HiRez Poll Genesis - A TRICK OF THE TAIL [SACD]

[Dob]

I've got my fair share of crappy CDs, SACDs and DVDAs.

My Greg Kihn DVD-A is a definite "jaw dropper." The description "crappy" hardly does it justice. And talk about high expectations...my old Kihnsolidation CD has wonderful sound.

I'm just grateful that Silverline isn't doing the Genesis catalog...although I acknowledge that their Gary Moore DVD-A is a good one.

 

[elroy]

Got mine today from CD-Wow.

The jewelcase was cracked in several places, so the cover won't stay on. Worse than that is that they sent 2 DVD's in the case and no SACD!!!

 

[SoonerCaniac]

So if you want to listen to one of these albums, you reach for what version?

Here is an excellent resource for best Genesis pressings (CD):
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=105179

I actually just picked up the original Atco pressing of Trick at Amazon for a measly $4 because I sold my 1994 DE with the expection that the new SACDs would have a superior redbook layer. DOH! . . .turns out, most feel the DE was a downgrade from the original pressing anyway. I look forward to the comparison.

Sorry for helping to slightly change the subject . . .back on topic!
Josh

 

[Dob]

Here is an excellent resource for best Genesis pressings (CD):
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=105179

But that's a stereo only, redbook/vinyl only thread (except for your post, which mentions the SACD)...and such threads inevitably contain posts praising the "rare as hen's teeth" pressing.

Nah, enough already. I have a good sounding multichannel SACD, and I'm done with the old stereo mix. Back in my vinyl days, I had the MFSL pressing, but I couldn't say how it compares. I may even still have it lying around somewhere...

...I sold my 1994 DE with the expection that the new SACDs would have a superior redbook layer.

Josh, you have a multichannel setup, so I'm wondering why you're interested in the SACD redbook stereo? It's not even the original mix, right?

 

[peterzach]

Well I will be posting the same info. for each cd as I got the box 76-82(Sacd and NTSC) and as this and W & W were my favorite cd's/lp's from past they are still my favorite after these multi channels came out. I am not bothered by the compression used and am enjoying the extra details coming out in each sacd and after each listen. I think Nick Davis has done a good job on these mix's. I will give Trick a score of 9(10 for music and 8 m/c mix).
I also enjoy the extra disk which has songs I had never heard before.
I would rate extra cd as 8 music and a 8 for m/c mix.

 

[timbre4]

Glad to see some opinions the other direction; I suspect my truth will fall somewhere in the middle. Love the music of the two mentioned (TOTT,W&W)most of this batch as well as a few of the songs that will be on that bonus disc). Looks like I'm waiting for the box in June...

 

[LizardKing]

Just played this for the first time in years....HARSH SOUNDING!!!

The cymbals just sound horrible......

I voted a (generous) 7 - I'd probably vote 6 now...

Great album though.....

 

[rtbluray]

While this mix is not quite as good as the 5 albums contained in the green Gabriel set, it still sounds great IMO.
Any and all problems with the way it sounds probably stems from bad MASTERING, not mixing (It is EMI, after all...)
It still sounds better than any CD version I've ever heard of the album.
Do I think people like Steven Wilson could do a better job? Certainly! But I'm glad we have all these albums released as SACDs (particularly at a time when the SACD was considered completely dead)
And I do hear a difference between the SACD and the DTS96/24. The SACD provides a clearer sense of separation from all 5 speakers.

 

[Neil Palfreyman]

This is one of my favourite Genesis albums and I think Nick did a pretty good job with the mix. I'll be honest and state that I just don't get some of the other comments about compression and too much brightness. My system is pretty transparent and I usually end up with pain in my ears if a title is badly compressed and I don't get that with this mix (based on SACD multi-channel.) Maybe it doesn't quite showcase the material to it's full potential; this album is full of stunningly beautiful songs; Entangled, Mad Man Moon and Ripples and I can't help feeling that they should have sounded better considering how good much of the rest of the catalogue is in 5.1 There's some odd variation in the overall sound such as vocal levels/sound and it's not up there with Nick's best in terms of separation/clarity and use of the surround-field but to my ears there's nothing that sounds bad; just not quite as good as it could/should have been. I'm happy to give it an 8.

 

[keenly]

The Genesis 5.1 titles have fine mixes; it is the mastering that is the problem.

 

[rtbluray]

The Genesis 5.1 titles have fine mixes; it is the mastering that is the problem.

THANK YOU!!!

