heavensolid98
Active Member
@fredblue ’s recommendation. Always works.
Listening to in Dolby Atmos Streaming, via Tidal/Apple/Amazon
- Thread starter beerking
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alansanchez86
800 Club - QQ All-Star
I was a big fan of CRAWLER (previous album), and that's how/when I discovered them. Liking the evolution to this album, as well as the atmos mix, as you mentioned.Shared by @PurpleMoustache earlier. Pretty great mix, at least for rock/punk standards. Lots of action in the rears. They used to be more of a punk rock band (their album Joy As An Act of Resistance was a big deal a lifetime ago back in 2018) but they've become more experimental, more simple, slower, and now sing sometimes. The atmos mix makes good use of noise, feedback, sfx, etc. The first single Dancer is a great example of an atmos mix that's better for the music than the stereo mix. The chorus has two melodies at once and the atmos mix does a nice job of unmuddling it. Interesting album, certainly one of the quality punk surround mixes.
I'm seeing this band in October, can't wait.
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It's available for $35.30 plus $1.05 shipping to US from grooves.land - but apparently no tracking. Still seems pretty pricey. Will need to sample a bit more on AM before pulling the trigger, but I like what Ive heard so far.Ordered from this link as it was cheaper than jpc and had free shipping.
Anyone have thoughts on the Kiss debut Atmos mix? I always thought the first 2 records produced by Kerner/Wise could sound so much better.
Hotter Than Hell suffers the most, mostly due to the fact that it was recorded in 10 days and most of the money was spent on booze and hookers. I’d love to hear a (surround) remix of Hotter Than Hell, a kick-ass album but the mix just has no balls!
Hotter Than Hell suffers the most, mostly due to the fact that it was recorded in 10 days and most of the money was spent on booze and hookers. I’d love to hear a (surround) remix of Hotter Than Hell, a kick-ass album but the mix just has no balls!
I listened to the debut album yesterday, but I didn't really focus on the mix. Honestly, I was surprised how much I enjoyed the music because I'm not a fan of their later work, including Destroyer. I had the Alive album when I was a teen, like everyone else, but I never owned another Kiss album.
As for the debut album, the lyrics are juvenile, as they are on most, if not all, their songs, but the music is pretty tight. They sound like a really good garage band, not the overproduced nothingburgers they would later become.
Those 70s albums kicked major ass, when they used to be a band not a brand. Long before Paul and Gene became what they are today. Definitely not the thread to get into that though. The debut is a super fun listen. Juvenile, yes but just a good party record.
benfolds5
Well-known Member
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I have to say that I’m a bit disappointed with the album.
Don’t get me wrong, the mix is top notch. I just thought that we were gonna get an instrumental blade runner esqe album. But it turns out to be a more element of nature/relaxation album.
It turns out that this album was conceived a few years ago for a spa in Zurich.
When I read this (After listening to the whole album) it all made sense to me.
But I would have preferred to hear the version of the album that was in my head
millertek
Member
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Also noticed the volume levels for ATMOS items especially when you have another surround source to compare...here are some of my observations -
I listened to Pet Sounds, Sgt Pepper, and the new Band On the Run (my surround DVDA's and the newer ATMOS mixes) and noticed a few things and will attempt to explain my conclusions as to why these anomalies exist...
Initially - with all 3 albums, the FIRST thing I noticed was the ATMOS mixes were not as loud compared to my previously released surround mixes. So I started listening to other ATMOS mixes and compared them to previous surround mixes as well, and noticed the same anomaly with the volume level quieter, so you want to turn up your volume control to the louder levels you are used to. Why is this?
I think I may have come to my own conclusion based on my analysis from extracting and isolating the individual tracks from each channel. I noticed at the lower levels of listening to the unique items chosen to be mixed to each specific channel...it appears this technique provides more flexibility in range capabilities when ALL REMAINING channels and their levels have to be considered in the complete mix.
For example - with lower levels OVERALL to ALL CHANNELS, if one chose to isolate a particular instrument or vocal on JUST ONE channel - it is easier to ensure it does not get buried when you hear the items on the remaining channels, including instruments and vocals that are given MORE THEN 1 channel and you hear them using the additional speakers.
Appears easier to make a final mix with more individual sounds when you have that capability to adjust the volume levels more, than being restricted and risk burying something unique with the more powerful sounds on the other channels and speakers.
So when hearing ATMOS mixes, I can turn up my volume more and STILL hear elements that I could not hear at higher volume levels on my earlier surround sources - as they appear to not be buried as sooner as my older surround sources.
I hope that make sense as this is purely MY CONCLUSIONS....
