Deep Purple "Machine Head 50 (Deluxe)" 3CD+LP+BD-A w/ Atmos, US quad and 5.1 bonus (3/29/2024 -Universal)

[quicksrt]

The most points that should be taken away for the musical content is 3. So many here don't follow the guidelines, which makes polls less useful. I do also find that 9s and 10s are handed out far too frequently, artificially inflating scores.

But there have been a lot of true 9s and 10s lately imo for quadraphonic reissues. I can name a two dozen titles right off the bat. When a 4.0 or a 5.1 is great enough that I'm never going back to the stereo mix it's usually a 10. Or a 9.5 that I rounded out to 10.

Lot's of magic has come out since AF kicked the door down for quad on disc. I'm amazed.

 

[JulesRules]

I don't think I had a double negative in there.

I think you just used a wrong word order there. "The mix just isn't“ vs. "The mix isn't just" - quite a difference. Stuff like that can happen.

 

[ar surround]

Well, despite my reservations about this set, I caved because ImportCDs has it for $59. However, it is backordered and won't be here until sometime in May.

 

[Ephi82]

We completely agree, up to this point.
Beyond that, we mainly disagree.

The mix is enjoyable to some people, on some systems. I’d like to see you sit with Dweezil, in his immersive mixing studio, and tell him what he’s done “

Greg Penny and Eliot Scheiner did/do consistently great work despite being not Steven Wilson.

And I've consistently preferred their work to Wilson's.

Wilson does great work, but I don’t understand the god like reverence. As you point out, he’s not the only ATMOS mix engineer putting out really good records.

 

[mandrix]

Steven Wilson, when mixing his own work and PT is a master. I guess cause I'm a proggie I favor it.
He does pretty good on other's music as well, but some of it is for groups I'm not all that crazy about. It's sometimes hard for me to judge mix quality if I don't like the music. If I absolutely don't like the music I suppose I can't rate it fairly.

He is indeed not the only Atmos mixer out there, and there are some good ones and there are some not so good ones (IMO).

 

[ar surround]

Wilson does great work, but I don’t understand the god like reverence.

Neither does he, probably. The man comes across as rather humble and works his butt off to achieve what he has.

 

[cornwall198]

We completely agree, up to this point.
Beyond that, we mainly disagree.

The mix is enjoyable to some people, on some systems. I’d like to see you sit with Dweezil, in his immersive mixing studio, and tell him what he’s done “wrong”.

EdisonBaggins - why would you like this? You seem very defensive on this Purple set. And a bit angry. Why? Can we only comment if we are prepared to do as you suggest above? My goodness, I love a lot of eg Steven Wilson’s mixing choices - and dislike a few of them. Can i only comment if I’m prepared to sit in his studio and “tell him what he has done “wrong”?

 

[jimfisheye]

Remixes are tricky. The band was there for the original mix. Sometimes they had their hands on the board riding the faders and getting the parts and levels just right. Tweaking an echo to be just perfect timing. Getting that flange lined up just right and panned perfect. Ordering pizza at just the right time so the delivery guy could pull that last fader down at the right moment because we needed one more hand on the board than we had!

I think of a lot of those circa 2000s DVDA discs. Some of those surround remixes are solidly on point with fidelity. But the mix just sits there! The sometimes very damaged copy of the original mix is still more interesting.

I think Wilson gets that more than some people and tries to have a high level of attention to original mix detail. Not saying he's perfect but he hits details more than many others in his remixes. He puts effort into perception of the original where many others often don't even make an attempt and it got noticed.

He's dome some revisionist stuff too. I really don't like his 1st remix of Crimson Larks' Tongues with the guitar outtakes in the mix. And then his recent 7.1.4 remix is one of my favorite Atmos mixes.

 

[Sal1950]

EdisonBaggins - why would you like this? You seem very defensive on this Purple set. And a bit angry. Why? Can we only comment if we are prepared to do as you suggest above? My goodness, I love a lot of eg Steven Wilson’s mixing choices - and dislike a few of them. Can i only comment if I’m prepared to sit in his studio and “tell him what he has done “wrong”?

I have to agree a bit here, and not just Edison for sure.
Seems we get piled on anytime we give a not so glowing review.
I really hate to put up negative comments on new multich releases. I do very much appreciate
where we are today next to 5 years ago and would hate to in any way discourage Rhino/Quadio
or any of the rest of the labels. But the fact of life is, not everything can be a 9 or 10.

 

[paligap]

I've listened to the Atmos mix of this album only via streaming on Apple Music, so I haven't participated in the poll thread. I have a generally positive impression of the mix based on my own listening and my experiences listening to other mixes of this album. I would never try to discount or explain the opinions of others, but I do find the diametric opposition of some of those opinions interesting.

