Quad LP/Tape Poll Eleventh House with Larry Coryell: Introducing [SQ/Q8]

[quadsearcher]

HOLY SHEEP SHIT!!! This is absolutely one of THE best quad mixes ever. I can't say enough good things about it. Totally brilliant I have always dug this album and am a huge Alphonze Mouzon fan but after hearing this in quad it really takes it to a whole other level that I can't even describe. This one goes to 11!!

I'd love to hear a surround mix of Mind Transplant. that would KILL!!

Um, yeah! It is quite good to say the least. I finally scored a minty German pressing off the 'bay last week.

 

[fredblue]

Ok.. so nobody here or anywhere at QQ has mentioned (or at least if they have I can't find anything about it.. ) but the German SQ LP (which does sound amazing btw) has an almighty channel assignment screw up when you decode it into 4 channels..

If I reassign the channels as follows;

1 = Remains FRONT LEFT,
2 = Formerly FRONT RIGHT becomes REAR LEFT,
3 = Formerly REAR LEFT becomes REAR RIGHT,
4 = Formerly REAR RIGHT becomes FRONT RIGHT...

..most things make much more sense when you remap the channels -- but not everything..!

Straight away when you scrutinise the individually decoded channels you notice 2 and 3 are much more muted relative to 1 and 4 - with 1 and 4 having the bulk of the rhythm section at full pelt and 2 and 3 mostly having more reverb tails and stuff (dead giveaway imho) but I say mostly as its not quite as cut and dried as that, though that may well be down to the limitations of SQ and channel bleed through or whatever.

Did I get a dud pressing? Do the Q8 or the U.S SQ LP exhibit the same scenario??

HELP!!
(Thanks in advance)

 

[fredblue]

This will give you an idea of what I mean about remapping the channels, what a mess..!!

 

[fredblue]

revisiting for the first time in a long time (compared the decoded SQ "as is" to the Q8 and they are the same, so i was wrong about the channel assignments, this is one of those "diagonal" mixes). upped to a "9".

 

[steelydave]

I wonder if the same mystery mixer who did the quad mix of ZZ Top's Tres Hombres also did the mix for this one - they both have the same unorthodox drum assignment, stereo in the front and the same stereo mix swapped in the rears. I can't recall a single other quad mix that does the drums this way.

Even though it's not my preferred drum mixing technique, the rest of the mixing decisions are great, and combined with the music this is at least a 9 - I would love to hear how this sounds from the master, because even from the Q8 it's very good.

 

[fredblue]

I wonder if the same mystery mixer who did the quad mix of ZZ Top's Tres Hombres also did the mix for this one - they both have the same unorthodox drum assignment, stereo in the front and the same stereo mix swapped in the rears. I can't recall a single other quad mix that does the drums this way.

Even though it's not my preferred drum mixing technique, the rest of the mixing decisions are great, and combined with the music this is at least a 9 - I would love to hear how this sounds from the master, because even from the Q8 it's very good.

good question..

could there be any clues as to who the mystery mix engineer was.. do the two albums have anything in common.. same label? no. same recording studio? no. same producer? no. same engineer? no... i'm fresh out of ideas!

 

[Beefalo]

revisiting for the first time in a long time (compared the decoded SQ "as is" to the Q8 and they are the same, so i was wrong about the channel assignments, this is one of those "diagonal" mixes). upped to a "9".

I've never heard this.
"The Ripper" to the rescue...

 

[steelydave]

The only thing they have in common as far as I can tell is that the Q8s of both Vanguard (Eleventh House) and London (ZZ Top) were both manufactured and distributed by Ampex tapes, but that's a pretty tenuous connection - I think the only way to determine for sure would be to see what's on the master tape boxes.