I hate it when people just throw Nick Davis under the bus cause they think his mixes are horrendous due to perceived brightness and heavy compression on his end when in reality it is probably due to the mastering more than the remixing.
I bet if we had all of his mixes as flat transfers then we would think entirely different about them.

 

[keenly]

THANK YOU!!!

I hate it when people just throw Nick Davis under the bus cause they think his mixes are horrendous due to perceived brightness and heavy compression on his end when in reality it is probably due to the mastering more than the remixing.
I bet if we had all of his mixes as flat transfers then we would think entirely different about them.

Exactly! The major issue with this album is the EQ. It is actually a dynamic album; the compression is not too bad compared to many other 5.1 titles.

Mastering is so overlooked by many on here. If only Steve Hoffman could of mastered some of my fav 5.1 albums; that would of been bliss.

 

[IMachine]

Exactly! The major issue with this album is the EQ. It is actually a dynamic album; the compression is not too bad compared to many other 5.1 titles.

Mastering is so overlooked by many on here. If only Steve Hoffman could of mastered some of my fav 5.1 albums; that would of been bliss.

Not every Hoffman mastering is good.
I don' like the Close To The Edge SACD very much

 

[keenly]

Not every Hoffman mastering is good.
I don' like the Close To The Edge SACD very much

He's better than the guy who did the Genesis titles!

 

[DennisMoore Jr.]

I bought the English box for the SACDs. ATOTT & W&W are my favorite Genesis recordings though I love all the PG era as well. So that is where I am coming from.

I own all the CDs, the original LP and the MFSL LP from back in 1981ish..

This SACD is magnificent. It is by far, the best I have ever heard this recording. I do not have issues with harshness or too much cymbals. As I recall from the first I heard the LP it was a bit bright with lots of cymbals. Phil plays them almost like a second rythym guitar, I've always thought.

When mixing & mastering a recording some compression must always be used. A room or a car does not offer
all the sonic listening space for a full dynamic recording(from a pin drop to a thunder clap) ATOTT SACD is VERY dynamic still and I don't notice the compression when I listen in my main 5.1 listening home space.

Every single mixing sound man will have his/her own gut feeling on how much compression is needed in what the mix should be, so I know every 5.1 mix will be one of a kind so I don't pick apart a mix unless there are major flaws.

For me, ATOTT 5.1 from my SACD box set is a 10. I consider it to be a treasure of the highest order. I listen to this recording in complete bliss. The only bad part is Steve Hackett leaving Genesis after W&W, but that is no fault of this SACD.


BONUS Area:

Well, I gave a 9.
Yes, the original sound is warmer, better, but I am so happy that my absolute favorite band has put out all studio albums in surrround...I really can not give less points.

Uh... yeah.... But you could give it one more point! :slap: :ugham: :brew

 

[jhw59]

I gave it a 7. I agree mix is fine but mastering could be better.

 

[blue.monk]

I bought the SACD box upon its release in 2007. I remember my excitement turning to utter disappointment after the first few bars of "Dance on a Volcano" due to the poor mastering. Well I put this on today after several years hoping my view has softened. Unfortunately it hasn't. The sound is overcooked and unnatural. Particularly brutal is the high end. The harsh wash of cymbals obscures much the subtle details in the arrangements. The main victim is the keyboards where it's often hard to hear the richness of the organ and Mellotron. What a shame since the surround mix is quite good! Thankfully the 70-75 box was spared this heavy-handed treatment. Those discs are warmer and sound more natural.

On the plus side the extras are terrific, particularly the 2007 interviews and the '76 concert. But overall a potential 10 is reduced to a 7 due to the utterly needless iPod surround mastering.

 

[IMachine]

Well, I gave a 9.
Yes, the original sound is warmer, better, but I am so happy that my absolute favorite band has put out all studio albums in surrround...I really can not give less points.
The 5.1 mix is so good....and as I am getting older...it will never sound dull to my ears .

 

[beerking]

I whacked a 9 in the votes for this release.
Some fairly unhappy peeps in previous reviews
Not me
It's a very good album, where Genesis are staying true to their prog music days.
I'm getting lots of discrete action and the fidelity is good to'
No comments since June 2014!!
Well to counter that...
Its great to hear the boys giving their all.

 

[key_wiz]

I don’t see a poll for the DVD version so I guess I can post about that here? NTSC version.

I give a “9”. Music is a “10”. Surround mix is a “10”. Yes, it’s too bright and harsh. Not as bad as the some of the Genesis discs, and in many ways better than this album has ever sounded. Do wish they’d have mastered it differently but to have it the entire Genesis catalog in surround?

That alone is almost worth the extra point to make it a “10”.