I sometimes wonder if it's more challenging to create a "great" Atmos mix from a straightforward rock album like Machine Head than it is from a prog or otherwise "dense" album. Those challenges might also lead to more divergent opinions. Or not.

 

[Dynamic Editor]

I am sorry if I'm the one who sparked up the contention here. Looking at mixes and if everything is in sync and all is a bit of something that I am quite interested in. I understand that the concept of something being done "wrong" leads dangerously close to degrading the artistic expression of mixing engineers. I do think the question of something being unintended is a good question to ask, and it's important not to jump to conclusions.

 

[quicksrt]

I am sorry if I'm the one who sparked up the contention here. Looking at mixes and if everything is in sync and all is a bit of something that I am quite interested in. I understand that the concept of something being done "wrong" leads dangerously close to degrading the artistic expression of mixing engineers. I do think the question of something being unintended is a good question to ask, and it's important not to jump to conclusions.

I always have to wonder if the sub is not polarity reversed intentionally. It happens often enough that I must question the intent or error. And I don't see the struggle of the signal (so much) if it stays singular apart from other signals electronically.

 

[himey]

I don’t understand the god like reverence.

For me it is his consistency and the genres he likes. Pretty simple really.

 

[himey]

some of it is for groups I'm not all that crazy about.

Haha. I just posted that it is one of the reasons I like his mixes so much is because we have the same tastes. From progressive stuff to the 80s new wave.

 

[ssully]

Whereas for me, that's what makes me especially critical of his work. I 'know' a lot of the original mixes like the back of my hand. When Wilson's surround remix doesn't capture the magic, it bugs me intensely. I just can't listen to it. (I barely ever audition his stereo remixes)

I know Wilson is aware of this too -- missing something that the ultra-fan hears as crucial -- since he's mentioned it in interviews as a hazard of the job, and because he is a thoughtful person and musician and acknowledges that it's been a learning process. I suspect he'd be embarrassed by the slobbering worship he gets in some circles.

(I agree with the above poster too who said SW's surround work on his own music is consistently extremely good.)

 

[jimfisheye]

I always have to wonder if the sub is not polarity reversed intentionally. It happens often enough that I must question the intent or error. And I don't see the struggle of the signal (so much) if it stays singular apart from other signals electronically.

I'm mighty curious about that too! I like to play detective and sleuth out software bugs. Not to just call out a mistake but to catch it and prevent it from happening again!

There's some film mastering house or something slightly off the main music production path involved in this. There just has to be. Once or twice and I'd expect someone had an outboard fx patch that wasn't offset correctly and the mistake slipped through. Repeatedly though and with random different offsets song to song sometimes?! Boy o boy I'm curious what piece of rogue software or whatever it is behind this one! It's just an ugly crippling mistake to have slip through and get released too. (It's also the least of the problems with the Atmos mix here but that's just, like, my opinion.)

12 channel mixes now...
Sitting down and listening to a final release fully in real time is really required if you want a perfect release! This is starting to get insidious though. Glaring as all heck in hindsight but I can see myself missing it just listening. Too much going on to just be able to immediately spot some things like with stereo!

 

[Sal1950]

Whereas for me, that's what makes me especially critical of his work. I 'know' a lot of the original mixes like the back of my hand. When Wilson's surround remix doesn't capture the magic, it bugs me intensely. I just can't listen to it. (I barely ever audition his stereo remixes)

This is where we fall into the area of opinion.
I also know much of the original mixes like the back on my hand and find the majority of
his work to be improvements in the revealing of inner detail and FR balance. If he was just to make exact copies what would be the point? From his remastered stereo to 5.1 multich and Atmos, I've found very little to be disappointing.
YMMV

 

[edisonbaggins]

I have mainly given folks some suggestions for how they might approach voting, eg you can vote on the US Quad, since it’s included and many of us would pay $60 for a good quad mix of a great album. I haven’t told anybody what to like or not.
Now… as for Jim. He has a long history of being super negative and it bugs. I simply challenged him on some assertions. Turns out there was some unclear language. Cool.
If my efforts to point out that there are other ways to vote, other than fixating on an Atmos mix that doesn’t play back well for you, such as docking a point for value and voting on the quad come across as judging, that is unfortunate.
On the flip side, people in my position: enjoying a mix, wishing others could, and trying to give some helpful advice get a bunch of pushback, it’s sort of just the other side of the same coin. Feeling judged for giving my $0.02.

 

[mandrix]

I know. When I say the low end leaves a lot to be desired on the Atmos mix, (and I know others that feel the same) but otherwise superb to me, yet others say the low end is a punch in the face. I don't get it, but I'm not going to get too up about it, whatever the reasons are. I know the sub is working, and the system has been calibrated and working fine otherwise. So I am without understanding on that point.

I often feel when things like this are mentioned that some jump on the "complainers" bandwagon, or your system is not right or such. But I'll leave it at that.

 

[GOS]

Yep, and yep.