More channels = more problems

[quicksrt]

I have my older Onkyo 5.1 AVR that has surround settings that are very confusing. Sometimes it was like some channels were missing on the music as it was playing in surround - as if an upmix type of thing was happening. I had to walk over to each speaker and listen carefully to try and figure out what the hell was going on with it.

I still have it in the bedroom for stereo only at the moment.

But for me it is always a question - or I mean two questions: 1) what are you inputing, and 2) what are you expecting to be output?

My Denon never deviates from its standard 5.1. But dies not seem very straight forward for “All Stereo” and not processing anything to deliver that (as I prefer). I like sending stereo to two sets of speakers with nothing being done to the signal when that is done.

 

[Rickko]

In reading some of the comments about some of the frustrations of modern technology, I, am reminded of what personally grounds me to everyday life. It inevitably leads to the experience of simple (and often unanticipated) pleasures and enjoying those moments. It certainly applies to music.

Above all, I have been driven to attain the best available audio quality in 5.1, 4.0 and Stereo 2.0. Over the years, I have upgraded equipment to enhance my listening pleasure with generally positive results. However, over time technology in music has evolved. I have spent countless hours (with the subsequent frustrations) to get the desired results. But some time ago I reached the point to simply enjoy what I have. I do not have any regrets.

For those who wish to experience Atmos, I think it is an admirable goal. For me, I will continue to enjoy the music of my preference in a world where less is more. It is a world less complicated that brings me peace of mind.

 

[ar surround]

In reading some of the comments about some of the frustrations of modern technology, I, am reminded of what personally grounds me to everyday life. It inevitably leads to the experience of simple (and often unanticipated) pleasures and enjoying those moments. It certainly applies to music.

Above all, I have been driven to attain the best available audio quality in 5.1, 4.0 and Stereo 2.0. Over the years, I have upgraded equipment to enhance my listening pleasure with generally positive results. However, over time technology in music has evolved. I have spent countless hours (with the subsequent frustrations) to get the desired results. But some time ago I reached the point to simply enjoy what I have. I do not have any regrets.

For those who wish to experience Atmos, I think it is an admirable goal. For me, I will continue to enjoy the music of my preference in a world where less is more. It is a world less complicated that brings me peace of mind.

People reach a certain level where they feel comfortable and don't want to further complicate their lives. I know a few people who won't go beyond stereo, not because they have something against surround sound, but because they don't want any additional complications...such as a spouse throwing them out of the house...

 

[jimfisheye]

Yeah man, that's why I'm waiting for them to actually, you know, release the Atmos decoder codec! First, we need the ability to have all the discrete audio channels coming out of our audio interface outputs. Then we solo groups of channels on the existing 5.1 system to see if anything entices us to hear it fully realized with the extra channels. THEN we hang those extra speakers from the ceiling!

We haven't got to step one yet. They've only released the playback codec to certain AVR and theater install audio interface makers so far to push selling new hardware. There will be no speaker hanging for this currently DOA format!

How to create another dead format?
Don't let anyone play it unless they purchase one of the most expensive pieces of their system over again!

This is obnoxiously frustrating! You don't often see creative pushes in audio like this. There are even a handful of what look to be serious mixes being made by the likes of Steve Wilson and company. This one is admittedly a stretch to begin with for probably 99.999% of the listening public. Can't even get most people into 5.1! And all being just pissed away by greedy marketing practices.

 

[winopener]

On the up side - working on wiring the house and such inspired me to pick up one of those Vibra 5 tape 8 track changers

????

 

[Cyber 1]

The future is here, and it's shit!

(I refuse to update the firmware - they will take my iso playback from my cold dead hands)

I hear ya man, no ISO on my 205 is a real piss off too.

BTW my local tech savvy guy told me I should buy spare optical lazer for it for "down the road" replacement.
Oppo laughed at that saying we don't sell parts.

 

[Wagonmaster_91]

Jonathan, glad you didn't panic and do the firmware update. You would really be pissed now that you know the problem it isn't the fault of the Oppo.

 

[marpow]

Thank you @ArmyOfQuad for a good thread and letting out your frustration. Your frustration was certainly valid. I liked what Jon Urban said, hang in there, we have all been there.
Going to Best Buy and getting a new player should be helpful to you.
Setting up Atmos is no easy venture, and then you get there and you want it to be better than it is. It comes in the same form as pretty much all audio releases, from not so good to this sounds absolutely fantastic. Movies seem to be better, War and Sci Fi movies are good with Atmos sound.
I have been in construction my whole life, so the challenge for me was never the work, but getting the sonics of the room after built dialed in, I think I have done a good job.
Like @Rickko says, sometimes the best thing is to just enjoy and listen to what you have. As good as my construction skills are my audio knowledge is not equal to some on QQ, but I get by.
Fortunately I have never had the performance problems with playback, etc, I have had great people on QQ help me and I would love to pay it forward any chance I get.
Just to let you know I still have two problems that I can let go of sometimes and other times I can't.

 

[ArmyOfQuad]

????

 

[beerking]

View attachment 64578

Ah, there lies the answer to all our problems!!
Use a microwave....

 

[ar surround]

View attachment 64578

Ah, there lies the answer to all our problems!!
Use a microwave....

I have to admit that, at first glance, I thought you put the carts in a microwave.

 

[beerking]

I have to admit that, at first glance, I thought you put the carts in a microwave.

At first glance, all I saw was Bay City Rollers!!

Only joshing ArmyofQuad...we've all been there and we feel your pain. I spent a mini fortune on my Marantz SR8012 reciever, to make it all work.
Even then had to figure out how to set it all up and get everything talking to one another.

