Surround Master v2 LED's are dead?

[ar surround]

I turned on the SM v2 yesterday and noticed that all but one of the LED's were not working. I unplugged the unit from the Monster surge suppressor for a few minutes, plugged it back in, but the LED's are still dead. @chucky3042 or @Overture any ideas as to what has happened and how to fix it from here? The unit still appears to be otherwise working properly with full output from all four channels and no distortion.

It seems that my poor little blue-eyed monster has gone almost blind!

 

[Sonik Wiz]

As Eldon Tyrell said to Roy Batty: "The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long." And those are some pretty darn bright lights.

Seriously, sorry you're having a problem. Is the level indicator still working? Might I ask how many hours a day the unit is left on? Some people never turn their gear off, and I turn it on only when I'm using it. So far so good.

 

[ar surround]

As Eldon Tyrell said to Roy Batty: "The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long." And those are some pretty darn bright lights.

Seriously, sorry you're having a problem. Is the level indicator still working? Might I ask how many hours a day the unit is left on? Some people never turn their gear off, and I turn it on only when I'm using it. So far so good.

I only turn on the SMv2 when I'm using the system...and sometimes not at all if I am listening to surround albums. Something must have happened during the power-up sequence.

 

[J. PUPSTER]

As Eldon Tyrell said to Roy Batty: "The light that burns twice as bright burns half as long." And those are some pretty darn bright lights.

Seriously, sorry you're having a problem. Is the level indicator still working? Might I ask how many hours a day the unit is left on? Some people never turn their gear off, and I turn it on only when I'm using it. So far so good.

Doesn’t the Level indicator come on when it’s starting to clip?

I only turn on the SMv2 when I'm using the system...and sometimes not at all if I am listening to surround albums. Something must have happened during the power-up sequence.

I know you guys are much more savvy on this electronic stuff than I, but since it looks like three went out all at once suggest something other than the actual LEDs?

 

[DuncanS]

I would suspect its a buffer driving the LEDs that's gone phutt, as your unit is functioning still. Reliability follows a 'bathtub curve' so early failures do occur then its years before more fails. If I switch on kit I leave it on all day, lots of on/offs cause more failures. 'Professional' kit tends to be switched on and never turned off to improve reliability, unfortunately we usually can't do that in the 'home' environment

 

[4-earredwonder]

I would suspect its a buffer driving the LEDs that's gone phutt, as your unit is functioning still. Reliability follows a 'bathtub curve' so early failures do occur then its years before more fails. If I switch on kit I leave it on all day, lots of on/offs cause more failures. 'Professional' kit tends to be switched on and never turned off to improve reliability, unfortunately we usually can't do that in the 'home' environment

I was once told by my [criminally insane and prolific rip off artist*] high end audio dealer that digital components should either be left on all the time and/or in stand by mode for BEST results. And turning anything on and off does shorten the lifespan of certain components [even lightbulbs].

My Martin Logan electrostatic speakers in my secondary system all have subtle blue LED lights when engaged and the left right rear's bulb went kapooey years ago but it doesn't at all affect playback.....so unless you like those [IMO] glaring LED SM v.2 lights, as long as it doesn't affect playback ..... not to worry unless Chucky indicates otherwise.

*but he did know his shit and got me hooked on Meridian components for which I AM eternally grateful!

 

[J. PUPSTER]

I was once told by my [criminally insane and prolific rip off artist] high end audio dealer that digital components should either be left on all the time and/or in stand by mode for BEST results. And turning anything on and off does shorten the lifespan of certain components [even lightbulbs].

My Martin Logan electrostatic speakers in my secondary system all have subtle blue LED lights when engaged and the left right rear's bulb went kapooey years ago but it doesn't at all affect playback.....so unless you like those [IMO] glaring LED SM v.2 lights, as long as it doesn't affect playback ..... not to worry unless Chucky indicates otherwise.

Didn't know you had Martin Logan electrostatics Ralph, how do you like those; and when are you getting a SMv2?

 

[4-earredwonder]

Duplicate Post .... sorry!

 

[4-earredwonder]

Didn't know you had Martin Logan electrostatics Ralph, how do you like those; and when are you getting a SMv2?

