DVD/DTS Poll Derek & The Dominos - Layla & Other Assorted Love Songs 40th Anniversary (Ellioitt Scheiner 5.1 Mix) [DTS/DD DVD]

[fredblue]

As I love Queen's Greatest Video Hits [2 disc set/DTS 5.1 DISCRETE] wonder why May/Scheiner never tackled the remainder of the wonderful Queen catalogue?

good question! i don't know at all (rumours Scheiner & May didn't exactly see eye to eye) but who knows, could be just hearsay/poppycock!

afaik the intention was to carry on remixing the catalogue beyond The Game, with A Day At The Races next in line for the 5.1 treatment, according to May himself on his own website.

further down the line, some of the NOTW album is said to be missing multi's, so not sure how they'd have got around that, some unwrap/upmix job I guess.

unless the catalogue's revisited for remix, which seems unlikely at this point, I think we should be happy with the MultiCh Queen we've got, which is not bad really when you factor in the 2 x DVD Video collections plus the 2 x DVD-A's, plus Freddie's solo 5.1 DVD is kinda cool too.

 

[fredblue]

anyway, I've just realised all this Queen (back) chat should be moved out of this Layla Poll..! sorry Jon/RT, etc.!

 

[musicmemorabiliashoppellc]

Does anyone own both the German Super Deluxe Edition and the Japanese SDE SHM set and can give an HONEST comparison? If so I’d appreciate it greatly

 

[marpow]

Please post your comments on the Elliot Scheiner DTS/Dolby 5.1 version here only

Shoot, I want this but $144.00, just can’t.

 

[musicmemorabiliashoppellc]

Shoot, I want this but $144.00, just can’t.

This is the Elliot Scheiner 5.1 I’m talking about

 

[marpow]

This is the Elliot Scheiner 5.1 I’m talking about

Right, what did you think I was talking about. I replied to post #1. Do you know of it being for sale?

 

[musicmemorabiliashoppellc]

no just wondering

Right, what did you think I was talking about. I replied to post #1. Do you know of it being for sale?

no not that I know of but was very curious if anyone had both and could do a comparison

 

[edisonbaggins]

Shoot, I want this but $144.00, just can’t.

$144?! I'd probably do it for that! I usually see it around $250 or so.

 

[4-earredwonder]

$144?! I'd probably do it for that! I usually see it around $250 or so.

Maybe someone could make a FLAC 5.1 DVD~V for Markie from the DTS 5.1 disc. I would if I could but I can't!

 

[sjcorne]

$144?! I'd probably do it for that! I usually see it around $250 or so.

There's two currently on Discogs for under $200 but both are from international sellers, so who knows how much the shipping adds. Got mine for around $100 on eBay about two years ago. It's a hefty box with all kinds of useless junk, probably the biggest one I've got- pretty sure it's larger than either Beatles set.

You don't need to look far to find me waxing poetic about the mix. The old SACD will seem like a joke once you hear this. "Bell Bottom Blues" is one of my all-time favorite songs and the mix takes it to a new level. This has to be the best version of the album available, regardless of the loud mastering and lossy encode. I doubt it will ever be re-released, so jump on it if you see it for the right price.

 

[Clint Eastwood]

There's two currently on Discogs for under $200 but both are from international sellers, so who knows how much the shipping adds. Got mine for around $100 on eBay about two years ago. It's a hefty box with all kinds of useless junk, probably the biggest one I've got- pretty sure it's larger than either Beatles set.

You don't need to look far to find me waxing poetic about the mix. The old SACD will seem like a joke once you hear this. "Bell Bottom Blues" is one of my all-time favorite songs and the mix takes it to a new level. This has to be the best version of the album available, regardless of the loud mastering and lossy encode. I doubt it will ever be re-released, so jump on it if you see it for the right price.

It is bigger than Sgt. Peppers and the Petty Anthology box...much thicker...and you are spot on about the junk...and since I don't have a turntable the LPs are useless to me..I've thought about selling it as I have it on a drive...but the sheer size of it is a hassle to ship and then there are the LPs...you never know if they are defective or not and the last thing I need is to have some buyer on Ebay to complain about them...I might just put the discs up for sale...minus the LPs and box and junk....as they are becoming very limited and very expensive..

