4x RCA to HDMI for Quadraphonic Record Player / Quad Demodulator to Use On HDMI Only System

[quadsearcher]

What’s this gizmo? 4 channel XLR to SDI? Do SDI to HDMI converters then preserve MCH audio? https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1128870-REG/aja_3g_ama_3g_sdi_4_channel_analog_audio.html

That's where I was going with it earlier. I *think* it should work, because they are both serial streams, so once embedded should stay embedded. I don't know how channel mapping would turn out. But it is not low cost.
However I also *think* (almost certain) it would require an SDI video source even if just a black sync generator. Additional cost there.
Black Magic makes a low cost $75 sdi/hdmi converter that works well with 2 channel, haven't tested MC. I wouldn't cheap out on the converter with other brands, some are sold for security cams.

 

[ClassicalSurroundFan]

I don't know how channel mapping would turn out.

Channel mapping should be easily adjusted based on how you input on the analog side, no? These are on eBay for like $300. Cheap compared to an atmos avr with MCH rca in…

 

[quadsearcher]

Plus a video source and a converter, and cables.
A caveat I hadn't thought of: Pro gear does not accept content that has HDCP, that part makes sense, it is a form of copy protection. But, I don't know how it works the other way; will consumer gear accept non-HDCP content?

 

[quadsearcher]

Channel mapping should be easily adjusted based on how you input on the analog side, no? These are on eBay for like $300. Cheap compared to an atmos avr with MCH rca in…

Yes, but it matters how the sdi/hdmi converter handles it. Will it assign each channel separately, or will it combine them into stereo? I'm guessing it would maintain MC, but I do not know.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

Channel mapping should be easily adjusted based on how you input on the analog side, no? These are on eBay for like $300. Cheap compared to an atmos avr with MCH rca in…

Where?

 

[ClassicalSurroundFan]

Where?

Here’s one. Don’t know if they have the xlr breakout cable AJA HD10AMA Dual Rate 4-Channel Analog to SDI Embedder/Disembedder | eBay

 

[MidiMagic]

One possibility is that a 2ch analog input might be decoded in Dolby Surround in a device.

 

[armyjazzer]

It seems to me the answer is that the companies building multi-channel audio products today need to add an HDMI interface, since most multi-channel audio these days is played back using multi-channel recievers, and the standard is using an HDMI interface, like it or not.

I really think the customers would be willing to pay the additional cost of the HDMI interface rather than dropping an extra $2K on a new reciever that has analog inputs and I personally do not want to buy another old used reciever on ebay, etc. I have had 2 die now, plus they don't have new features like Atmos.

If Involve doesn't think enough Surrond Master customers want HDMI bad enough to pay the added cost they should try using a "Crowd Funding" site to see if they can raise enough money to pay the HDMI fee, etc.

 

[DudeRocks]

I bought an rca to hdmi cable to see if I could play the Akai CR-80D-SS through my Onkyo receiver and no sound came out. Didn’t work. Does that help?

Found someone discussing audio output on an older Samsung receiver. Apparently they had to set the receiver to TV input (and use that HDMI input on the receiver) in order to accept audio through HDMI. It requires both ends to be HDCP compliant. I'm going to try that on the Onkyo today. EDIT went through each HDMI input from the Pyle PREA86BTH and can't even get FM radio through the HDMI on that thing.

 

[gene_stl]

and you probably will have to have a teewee connected too.

 

[DudeRocks]

I think you would be better off buying the premade switch box. The article you linked to had a coda that said they managed to break the switch that they used. Of course you could find a bigger , higher current rated switch. Check WW Grainger and Graybar electric. Unfortunately Gateway Electronics is gone from St. Louis after 60 years in business. A victim of the pandemic and people not wanting to learn how to solder.

I'll post photos as I put this thing together. Most of the parts should be here Tuesday and Wednesday so I should get started on it and probably have it finished up by sometime next weekend. I'm going to add an RCA switch to it as well for the subwoofer. Ideally I would say it would be better to have a subwoofer for the rear channel as well as the front channel, for the beta I'm going to run front and rear into mono to the subs left and right input.

 

[ClassicalSurroundFan]

Yes, but it matters how the sdi/hdmi converter handles it. Will it assign each channel separately, or will it combine them into stereo? I'm guessing it would maintain MC, but I do not know.

Had some time to look it up and at least everything affordable SDI > HDMI downmixes MCH audio to stereo.

 

[chucky3042]

It seems to me the answer is that the companies building multi-channel audio products today need to add an HDMI interface, since most multi-channel audio these days is played back using multi-channel recievers, and the standard is using an HDMI interface, like it or not.

I really think the customers would be willing to pay the additional cost of the HDMI interface rather than dropping an extra $2K on a new reciever that has analog inputs and I personally do not want to buy another old used reciever on ebay, etc. I have had 2 die now, plus they don't have new features like Atmos.

If Involve doesn't think enough Surrond Master customers want HDMI bad enough to pay the added cost they should try using a "Crowd Funding" site to see if they can raise enough money to pay the HDMI fee, etc.

Hi Armyjazzer

We tried crowd funding back in the Y4 finalisation phase and we spent around $10K on the media campaign and got around USD$27k returned form it with the big negative of poisoning our distribution price structure. It was a lot of effort for a small return. One issue is our product was expensive for the "gifts" structure.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...audio-indiegogo-crowd-funding-campaign.19520/
Right now we are working with an Asian HDMI licensed crowd with a view of a separate product and adding it to a future SM4 but frankly the recent Asian component shortages, getting bad debited a lot and being several hundred thousand dollars behind in outstanding invoices from R+D customer is just screwing us at the moment.