I've had Martin Logans for years and the ones I'm currently using in my secondary system are lower end models [shorter in height duplicates of their originals] and they are pretty accurate. But those electrostatic panels do not like sunlight [vampire speakers] and I did have a lot of failures over the years.

And Pupster, as much as I am tempted to buy a SM v.2, I'd be one of those CRAZY audiophiles who'd add thousand dollar RCA interconnects to that component before plugging it into my Meridian pre/pro. And if you dont think those upgraded RCA cables make a difference ..... think again. I've done experimentation with cables and the differences ARE profound.

Would probably even make a difference in your new [and congratulations] turntable.

I also swear by replacing ANY detachable power supply cables in every component I own with Shunyata Research power cables ..... most especially the OPPOs ..... they L ❤ VE them!

 

[chucky3042]

I turned on the SM v2 yesterday and noticed that all but one of the LED's were not working. I unplugged the unit from the Monster surge suppressor for a few minutes, plugged it back in, but the LED's are still dead. @chucky3042 or @Overture any ideas as to what has happened and how to fix it from here? The unit still appears to be otherwise working properly with full output from all four channels and no distortion.

It seems that my poor little blue-eyed monster has gone almost blind!



View attachment 43995

Hi AR Surround

Well that really does suck balls. Really sorry. Gut feel is that its a faulty driver TCA9535 (U2) on the front PCB. I really hit the panic buttons when I saw your post and checked all the documentation. The Blue LED's are in series with a 2K resistor driven from 5V, my rough maths says that that's about 1.25 mA drive current. The BOM, Schematic , PCB and the pick and place layouts all say 2K ohms for the resistor. Still in the back of my mind thats a really bright blue LED - either its very efficient or some knucklehead had maybe substituted a 2R instead. Silly things like that can happen.

Not is a good position tonight without dismantling my SMV2 to find out for sure. Give me another 12 hrs to find out for sure. Either way we will fix the situation. Are you good with a screw driver as one cheap possibility is that we send you a replacement front board......dunno???

Not happy

Chucky

 

[ar surround]

Are you good with a screw driver as one cheap possibility is that we send you a replacement front board......dunno???

Thanks for getting back to me. Such are the adventures of being a pioneer/early adopter.

I have replaced mother boards in garage door openers, the main board in my tankless hot water heater, among other things. I should be ok with doing the work myself as long as there are instructions on how to get into the unit without destroying it.

 

[Sonik Wiz]

Thanks for getting back to me. Such are the adventures of being a pioneer/early adopter.

I have replaced mother boards in garage door openers, the main board in my tankless hot water heater, among other things. I should be ok with doing the work myself as long as there are instructions on how to get into the unit without destroying it.

FWIW, I have taken the top off the SMv2 & peeked inside. I think how to switch out would be pretty obvious, and simple, when you try.

 

[chucky3042]

Thanks for getting back to me. Such are the adventures of being a pioneer/early adopter.

I have replaced mother boards in garage door openers, the main board in my tankless hot water heater, among other things. I should be ok with doing the work myself as long as there are instructions on how to get into the unit without destroying it.

Hi AR Surround

Good news (for us) is that I checked the physical front PCB's and the correct 2K Ohm resistors have been installed on the board (I feel better now). This means each LED is being driven by a puny 1.25 mA which is well under the LED and driver IC maximum ratings. Tells me that we need to use a cheaper and lower efficiency LED on the next batch! Also tells me the rest of yous guys will be OK.

The bad news for you sucker is that we sold you a dud! So in the next day or two I will arrange for a replacement front board to be sent complete with IKEA style instructions for a pretty simple replacement procedure. After you do the fix please return mail the dud board so we can look at what went wrong, we will pay postage costs.

BEFORE WE DO THAT......It could be a cable connector issue possibly - could you grab an Allen (hex key) key and open the front panel and unplug and replug the two ribbon IDC cable connectors at both ends as it may be something has come lose???? See the front panel removal guide but don't bother taking the knobs off
https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...r-discussion-thread.26116/page-13#post-432916
Then turn it on again to see if it fixes the problem

Could you please PM me the delivery details.