I too love that version of Bell Bottom Blues

 

[Monkish]

An impressively discrete mix for such a sonically rough-edged album... but wow, this is a tiring listen because of the loud mastering. I intended to listen to the whole album in one stretch to finalize my rating, but I could only get around six songs in before having to tap out due to ear/brain fatigue. So... I don’t anticipate ever listening to more than a track or two at time, but I’m sure glad this mix exists. I give it an 8.

 

[jagxjr15]

Please post your comments on the Elliot Scheiner DTS/Dolby 5.1 version here only

I didn't like the sound of this audio DVD at all. Sure, the content is A+, and the 'mix', meaning the space and relative positions of the instruments and voices are good, but the sound was just bloated and the images lacked focus, seeming fuzzy/noisy. I think it got the surround sound Grammy because of the quality and importance of the music (common problem with Grammys). Compared with really clean 5.1 mixes like Gaucho or Brothers in Arms, it can't compete, at least on my system. I do have rather idiosyncratic hardware (Sennheiser HD180 S cans fed by a Smyth Research A16 with Auro 3D Auromatic up-conversion from 5.1 to 13.1 channels), so maybe that's the problem. It may have worked better over speakers, or if I had tweaked the Auromatic settings to suit the recording. I was hugely disappointed by this, because I love the music (in plain old stereo) so much.

Also worth noting that that the DVD has a DTS 5.1 mix which sounds quite different from the Dolby 5.1, even when my Oppo disc player converted both formats to PCM at the HDMI outputs.

 

[~dave~~wave~]

I didn't like the sound of this audio DVD at all... ...the sound was just bloated and the images lacked focus, seeming fuzzy/noisy...

I do have rather idiosyncratic hardware (Sennheiser HD180 S cans fed by a Smyth Research A16 with Auro 3D Auromatic up-conversion from 5.1 to 13.1 channels), so maybe that's the problem.

It may have worked better over speakers, or if I had tweaked the Auromatic settings to suit the recording.
I was hugely disappointed by this, because I love the music (in plain old stereo) so much.

Appreciate the detail in your comments.

I would observe that history documents Tom Dowd's 1970 Criteria Studio setup & miking was intended to capture lightning in a bottle, not make a 1980 Steely Dan record.
There was a lot of bleed of instruments on the tracks, etc.

Thankfully, "plain old stereo" will alway be available for headphones or speakers.
Also, there is a good market for this version of the DVD if you'd like to sell it to someone here who would appreciate a historic 55-year old artifact more than you, and buy something you'd rate higher.

 

[jagxjr15]

Appreciate the detail in your comments.

I would observe that history documents Tom Dowd's 1970 Criteria Studio setup & miking was intended to capture lightning in a bottle, not make a 1980 Steely Dan record.
There was a lot of bleed of instruments on the tracks, etc.

Thankfully, "plain old stereo" will alway be available for headphones or speakers.
Also, there is a good market for this version of the DVD if you'd like to sell it to someone here who would appreciate a historic 55-year old artifact more than you, and buy something you'd rate higher.

View attachment 112392​

I would only reply that I don't think a multichannel mix improves the sound of this recording, kind of like candy-apple red paint on a Model T. Of course, there are many historic recordings (The White Album and Abbey Road, for example) that do lend themselves to multichannel remixing, but this isn't one of them. Grammy Awards often go to sentimental favorites instead of to great recordings, which is inappropriate to the Immersive or Surround Award, which should be about the end result of the remix, not a sentimental attachment to the original stereo recording.

 

[coolerking101]

I didn't like the sound of this audio DVD at all. Sure, the content is A+, and the 'mix', meaning the space and relative positions of the instruments and voices are good, but the sound was just bloated and the images lacked focus, seeming fuzzy/noisy. I think it got the surround sound Grammy because of the quality and importance of the music (common problem with Grammys). Compared with really clean 5.1 mixes like Gaucho or Brothers in Arms, it can't compete, at least on my system. I do have rather idiosyncratic hardware (Sennheiser HD180 S cans fed by a Smyth Research A16 with Auro 3D Auromatic up-conversion from 5.1 to 13.1 channels), so maybe that's the problem. It may have worked better over speakers, or if I had tweaked the Auromatic settings to suit the recording. I was hugely disappointed by this, because I love the music (in plain old stereo) so much.

