I listened to this DualDisc a couple times now to find out if there's anything discrete about the surround mix. For the life of me, I cannot hear anything in the rears that isn't going on in the fronts. I understand this isn't a very exciting mix to begin with, but can you guys let me know if there is any point at all where anything discrete happens?
I even have the vocals in the rears. Right now, it sounds like channels are simply duplicated, and I wonder if perhaps I have a faulty disc or something. Is this really a "double stereo" kind of thing?
I wouldn't mind either way, as the sound is pretty good and the music is nice enough for the couple bucks I paid.
Just ripped this with DVDAE and for fits and giggles I thought I'd check out the 6-ch FLACs in Audacity...
OMG, no wonder it sounds like shit.. the stems look like shit! :yikes
First off, FL/FR & SL/SR are much louder than the Centre and LFE, lots of clipping going on in those 4 channels, they're not total box hedges but they're maximised,
Second, lead vocals are significantly louder in the SL/SR channels.
So I quickly did a couple of things, lowered the overall volume, lowered FL/FR & SL/SR by 2dB and raised the Centre & LFE by 1dB.
Then I swapped over FL/FR & SL/SR.
Ta-da!
So.. I am calling my new revised version "Fronts And Rears" :ugham:
As the ad man says; "Try it, you might like it"..!
Hi Adam
Is your vertical axis set to 24 bit? What is the peek samples in a row setting to flag as being clipped? For the era (in terms of stereo mastering at least) that's not bad at all. Also, if the vocals are in the front three as well as the rear, doesn't that account for at least some of the lower level at the front?
Just wonderin'...
I gave this a spin again tonight. It's still not a favourite surround mix, and the vocals still bother me: there's problems with plosives and unvoiced sounds (like esses) and it just does not sound right. The vocals remain too high for me, and Everybody's Changing is disappointing in its overall feel. There's enough different stuff in the mix to keep it interesting, but I don't like the authoring as the player searches for each track rather than plays through like Love (aside from the layer change on Love). In other news, I'm not the lowest scorer on the poll!
Scrub that! I think you're right. There's far more bass in the rears than the front which doesn't seem right at all. The vocals at the back seemed acceptable as I thought they were going for a centre of the room effect, but it can't be right have the bass more in the rears than the front for a 21st century mix. I'm referring to is the dualdisc DVD-A. Does anybody know if it's the same on the SACD?
Listening to This Is The Last Time, I'm convinced Adam is right. The assigned front channels are bare bones, no bass, minor vocals, whereas the rears have much of the beef of the track including vocals and bass.
its been a while since I last played the SACD but pretty sure its the same as the DVD-A.. when I first started to pull the tracks apart I was astonished to make the same discovery as you, all those little keyboard and effects flourishes in the fronts and all those vocals and low end in the rears, I thought; "this can't be right?!"
at some point I did repurpose the whole thing and adjust some levels.. iirc there was some clipping on various channels on some tracks and to balance out the vocal spread across the front required some lowering of the Centre channel from what I can remember but it was a while ago now and tbh when nobody could be bothered to try out the suggestion to flip the front and back etc I kinda lost heart (happens quite a bit really.. some days its felt like i'm posting in a vacuum.. you may or may not have noticed I'm posting a lot less these days, I haven't run out of things to say about surround its just i don't like talking to myself so much.. 1st sign of madness.. bit late for that maybe but.. anyway, light-hearted semi-moan over and out! let me know how you get on with adjusting the channels and such I'm all ears! )
But Adam, you are spot on! I heard you loud and clear...I love Keane and I love this title. Your changes are wonderful and I play this title often. It's a gem!!! I still have my original disc, so whatever.
everybody's changing but we still feel the same!