Regards

Chucky

 

[ar surround]

Hi AR Surround

Good news (for us) is that I checked the physical front PCB's and the correct 2K Ohm resistors have been installed on the board (I feel better now). This means each LED is being driven by a puny 1.25 mA which is well under the LED and driver IC maximum ratings. Tells me that we need to use a cheaper and lower efficiency LED on the next batch! Also tells me the rest of yous guys will be OK.

The bad news for you sucker is that we sold you a dud! So in the next day or two I will arrange for a replacement front board to be sent complete with IKEA style instructions for a pretty simple replacement procedure. After you do the fix please return mail the dud board so we can look at what went wrong, we will pay postage costs.

BEFORE WE DO THAT......It could be a cable connector issue possibly - could you grab an Allen (hex key) key and open the front panel and unplug and replug the two ribbon IDC cable connectors at both ends as it may be something has come lose???? See the front panel removal guide but don't bother taking the knobs off
https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...r-discussion-thread.26116/page-13#post-432916
Then turn it on again to see if it fixes the problem

Could you please PM me the delivery details.

Regards

Chucky

I removed the front panel and unplugged / replugged the two ribbon connectors. That did not fix it. Sending you PM with contact info.

 

[chucky3042]

I removed the front panel and unplugged / replugged the two ribbon connectors. That did not fix it. Sending you PM with contact info.

Your new front PCB (with front panel) was sent today!

 

[ar surround]

Your new front PCB (with front panel) was sent today!

Charles,

I am perplexed as to why the LEDs failed. I’ve been using the unit since June, so infant mortality is probably not an issue. The power supply (wall wart) is plugged into a Monster HTS2600, a $300 surge suppressor, not a $10 power strip. So surge should not be an issue. I am wondering about that wall wart given that it is plugged into an unswitched outlet on the Monster and, therefore, always “on“. But then again, the TV, disc players, etc. are always in standby mode and I’ve never had an issue with them. Just pondering.

 

[chucky3042]

Charles,

I am perplexed as to why the LEDs failed. I’ve been using the unit since June, so infant mortality is probably not an issue. The power supply (wall wart) is plugged into a Monster HTS2600, a $300 surge suppressor, not a $10 power strip. So surge should not be an issue. I am wondering about that wall wart given that it is plugged into an unswitched outlet on the Monster and, therefore, always “on“. But then again, the TV, disc players, etc. are always in standby mode and I’ve never had an issue with them. Just pondering.

Yeah, I was perplexed to. Thats why I first suspected overdriving the LEDS, turns out they are really being driven at low current. The LED's will be fine, its more likely to be the driver chip as it is the common point to those LEDS. It may be something silly like a crappy track on the PCB, poor soldering on the driver chip etc

 

[chucky3042]

Hi All

Just a side observation. As you all know the blue eyed monster is TOO BRIGHT!! We got caught a bit by this as the light pipes we used with the LED's arrived after we received the boards (I admit it we were rushing). When it all came together the light pipes funneled the wide dispersion light of the point source LED's into a frontal direction and POW it really was bright. We are using similar pipes in our solar batteries now and the same effect, it turns a low intensity dispersed light into a directional beacon.

 

[Soundfield]

Hi All

Just a side observation. As you all know the blue eyed monster is TOO BRIGHT!! We got caught a bit by this as the light pipes we used with the LED's arrived after we received the boards (I admit it we were rushing). When it all came together the light pipes funneled the wide dispersion light of the point source LED's into a frontal direction and POW it really was bright. We are using similar pipes in our solar batteries now and the same effect, it turns a low intensity dispersed light into a directional beacon.

Hi Chucky - I haven't got the time to take the front panel off at the moment to check this idea- but would it be possible to paint over the light pipes to make them darker - or would it be easier to replace the LED series resistors with higher values (assuming the warranty police don't find out of course!)?

 

[chucky3042]

Hi Soundfield

We published instructions on removing the front panel and knobs to gain access to the front PCB HERE:
https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...r-discussion-thread.26116/page-13#post-432916

Its a pain in the arse but it would be easier to paint over the LED's with err um probably a black???? or its surface mount resistor time with a microscope

They are all on the front panel, recon you would need to use in excess of 10K as the eye is very logarithmic