Also worth noting that that the DVD has a DTS 5.1 mix which sounds quite different from the Dolby 5.1, even when my Oppo disc player converted both formats to PCM at the HDMI outputs.

Interesting. I really love the mix (especially bell bottom blues), but it’s worth noting this is not an album I had any real attachment to before listening to this version. Which stereo release is your go-to?

 

[Larry Geller]

I would only reply that I don't think a multichannel mix improves the sound of this recording, kind of like candy-apple red paint on a Model T. Of course, there are many historic recordings (The White Album and Abbey Road, for example) that do lend themselves to multichannel remixing, but this isn't one of them. Grammy Awards often go to sentimental favorites instead of to great recordings, which is inappropriate to the Immersive or Surround Award, which should be about the end result of the remix, not a sentimental attachment to the original stereo recording.

I cannot think of an album that is more improved by a surround mix than the Scheiner mix of this one.

 

[califcab]

I think the Elliot Scheiner surround mix blows the SACD away. He makes a muddy mix come alive.

 

[jagxjr15]

Interesting. I really love the mix (especially bell bottom blues), but it’s worth noting this is not an album I had any real attachment to before listening to this version. Which stereo release is your go-to?

Thanks for your reply.

The Layla single was released the year I graduated from high school, when I didn't listen for the mix. We mostly heard it on AM radio or on inexpensive 45 RPM single releases (played back on 'low-fi' 45 RPM 'Record Players') , so I, like most other (young) people at the time, glommed onto 'the music', not understanding the importance of the engineering, so I don't have a stereo reference. I didn't (and don't) have an LP or CD recording of that album. The album did yield a couple more singles than just "Layla", including "Bell Bottom Blues." Back then, wearing bell-bottoms was a symbol of youthful rebellion (hippie uniform) , which I doubt younger listeners know when they listen to that track.

My first acquaintance with 'hi-fi' audio happened when I listened to a Frank Zappa LP on the console at a high school friend's house , which was a 'high end' console with what sounded like a good moving coil phono cartridge. That memory stayed with me, but I didn't buy an audio component system until 1980, when I could afford to buy the components myself. The heart of that system was a Carver C4000 pre/pro with 'Sonic Holography', which, to my mind at the time, was a big improvement over stereo. Now we have Immersive Audio -- and who can imagine what the future of cutting edge audio holds for us? I can't foresee anything that could be better. But who can, because if we could foresee it, we would want that, not what we have now.

 

[jagxjr15]

Thanks for your reply.

The Layla single was released the year I graduated from high school, when I didn't listen for the mix. We mostly heard it on AM radio or on inexpensive 45 RPM single releases (played back on 'low-fi' 45 RPM 'Record Players') , so I, like most other (young) people at the time, glommed onto 'the music', not understanding the importance of the engineering, so I don't have a stereo reference. I didn't (and don't) have an LP or CD recording of that album. The album did yield a couple more singles than just "Layla", including "Bell Bottom Blues." Back then, wearing bell-bottoms was a symbol of youthful rebellion (hippie uniform) , which I doubt younger listeners know when they listen to that track.

My first acquaintance with 'hi-fi' audio happened when I listened to a Frank Zappa LP on the console at a high school friend's house , which was a 'high end' console with what sounded like a good moving coil phono cartridge. That memory stayed with me, but I didn't buy an audio component system until 1980, when I could afford to buy the components myself. The heart of that system was a Carver C4000 pre/pro with 'Sonic Holography', which, to my mind at the time, was a big improvement over stereo. Now we have Immersive Audio -- and who can imagine what the future of cutting edge audio holds for us? I can't foresee anything that could be better. But who can, because if we could foresee it, we would want that, not what we have now.

I cannot think of an album that is more improved by a surround mix than the Scheiner mix of this one.

My stereo/mono reference for Layla is a car audio system, and, to my ears the 5.1 DVD mix is worse sounding than the car radio mix.