Yeah..what he said mboddy
New AVR required - Recommendations, please
- Thread starter Neil Palfreyman
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Neil Palfreyman
1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
I've had a week and a half playing with, and sometimes fighting, with my new Arcam AVR 550 now, so I thought it was time for an update. I guess the most important thing is that I'm extremely happy with the purchase and will most certainly be keeping it. I stress this since some of what I post below may come across a little negative, and I wouldn't want that to detract from the amazing surround sound I'm now getting out of it.
As you may be aware the AVR 550 is an "end of life" model. This means I got a great reduced price deal on it (though a lot more than I had intended to spend) to replace my recently deceased Cambridge Audio 551R surround amp. I needed something at least as good for all the 5.1 play testing that I do. The AVR550 has pretty much everything I need, a great reputation for build/sound quality, and the much vaunted "Dirac" automated set up and room correction.
After taking a while to get used to the amp, I've spent much of the last week trying to get to grips with Dirac, the automated set-up and room calibration system. Although I could tell that the results were going to be good (I mean *really* good), getting it set up with my sub woofer was proving to be a real pig. The main issue was that I couldn't get the included calibration mic to set the sub levels anywhere near correct. It was under reading the sub level by around 20bd (!), which is a hell of a lot of error! I could manually compensate to some degree, but that's hardly the point. In addition, the settings Dirac was generating for speaker delay and levels were obviously quite a bit out too, resulting in some highly dubious spatial imaging.
I contacted Richer Sounds and twice e-mailed Arcam technical support. Richer sounds were sympathetic but ineffective and Arcam haven't even had the decency to get back to me yet...
But, because I was sure the sound *could* be really good I persisted, rather than having it picked up for a return/refund, and trawled various AV forums to search for clues. Most people I spoke to had limited experience of the included Arcam microphone, instead using the "industry standard" UMIK-1 calibration microphone. I was pretty certain that the Arcam mic was at fault and tried to get Richer Sounds and/or Arcam to lend me one. I'm still waiting...
So I took the plunge and ordered a UMIK-1 (for another £110.) It arrived two days ago. One single run of the calibration and the issue was completely resolved! I've suspected the included Arcam mic right from the start, but I had no idea just how bad it is. It's dire. Absolutely dire. Okay, I understand that the quality of an included calibration mic is going to be lower than one bought for £100, but the one I got with my amp is so woefully bad that it just isn't "fit for purpose." Using the UMIK-1 instead, not only is the calibration level of the sub improved by around 20db (!), but the imaging (distance delay and level) on all speakers is vastly improved and where I would expect it to be. Maybe I got a duff mic, but it makes me weep to think that people could pay such a lot of money for an amp, only for their set-up and Dirac to be completely crucified by the mic included with the unit. Truly shocking.
So, that's the negative bit out of the way. Onto the positives. The sound now is *stunning* - it's everything I imagined it would be and more.
I had a late night, last night, running a multiple pass calibration set up. "Late night" to prevent any outside noise (mainly traffic) getting into the calibration.
I'm testing the results this morning using some "reference quality" surround material (War of the Worlds sacd, Brothers in Arms sacd, Every Breath You Take (Police collection) the Big Big Train Hackney Blu Ray soundtrack (yes, it's that good) and I'm completely blown away.
The sound is tight, detailed, powerful and dynamic. The bass is extending seamlessly right down to the end of the sub range with no hint of resonance or phase issues, which is incredible considering that my listening room isn't the biggest in the world and is far from perfect; it's smaller than the ideal and there are more reflective surfaces than there should be, but it's not cluttered and I have clear line of sight from all speakers to the main listening position. What Dirac has done for me is resolve some pretty annoying resonant frequencies around 40Hz that made some play testing challenging at times. As in; I knew they were there (I mean exactly) and I could mentally compensate when they were hit in a mix, but there was some guesswork and manual "on the fly" tuning of the sub involved. That's all been removed and the bass/sub integration is seamless. It's calmed down (flattened) a small but noticeable bit of top end on my already very flat fronts and surrounds. This is important because its just above the spot where many speakers have a "warm" cut. I need transparency, but no additional top, and it's done that perfectly. The other huge thing it's done is to create a perfect and very detailed spatial image for the surround field. It's concise and much easier to pick out nuances, detail and individual instruments. This was always good on my 551R, but it's exceptional now.
The last time I heard sound like this was on a mate's £20k plus valve amp system in a much bigger room. You could say I'm impressed.
As you may be aware the AVR 550 is an "end of life" model. This means I got a great reduced price deal on it (though a lot more than I had intended to spend) to replace my recently deceased Cambridge Audio 551R surround amp. I needed something at least as good for all the 5.1 play testing that I do. The AVR550 has pretty much everything I need, a great reputation for build/sound quality, and the much vaunted "Dirac" automated set up and room correction.
