A Talk with Michael Dutton - Of the Dutton Vocalion and Epoch Record Labels

[ar surround]

Thanks for the great interview Mike! Glad someone was able to coax Mr. Dutton out of his mixing/mastering den for a chat!

A half hour is just a small taste; ready for a follow up please.

and thank you Mr. Dutton for the discount. I ended up saving about $13 US on these titles -

Sub Total: £78.95
Discounts: £10.40
Shipping: £13.00
Grand Total: £81.55

View attachment 92294

Thanks for the recommendations, Pups!

 

[ar surround]

Excellent interview Mike and Mike! @edisonbaggins you continue to emigrate into the big leagues. Looking forward to more of these types of interviews.

 

[steelydave]

Great job @edisonbaggins , both on the interview and also in persuading Mike to do it - an equally difficult task I assure you, given his desire to kind of be "the man behind the curtain" as we kind of heard from him in the video.

I'm really glad that everyone here has had the opportunity to see a bit of what I've experienced over the last 7 or 8 years working with Mike - the breadth of his knowledge and passion for what he does is there for all to see.

Regarding the American Woman channel assignments that he referred to specifically, the two master tapes had the same configuration noted on their boxes (1 = left front / 2 = left rear / 3 = right front / 4 = right rear) by the original engineer (or assistant) but one of them was obviously different from the other, hence why both the original Q8 and the SACD have the same issue. As Mike said, he has a Q8 deck to check against, but quad channel assignments are also a massive bugbear for me (I think wrong assignments can really ruin a mix) so in cases where I know the Q8 is wrong I've preemptively let him know, and in some cases where the master tape is missing assignments he's asked me (Garfunkel's Breakaway and Herbie Hancock's Sextant for example) to provide waveform screenshots of the correct channel layouts. Of the many things I'm proud of from my association with D-V, the rate at which we've been consistently right with channel assignments (okay, this is like 85% Mike and 15% me at best, but still) even in the face of occasionally defying what's written on the tape box occasionally. The one half of that Guess Who album is one of the only (if not the only) one that was errant, and I try to remind myself that that kind of record would get you into the hall of fame in any sport, or as Mike simply put it "we don't always get it right."

I know money's tight for everyone these days, but there are some great titles being offered under the 20% discount Mike's offering - if you've been on the fence about any of them (I can heartily reccomend the Mancini, Montenegro and Main Ingredient albums at the top of that list, though you're guaranteed a great quad mix and superior sound quality with all of them) this is a great opportunity to take a chance, not to mention (as I've said before) the best kind of vote for the continuation of Mike's quad excavations at D-V is the one you make with your wallet.

 

[Q-Eight]

And, in Mr. D's defence, the American Woman Q8 also has some phase issues on Track 1 as well as not being a discrete mix AT ALL. Plus, there's also the fact the error is ONLY on Track 1 would probably make a person second guess themselves. It took me many years, multiple listens AND having a 4-channel oscilloscope to figure it out.

That's a mighty steep learning curve to overcome for a single title.

 

[artwwweb]

I can't really add anything to what others have already said, but I've got to say it anyway! Well done for getting the interview, it was great! And of course thanks to Mr Dutton for agreeing. The mastering and attention to detail - and value for money - are appreciated. Roll on part 2 (and SWT part 1 ).

(I'd be interested to know exactly what MJD meant when he said that Van Gelder mixes can't be adjusted. I think he was just talking about the 4 track quad masters, so I'm wondering what makes them different to other quad masters. I didn't think he meant 'there are no multi-tracks', I got the impression he was talking about simple adjustments the quad master. (Maybe I misunderstood.) I can't find the relevant section now to check.)

 

[jaybird100]

The passion in Mike's voice shows how much he deeply cares about his life's work.
You can see he is a driven man with exceptional qualities in trying to achieve the ultimate sound.
His interest in higher definition, especially for orchestral recordings, sounds like it's a real game changer.
I wonder if has has an apprentice to help him to prolong his amazing ability to know what sounds right.
I thoroughly enjoyed the discussion Mike
And was sorry it ended when it did.
I felt he has a lot more to say about his past and future projects.
I also like his reference to some of today's mixing engineers who could improve their skills by getting back to basics and embracing quad music.

Where Mike Dutton leads, we follow with our open hearts.

Is Mike a member of our forum? If not, maybe we can persuade him to join us.

I seem to have a problem logging on to their website. When I enter my user name and password, I get a message that says "Hash test failed". Simon, at DV, helped me log in once, but this problem is ongoing. Has anyone else had that problem?

 

[beerking]

Is Mike a member of our forum? If not, maybe we can persuade him to join us.

I seem to have a problem logging on to their website. When I enter my user name and password, I get a message that says "Hash test failed". Simon, at DV, helped me log in once, but this problem is ongoing. Has anyone else had that problem?

I Don't know if he is a member.
Those in a better place to provide that information can, hopefully, chime in.

That's a right pain not being able to access their website without a run around. Not had that problem here.