Got there eventually and now I loudly bang the Atmos drum .

 

[timbre4]

Sigh. Toe in the water with a 5.1.2 setup and plans to make the main system ATMOS in a year. I love Oppo BDP-93 players and have observed: $200 used on eBay comes around, OPPO will still refurb players and the one I got back was in a new case to boot! I play FLACs through it but not ISOs so not sure which firmware it came back with.

As for the Marantz AVR only playing FLACs as stereo - could this be more about quad 4.0 files needing phantom C & LFE to be recognized properly? #chipset blues

EDIT: Houses of the Holy 8 track is RCOA! Record Club of America for you youngsters.....

 

[ArmyOfQuad]

Sigh. Toe in the water with a 5.1.2 setup and plans to make the main system ATMOS in a year. I love Oppo BDP-93 players and have observed: $200 used on eBay comes around, OPPO will still refurb players and the one I got back was in a new case to boot! I play FLACs through it but not ISOs so not sure which firmware it came back with.

As for the Marantz AVR only playing FLACs as stereo - could this be more about quad 4.0 files needing phantom C & LFE to be recognized properly? #chipset blues

EDIT: Houses of the Holy 8 track is RCOA! Record Club of America for you youngsters.....

Nope, I tried 4.0 and 5.1 flac, and I confirmed in the documentation that network and usb playback only supports stereo. I questioned marantz support about it, and they came back with a lengthy explanation of receivers originally not being intended for TV use, but bad TV speakers resulting in it, and receivers not being built from the ground up for budgetary reasons......

...yeah, sure. Maybe in the 70s the idea of a receiver having anything to do with video was foreign - but DVD was launched in the mid 90s with standardized 5.1 options, and we're 25 years later from that. By the time they're adding network and usb playback, I think the concept of multi-channel is quite well established. Whatever....bottom line is network and usb playback is useless to me, ah well.

 

[ArmyOfQuad]

At first glance, all I saw was Bay City Rollers!!

I've got my Aunt to thank for that - she gave me all her Bay City Rollers LPs when I had my first record player. Picked up that 8-track in college to replace the trashed and broken LP. Always liked that album.

 

[Doug G.]

All these posts are conclusive proof that quad is THE optimum.



Doug

 

[ArmyOfQuad]

Whew....finally got there. Got the PS4 working to pass along atmos, got the fire cube passing it from tidal. Both - quite the struggle.

Actually spent an hour on chat with amazon support last night. They basically searched all their articles for the word atmos and kept copying and pasting things at me.

Then they said the only thing that supports it is their Jack Ryan show through prime - although I couldn't even get that to work.

Then I found on tidal's page they specifically list the fire cube supporting it - played around more. Found posts here about uninstalling/reinstalling, and such - so it seems getting atmos working on fire devices is problematic in general.

I ended up having to select atmos from the surround settings on the receiver multiple times with some disconnecting/reconnecting of the hdmi cable, and eventually it worked.

Although from what I'm reading, it will work until it doesn't.

Ah well - at least I got some tunes now.

 

[Sal1950]

The number of hoops one has to jump through just to get this stuff to work though.....ugh......future is not looking good for Atmos. Probably will be a smaller spot on my shelf for those discs than any other format.

In the end you'll be happy you worked any kinks out and have the system done.
I find those who are making the negative remarks about doing an Atmos upgrade very reminiscent of the stereo guys who say the same type of things about being involved in quad or 5.1. The future of immersive audio is Atmos and I'm very thankful of it. Once again there is vitality in the music industry for releasing something other than stereo and hopefully it will gain the traction that 4-5.1 never did. I find having my 5.2.4 rig in place to offer more sources every day.

 

[Old Quad Guy]

Glad you were able to make progress. Hope things continue to work out.

Just to be clear, I’m not against Oppo or Atmos. I’m just wondering, like everyone else, what is the best way to get from here to there MC wise, with the least amount of fuss and expense.

The question I’ve been wondering about for years is, and I know that Oppo’s have wonderful DAC’s, but couldn’t a server or computer (which can be replaced if fried) not work as well for .ISO and Flac playback? Shouldn’t the DAC’s in one’s Amp’s receiver do the work just as well as a Oppo? Since things are digital, this has been on my mind. Thanks.

 

[ArmyOfQuad]

Computers can do a lot of playback, but like all things in our modern era of technology, it isn't perfect. My biggest gripe of computers these days is it feels like every windows update comes with yet another change to the functionality and menus for sound settings, and they're never good! But a computer with an hdmi output is a rather simple way to get digital multichannel to a receiver.....but then you have the whole issue of whether or not your receiver will like the signal the computer is sending out. My rather old at this point hdmi video card seems to play nice with my Denon receivers, but a recently picked up mini PC with built in HDMI output won't handshake with my denon receivers if a TV is on. Turn off the TV, and it sees the signal - which is fine if you're blind and install jaws on the computer I suppose. Denon's official answer is they don't support computers connecting to their receivers, had a lengthy polite conversation with their support. They tell end users to connect the computer directly to the TV to use the TV as a DA converter basically.....perfectly fine for the stereo minded. And then when you get past that battle, I never did find a working dvd-a option for PC. There were 2 popular DVD playback softwares back in the day that supposedly worked. I spent hours with both of them, never got either of them working, never saw them working, so while some people claimed they work, I never saw a shred of evidence that they do. The best option I've found for dvd-a playback on PC is foobar - but that just makes the audio content available, it doesn't actually navigate and test the disc. So, when I want to test a conversion, my only options are to burn a disc, or throw it on a usb and connect that to the Oppo.

Technology is great.....if you can figure it out. And it seems to only get more complicated.