After taking a while to get used to the amp, I've spent much of the last week trying to get to grips with Dirac, the automated set-up and room calibration system. Although I could tell that the results were going to be good (I mean *really* good), getting it set up with my sub woofer was proving to be a real pig. The main issue was that I couldn't get the included calibration mic to set the sub levels anywhere near correct. It was under reading the sub level by around 20bd (!), which is a hell of a lot of error! I could manually compensate to some degree, but that's hardly the point. In addition, the settings Dirac was generating for speaker delay and levels were obviously quite a bit out too, resulting in some highly dubious spatial imaging.
I contacted Richer Sounds and twice e-mailed Arcam technical support. Richer sounds were sympathetic but ineffective and Arcam haven't even had the decency to get back to me yet...
But, because I was sure the sound *could* be really good I persisted, rather than having it picked up for a return/refund, and trawled various AV forums to search for clues. Most people I spoke to had limited experience of the included Arcam microphone, instead using the "industry standard" UMIK-1 calibration microphone. I was pretty certain that the Arcam mic was at fault and tried to get Richer Sounds and/or Arcam to lend me one. I'm still waiting...
So I took the plunge and ordered a UMIK-1 (for another £110.) It arrived two days ago. One single run of the calibration and the issue was completely resolved! I've suspected the included Arcam mic right from the start, but I had no idea just how bad it is. It's dire. Absolutely dire. Okay, I understand that the quality of an included calibration mic is going to be lower than one bought for £100, but the one I got with my amp is so woefully bad that it just isn't "fit for purpose." Using the UMIK-1 instead, not only is the calibration level of the sub improved by around 20db (!), but the imaging (distance delay and level) on all speakers is vastly improved and where I would expect it to be. Maybe I got a duff mic, but it makes me weep to think that people could pay such a lot of money for an amp, only for their set-up and Dirac to be completely crucified by the mic included with the unit. Truly shocking.
So, that's the negative bit out of the way. Onto the positives. The sound now is *stunning* - it's everything I imagined it would be and more.
I had a late night, last night, running a multiple pass calibration set up. "Late night" to prevent any outside noise (mainly traffic) getting into the calibration.
I'm testing the results this morning using some "reference quality" surround material (War of the Worlds sacd, Brothers in Arms sacd, Every Breath You Take (Police collection) the Big Big Train Hackney Blu Ray soundtrack (yes, it's that good) and I'm completely blown away.
The sound is tight, detailed, powerful and dynamic. The bass is extending seamlessly right down to the end of the sub range with no hint of resonance or phase issues, which is incredible considering that my listening room isn't the biggest in the world and is far from perfect; it's smaller than the ideal and there are more reflective surfaces than there should be, but it's not cluttered and I have clear line of sight from all speakers to the main listening position. What Dirac has done for me is resolve some pretty annoying resonant frequencies around 40Hz that made some play testing challenging at times. As in; I knew they were there (I mean exactly) and I could mentally compensate when they were hit in a mix, but there was some guesswork and manual "on the fly" tuning of the sub involved. That's all been removed and the bass/sub integration is seamless. It's calmed down (flattened) a small but noticeable bit of top end on my already very flat fronts and surrounds. This is important because its just above the spot where many speakers have a "warm" cut. I need transparency, but no additional top, and it's done that perfectly. The other huge thing it's done is to create a perfect and very detailed spatial image for the surround field. It's concise and much easier to pick out nuances, detail and individual instruments. This was always good on my 551R, but it's exceptional now.
The last time I heard sound like this was on a mate's £20k plus valve amp system in a much bigger room. You could say I'm impressed.
To your list, my needs would also include at least one phono input, switchable between MM and MC, as well as multichannel analog inputs. I doubt I'd use the tuner, so it could be an AV Integrated amplifier. I wouldn't need multizone capability, I would need a proper tape loop, HDMI that supports DSD and MLP for SACD and DVD-A, Speaking of the multichannel analog inputs, a two-channel analog output that can be routed through an outboard surround processor, such as the Surround Master v.2, to accommodate high-separation surround from analog. Just wishing...It seems that my excellent but venerable Cambridge Audio Azure 551R has finally given up the ghost.
Which means I'm in the market for a new AVR for my main 5.1 system. My key requirements are:
Nice to have (but not essential) requirements:
- Exceptional audio for music, transparency being the most desired feature (the reason I have kept my 551 for so long is for it's clinical transparency.)
- Assume it's used for music only (rather than films)
- Decent sized, robust speaker connectors, capable of taking high quality speaker cables
- Fully automated microphone based configuration/room tuning.
- A high degree of control over bass management, such as being able to set all speakers as small/large, enable/disable sub, define individual cross over points for Front/Centre/Rears independently of each other.
- It will only be used for 5.1, but being able to bi-amp at least the FL/FR using "spare" channels would be good.
Any recommendations?
- Networked (wired Ethernet)
- Ability to stream multi channel flac.
- Ability to stream video with embedded multi channel audio
Neil Palfreyman
1K Club - QQ Shooting Star
I would have loved multichannel analog inputs. My 551R had them, and it was one of the reasons that I chose it at the time, way back when.
But there are so few with that feature now that it's really restrictive.
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