might pay attention to what it is putting into the surrounds, it's definitely quite a lot.

 

[atrocity]

But when decoding music from stereo CDs or FM radio it puts far too much in the centre. And if it weren't for that objectionable behaviour I might pay attention to what it is putting into the surrounds, it's definitely quite a lot.

Yes, FAR too much in the middle! I had actually forgotten about that quirk because I find it so annoying that I simply don't use it for music at all. My main music box has S/PDIF out to the receiver and analog out to the Surround Master, so it's very simple to A/B Involve vs. DS. There's not even a hint of a contest, DS is just awful for music. Or maybe it's more fair to say that it's arguably better than stereo, but awful compared to the old DPL-II Music Mode and/or Involve.

 

[Owen Smith]

My main music box has S/PDIF out to the receiver and analog out to the Surround Master, so it's very simple to A/B Involve vs. DS.

Sadly I have no analogue multichannel inputs on my AVR. I'm stuck with Dolby Surround Upmix, DTS Neural:X (which also puts too much in the centre and creates a pool of sound around each speaker with gaps in between), or Auro 2D (which does something very vague and underwhelming).

What I need is an analogue multichannel to HDMI convertor box, but the reasons why that doesn't exist have been discussed many times.

 

[ssully]

Yes, FAR too much in the middle! I had actually forgotten about that quirk because I find it so annoying that I simply don't use it for music at all. My main music box has S/PDIF out to the receiver and analog out to the Surround Master, so it's very simple to A/B Involve vs. DS. There's not even a hint of a contest, DS is just awful for music. Or maybe it's more fair to say that it's arguably better than stereo, but awful compared to the old DPL-II Music Mode and/or Involve.

As noted to Owen already, if your AVR has the Center Spread option available for DSU, then you can lessen the amount 'in the middle' to what it was for DPLII Music Mode by default,.

If you don't have the option, then you are stuck with the a movie-oriented center setting of DSU, which is not quite an apples-to-apples comparison for DPLII.

 

[atrocity]

As noted to Owen already, if your AVR has the Center Spread option available for DSU, then you can lessen the amount 'in the middle' to what it was for DPLII Music Mode by default,.

If you don't have the option, then you are stuck with the a movie-oriented center setting of DSU, which is not quite an apples-to-apples comparison for DPLII.

I do have that option but I still find it less than satisfactory for music. I'm sure part of that is due to having heard the alternatives.

 

[kfbkfb]

Perhaps using the Hafler passive speaker matrix "decoder" is the best option when an A/V receiver doesn't have any good modes for deriving surround sound from stereo.


I'm probably abandoning my idea of using 2 A/V receivers to get DPL decoding (switching my 4.1 speakers from receiver to receiver, depending on the decoding needed).

https://ubbcentral.com/store/item/P...l-Box-5064-9405-Never-Used-_276520671727.html

I use the above speakers from my old PC in my bedroom Hafler passive speaker matrix "decoder", works well enough for Dolby Surround encoded content.

I have to test my Pioneer VSX-534 to find out if the LS/LB and RS/RB speaker outputs are off in stereo mode, if so, and then all I have to do is obtain another set of the above speakers and connect them (with an on/off switch) in the Hafler configuration, this will provide Dolby Surround decoding and derived surround sound from stereo (the 534 has a lot of derived surround sound modes but nothing for original Dolby Surround decoding).


Kirk Bayne