I listened to Pet Sounds, Sgt Pepper, and the new Band On the Run (my surround DVDA's and the newer ATMOS mixes) and noticed a few things and will attempt to explain my conclusions as to why these anomalies exist...
Initially - with all 3 albums, the FIRST thing I noticed was the ATMOS mixes were not as loud compared to my previously released surround mixes. So I started listening to other ATMOS mixes and compared them to previous surround mixes as well, and noticed the same anomaly with the volume level quieter, so you want to turn up your volume control to the louder levels you are used to. Why is this?
I think I may have come to my own conclusion based on my analysis from extracting and isolating the individual tracks from each channel. I noticed at the lower levels of listening to the unique items chosen to be mixed to each specific channel...it appears this technique provides more flexibility in range capabilities when ALL REMAINING channels and their levels have to be considered in the complete mix.
For example - with lower levels OVERALL to ALL CHANNELS, if one chose to isolate a particular instrument or vocal on JUST ONE channel - it is easier to ensure it does not get buried when you hear the items on the remaining channels, including instruments and vocals that are given MORE THEN 1 channel and you hear them using the additional speakers.
Appears easier to make a final mix with more individual sounds when you have that capability to adjust the volume levels more, than being restricted and risk burying something unique with the more powerful sounds on the other channels and speakers.
So when hearing ATMOS mixes, I can turn up my volume more and STILL hear elements that I could not hear at higher volume levels on my earlier surround sources - as they appear to not be buried as sooner as my older surround sources.
I hope that make sense as this is purely MY CONCLUSIONS....
- The integrated Dolby Atmos loudness measurement should be -18 LKFS or less.
- The True peak level should be -1 dBTP or less for the Dolby Atmos loudness measurement.
The culprit is Dialnorm.
https://connectedmag.com.au/dialling-down-dialnorm/
Dialnorm is a Dolby Metadata used to modify the master volume level of the program, during the playback, to make the "dialog" level listenable at good levels. This was conceived for TV, commercials and Films. But, what is the volume level of "dialogs" in a music production?
Still the mastering people or the final export tools use Dialnorm for Dolby Atmos Music, which doesn't make sense.
The master volume of a Musical production should be set by the mixing engineering/artist without any conditioning of any level of "dialogues", and reproduced to that same level by the consumer.
https://forums.steinberg.net/t/important-dolby-atmos-and-the-dialogue-level-aka-dialnorm/861632
Final consumer Dolby Atmos Music should have No Dialnorm (or set to -31dB than means no master volume modification). But there are many Dolby Atmos Music in streaming with Dialnorm set with arbitrary values (or perhaps automatically set by the tool measuring the "dialog level" of the music). Blu-ray editions usually less but still some have Dialnorm set.
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It seems to me, the fidelity of the "Atmos" mix is super. Only problem, it's a very weak Atmos mix in terms of surround-y-ness. It sure does crank though. I was sort of thinking I don't think I've heard this album sound this good.
Glad to hear the fidelity is there. Since the Atmos mix itself isn’t too great, it might sound great downmixed to stereo.
Too bad the mix is poor. I thought the one for Rock and Roll All Nite was very good. Not crazy like Wilson’s Destroyer, but the fidelity upgrade is amazing. Anyone know who did the mix of Rock and Roll All Nite?
Tidal credits Greg Penny.
Completely agree. Fidelity-wise, this is the best I’ve ever heard this album. Bass and drums are tight and punchy, and the guitars have a nice crunch without being too bright. A nice 70s analog kind of sound - very crankable, as @GOS noted. I did notice some unintended distortion at the leading edge of some some of the guitar riffs, those must exist on the master tapes but I would have removed them if it were me.
As for the Atmos mix, very little surround action to speak of. Some background vocals mostly, virtually none of the actual instruments are isolated in any of the surround or height channels. Still, this beats any previous version of this album I’ve heard.
Just learned that this is a Nigel Godrich produced album. The first sign of Nigel changing his stance on surround?Shared by @PurpleMoustache earlier. Pretty great mix, at least for rock/punk standards. Lots of action in the rears. They used to be more of a punk rock band (their album Joy As An Act of Resistance was a big deal a lifetime ago back in 2018) but they've become more experimental, more simple, slower, and now sing sometimes
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It is amazing how so many professionals have not gotten this important memo, combined with zero QA steps such as simply having beta testers actually listen to the final product on the delivery service itself. The ears are out there, they just aren't being engaged.
Finally, when listeners do report these gross volume changes, there is no acknowledgment and presumably they aren't getting passed to the labels and/or any mix engineers.
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