 

[humprof]

I can't really add anything to what others have already said, but I've got to say it anyway! Well done for getting the interview, it was great! And of course thanks to Mr Dutton for agreeing. The mastering and attention to detail - and value for money - are appreciated. Roll on part 2 (and SWT part 1 ).

Thanks to @edisonbaggins: good job--and what a coup! And thanks to Mike Dutton for the insights. (And for lurking here. And for promising to continue the conversation.)

(I'd be interested to know exactly what MJD meant when he said that Van Gelder mixes can't be adjusted. I think he was just talking about the 4 track quad masters, so I'm wondering what makes them different to other quad masters. I didn't think he meant 'there are no multi-tracks', I got the impression he was talking about simple adjustments the quad master. (Maybe I misunderstood.) I can't find the relevant section now to check.)

I'm assuming he mainly meant that you just don't mess with a Rudy Van Gelder masterpiece? Maybe also that even with Van Gelder's close-miking technique, he was still mainly recording live in studio, so there would still be a lot of bleed from one mic to the next. (So in a way, as with classical music, much of the mixing happens in the miking and recording.) But I'm speculating, and I don't know a thing about how Van Gelder did his quad and 5.1 mixes. Somebody who understands this better should step in and set me straight....
https://rvglegacy.org/the-van-gelder-sound/

 

[Frank Lovejoy]

Thank you for this interview, @edisonbaggins! I only have two DV quads right now, but I thought they were both high quality sounding immediately right off the bat, both CD and SACD layers, and I’m hoping to get more to help keep them coming.

My question now is whether ‘Edison Musicians and the Phonograph’ JUST went up in price after this interview, or if it was that high before?

 

[artwwweb]

I'm assuming he mainly meant that you just don't mess with a Rudy Van Gelder masterpiece? Maybe also that even with Van Gelder's close-miking technique, he was still mainly recording live in studio, so there would still be a lot of bleed from one mic to the next. (So in a way, as with classical music, much of the mixing happens in the miking and recording.) But I'm speculating, and I don't know a thing about how Van Gelder did his quad and 5.1 mixes. Somebody who understands this better should step in and set me straight....
https://rvglegacy.org/the-van-gelder-sound/

I agree, I did think it might be due to a 'live in the studio' way of working, though even that at times might benefit from a bit of tweaking.

 

[mandrix]

Thank you so much for the interview with Mr. Dutton.
I think you cued him well with your responses and questions.
That he is beginning to dabble in Atmos is exciting.

But most of all thank you for the straightforward interview process. I don't like to hear a bunch of mumbo jumbo BS from an interviewer that wants to show how smart they are, but instead with gentle cues lets the interviewee (is that a word?) speak his mind.

Less is more, sometimes. That you know what you're talking about is a credit to you.

IOW ya done good.

 

[esimms86]

(1)Great interview! Thanks Mikie V!
(2)Am very interested in seeing which DV recordings will soon be going out of print. With an LIS discount code, Baggy will continue conspiring to separate me from my money!
(3)I nominate @fredblue and @DuncanS to try to attend an upcoming Watford Town Hall meeting, a.k.a., live recording session. Heck, @beerking can even provide adult refreshments if he’s not otherwise too busy on YouTube with Toyah and Robert!

 

[TVB]

Just bought 8 of these that I've been cooling my heels on, but baggy's discount shoved me over the edge. I got the earth wind and fire disc because of the reviews here, the kristofferson disc because of a review in an audio magazine that gave it kudos and had to add what I consider it's partner disc-the mac davis. I have all of the Kristoffersons and some of the Mc D's on SQ discs but discrete's will be nice. I ordered the sextant disc because I'm intrigued by the SQ variation on the disc and because some of ya'll like it better then the headhunters disc (I have the HH on japan sacd). I also have several of these on CD-4 that I really like (stolen goods, danny davis and a couple of the mancini's) so they're comin as well.

 

[The Rang]

How many discs did the code apply to, I thought it was a limited number, very few (one) of the SACDs I’m interested in

 

[edisonbaggins]

How many discs did the code apply to, I thought it was a limited number, very few (one) of the SACDs I’m interested in

I think the available titles are in the video description.

 

[The Rang]

I think the available titles are in the video description.

You’re right (and so was I ) should have double checked before posting

 

[Frank Lovejoy]

You’re right (and so was I ) should have double checked before posting

@The Rang the comments made by TVB made me think that the discount was more encompassing. Not that I’m complaining about the discount, I just saw that he purchased EWF (which I’m saving for) and thought he got the discount on THAT. Thanks @edisonbaggins for clarifying.

 

[The Rang]

There are some good deals to be had but I realized that with one exception, The Miracles, I already had everything of interest on the list.
Maybe a good thing, my discretionary music spending dollars got used up (and more) on a stack of SACDs on Memorial Day sales.

 

[Clement]

One last order before heading off for Japan. My memo to Michael Dutton at the top of the screenshot goes double for @edisonbaggins