The thing about the friggin HDMI license is that the $20K happens EVERY YEAR. And as mentioned before around 30% of Y4 product (first batch) had unfix-able HDMI board issues that effectively meant the whole unit had to be rejected.

But yeah working on it.

 

[DudeRocks]

Hi Armyjazzer

We tried crowd funding back in the Y4 finalisation phase and we spent around $10K on the media campaign and got around USD$27k returned form it with the big negative of poisoning our distribution price structure. It was a lot of effort for a small return. One issue is our product was expensive for the "gifts" structure.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...audio-indiegogo-crowd-funding-campaign.19520/
Right now we are working with an Asian HDMI licensed crowd with a view of a separate product and adding it to a future SM4 but frankly the recent Asian component shortages, getting bad debited a lot and being several hundred thousand dollars behind in outstanding invoices from R+D customer is just screwing us at the moment.

The thing about the friggin HDMI license is that the $20K happens EVERY YEAR. And as mentioned before around 30% of Y4 product (first batch) had unfix-able HDMI board issues that effectively meant the whole unit had to be rejected.

But yeah working on it.

If anyone has the ultimate set of tools and can fix it... It's you guys!

 

[mandrix]

Hi Armyjazzer

We tried crowd funding back in the Y4 finalisation phase and we spent around $10K on the media campaign and got around USD$27k returned form it with the big negative of poisoning our distribution price structure. It was a lot of effort for a small return. One issue is our product was expensive for the "gifts" structure.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...audio-indiegogo-crowd-funding-campaign.19520/
Right now we are working with an Asian HDMI licensed crowd with a view of a separate product and adding it to a future SM4 but frankly the recent Asian component shortages, getting bad debited a lot and being several hundred thousand dollars behind in outstanding invoices from R+D customer is just screwing us at the moment.

The thing about the friggin HDMI license is that the $20K happens EVERY YEAR. And as mentioned before around 30% of Y4 product (first batch) had unfix-able HDMI board issues that effectively meant the whole unit had to be rejected.

But yeah working on it.

Analog to HDMI as an add-on or separate unit sounds like a smart idea if you guys can pull it off by buying from / partnering with someone else to get the units. Save you guys the headache and fees maybe. Plus it's such a niche product. But I'm sort of surprised something like this hasn't popped up on the Amazon. There are, or used to be, many HDMI to analog extractors. Wouldn't those require the same licensing fees? I know I bought one made/sold by Monoprice when I was using HDMI > Analog on a second AVR for 7.1.4 Atmos before I bought my new AVR.

 

[armyjazzer]

Hi Armyjazzer

We tried crowd funding back in the Y4 finalisation phase and we spent around $10K on the media campaign and got around USD$27k returned form it with the big negative of poisoning our distribution price structure. It was a lot of effort for a small return. One issue is our product was expensive for the "gifts" structure.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...audio-indiegogo-crowd-funding-campaign.19520/
Right now we are working with an Asian HDMI licensed crowd with a view of a separate product and adding it to a future SM4 but frankly the recent Asian component shortages, getting bad debited a lot and being several hundred thousand dollars behind in outstanding invoices from R+D customer is just screwing us at the moment.

The thing about the friggin HDMI license is that the $20K happens EVERY YEAR. And as mentioned before around 30% of Y4 product (first batch) had unfix-able HDMI board issues that effectively meant the whole unit had to be rejected.

But yeah working on it.

Thanks for the information and enlightenment. As usual I am ignorant of many of the struggles facing companies manufacturing the equipment!

Who knows, if the up-mixing or software surround encoding products do a good job, it may remove the desire for HDMI on the Surround Master for a lot of surround audio folks, since they would be able to create the surround files from stereo files using the software, then playback through other devices (PC, MAC, media players, Blu ray players, etc.) with HDMI interface into their HDMI equipment. In this case the Surround Master software encoder might be the best option. Especially if you can make it a stand alone product that is simpler to use than the current audio VST plugins, like Penteo, that require using a DAW that many users are unfamiliar with and requires extra cost and learning curve. A really simple program that you feed the stereo file(s) to and it outputs the surround files would be great!

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

Right now we are working with an Asian HDMI licensed crowd with a view of a separate product and adding it to a future SM4 but frankly the recent Asian component shortages, getting bad debited a lot and being several hundred thousand dollars behind in outstanding invoices from R+D customer is just screwing us at the moment.

Would offering a 'DisplayPort' output connection work-out any cheaper? The end-user could then buy there own DisplayPort to HDMI adaptor...

 

[chucky3042]

Would offering a 'DisplayPort' output connection work-out any cheaper? The end-user could then buy there own DisplayPort to HDMI adaptor...

We looked at that but the issue is that its just not simple enough for the average Joe or Jill.

 

[SeeMoreDigital]

We looked at that but the issue is that its just not simple enough for the average Joe or Jill.

Hmmm... Perhaps you could include/bundle an 'DisplayPort to HDMI' adaptor lead

 

[chucky3042]

Hmmm... Perhaps you could include/bundle an 'DisplayPort to HDMI' adaptor lead

Yes that has been a discussion point at our end