Tres Hombres was mixed at Ardent Studios (which was owned by Stax, and quad-equipped according to an article I found in Billboard) in Memphis, so the quad mix could've been done then/there, and Vanguard had been doing quad since something like 1968 or 1969 so most likely their studio in New York was quad-equipped as well. To throw a further wrinkle in to the mix, the stereo LP of Tres Hombres was mastered at Bell Sound Studios in New York, which is where Edison Youngblood remixed all those USTI Q8 tapes for quad.

 

[fredblue]

The only thing they have in common as far as I can tell is that the Q8s of both Vanguard (Eleventh House) and London (ZZ Top) were both manufactured and distributed by Ampex tapes, but that's a pretty tenuous connection - I think the only way to determine for sure would be to see what's on the master tape boxes.

Tres Hombres was mixed at Ardent Studios (which was owned by Stax, and quad-equipped according to an article I found in Billboard) in Memphis, so the quad mix could've been done then/there, and Vanguard had been doing quad since something like 1968 or 1969 so most likely their studio in New York was quad-equipped as well. To throw a further wrinkle in to the mix, the stereo LP of Tres Hombres was mastered at Bell Sound Studios in New York, which is where Edison Youngblood remixed all those USTI Q8 tapes for quad.

maybe the USTI Quads have diagonal drums?

 

[J. PUPSTER]

maybe the USTI Quads have diagonal drums?

If you're still talking about "Introducing" (which has a lot of Zappa sounding influences to me) the discogs page shows that someone threw in the name Dave Baker as being mixed by?
https://www.discogs.com/The-Elevent...ntroducing-The-Eleventh-House/release/8032679

 

[steelydave]

If you're still talking about "Introducing" (which has a lot of Zappa sounding influences to me) the discogs page shows that someone threw in the name Dave Baker as being mixed by?
https://www.discogs.com/The-Elevent...ntroducing-The-Eleventh-House/release/8032679

Vanguard never put any unique remix credits on their quad releases, they're just the stereo jackets with the quad catalog number added on the back. So, there's no way of knowing if the stereo guy did the quad remix, and I suspect in a lot (or even most) of the cases it was probably someone else.

 

[fredblue]

If you're still talking about "Introducing" (which has a lot of Zappa sounding influences to me) the discogs page shows that someone threw in the name Dave Baker as being mixed by?
https://www.discogs.com/The-Elevent...ntroducing-The-Eleventh-House/release/8032679

no known Quad credits, feels a bit iffy

 

[4-earredwonder]

Vanguard never put any unique remix credits on their quad releases, they're just the stereo jackets with the quad catalog number added on the back. So, there's no way of knowing if the stereo guy did the quad remix, and I suspect in a lot (or even most) of the cases it was probably someone else.

The Vanguard label after going throw buku ownerships over the years is now owned by the Concord Music Group which has been known to license out their masters for surround reissues.

Dave, could you perhaps 'whisper' in Michael Dutton's ear and see if he'd have any interest in releasing some of those Vanguard QUADs?

Labels - Recorded Music | Concord [scroll down and you will see Vanguard]

 

[fredblue]

Vanguard never put any unique remix credits on their quad releases, they're just the stereo jackets with the quad catalog number added on the back. So, there's no way of knowing if the stereo guy did the quad remix, and I suspect in a lot (or even most) of the cases it was probably someone else.

'twas Fredison Oldblood did all the Vanguard's! i read it in a mag-a-zeeen! uh oh

 

[steelydave]

The Vanguard label after going throw buku ownerships over the years is now owned by the Concord Music Group which has been known to license out their masters for surround reissues.

Dave, could you perhaps 'whisper' in Michael Dutton's ear and see if he'd have any interest in releasing some of those Vanguard QUADs?

Labels - Recorded Music | Concord [scroll down and you will see Vanguard]

I provided D-V with a spreadsheet some years back with a full accounting of everything that Concord controls, and Mike knows how much I (and I'm sure everyone here) would like to see them tackle some of it - if it is (or becomes) possible, I'm sure he won't hesitate.

 

[Colin London]

It would be great if its able to come out on a Dutton mastered SACD 4.0
Courtesy of Concord Music Media.