Santana Lotus: Complete Edition in SACD Surround Sound and DSD 256 Stereo Download

[Simon A]

... or maybe AF didn't really try that hard.

That we'll never know. Truth of the matter is, someone has finally decided to release it. I'm grateful for it.

 

[Quadzilla]

That we'll never know. Truth of the matter is, someone has finally decided to release it. I'm grateful for it.

I agree with you, but I am concerned that the high price will turn away a lot of potential buyers, and the record company might take that as an indicator that there is nothing to be gained by the effort.

 

[Simon A]

I agree with you, but I am concerned that the high price will turn away a lot of potential buyers, and the record company might take that as an indicator that there is nothing to be gained by the effort.

I understand your point but I truly wonder how many Japanese releases such as this one are still sitting on the shelves after a few years? I think the market for this product has more followers than those of other companies because for the high cost you obtain equally high value. That value then increases on the secondary market. The only way I'd see this product fail is if the sound is atrocious.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Finally found tapes, could very well be a matter of" misfiled " in their archives and finally someone stumbled across the mistake while looking for something different.
I worked in an office with thousands of files and although rare in occurance,"misfiles" did happen.


I was actually pretty good at finding some of these...........so........if they need me to locate something believed to be lost in their shelves of warehoused tapes ??, I'd be more than happy to oblige.:sun

Quad sleuthing is right up my alley !!

 

[Snood]

Snood lub CD Japan :bounce - Preordered

 

[4-earredwonder]

... or maybe AF didn't really try that hard.

Since the elaborately packaged Sony Japan QUAD release of LOTUS will be released on April 19th, I really believe SONY wanted to keep the Santana QUAD reissues for themselves. As a point of reference, I was very disappointed with the SQ of the Abraxas QUAD track [Black Magic Woman/Gypsy Queen] on AF's sampler "The Collection." IMO, it was really no better than the much maligned DTS version of Abraxas.

OTOH, should we get the SONY Japan QUAD SACD of Abraxas, I'm sure it will restore the sonic brilliance to that title with bass intact and shrillness 'miraculously' absent. Just a hunch.

However, with the recent release of AF's Stereo LOTUS SACD and the $70 price tag for the 3 disc SONY Japan SACD, hopefully it won't deter customers from double dipping as poor sales might discourage SONY from releasing future SANTANA QUADs. Perhaps, SONY should've started with Santana's first album or ABRAXAS to really test the waters.

 

[seilerbird]

May I ask why you don't like it? The performances? The song selection? The sound quality?

Yes, yes and yes.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Yes, yes and yes.

Or perhaps it lacks that 3Dness which the QUAD remasters should restore.

IMO, LOTUS was a radical departure for Santana in the early 70's after their early albums but I personally enjoy its adventuresomeness and probably will appreciate it more so in QUAD.

 

[winopener]

... or maybe AF didn't really try that hard.

Or simply they missed a deadline.
Also, since AF is doing plain reissue and this new version has 35 min. more, it was possibly skipped because they needed to mix in 4.0 the extra tracks.

Not to rain on Sony Japan's parade, but i have no expectations for others Santana quad from there: keep in mind that Lotus was originally a Japan-only release and the only quad they managed from the start, thus having the masters.
All the others are in USA, not in Japan, and Japan stopped SQ production earlier than USA.
Ever seen Santana GH or Borboletta as SQ Japan? Me, not.
Same for any discrete quad tape: Sony is 99% M.I.A. (just a few reel and nothing more).
So, it's very unlikely that a Santana quad master tape other than Lotus could shows up there.

Said that, will love to be proved wrong...@:

 

[4-earredwonder]

Or simply they missed a deadline.
Also, since AF is doing plain reissue and this new version has 35 min. more, it was possibly skipped because they needed to mix in 4.0 the extra tracks.

Not to rain on Sony Japan's parade, but i have no expectations for others Santana quad from there: keep in mind that Lotus was originally a Japan-only release and the only quad they managed from the start, thus having the masters.
All the others are in USA, not in Japan, and Japan stopped SQ production earlier than USA.
Ever seen Santana GH or Borboletta as SQ Japan? Me, not.
Same for any discrete quad tape: Sony is 99% M.I.A. (just a few reel and nothing more).
So, it's very unlikely that a Santana quad master tape other than Lotus could shows up there.

Said that, will love to be proved wrong...@:

Keep in mind that when Analogue Productions released Jeff Beck's Wired as a Stereo only SACD they maintained that the QUAD masters were nowhere to be found and then SONY Japan released it as a QUAD SACD later that year. I have NO doubt that SONY Japan which owns/controls all of their intellectual properties knows exactly where ALL those Santana QUAD masters are.

 

[seilerbird]

Or perhaps it lacks that 3Dness which the QUAD remasters should restore.

IMO, LOTUS was a radical departure for Santana in the early 70's after their early albums but I personally enjoy its adventuresomeness and probably will appreciate it more so in QUAD.

I bought the album when it came out and didn't like it and I got a quad version donated to me and still didn't like it. It makes me sad because I am such a huge Santana fan and it is a real disappointment to me. I also hate almost all live quad and surround albums because most of the time the band is in stereo in the front three speakers and the audience is in the rears. That is not surround sound in my book, that is lazy engineers.

 

[4-earredwonder]

I bought the album when it came out and didn't like it and I got a quad version donated to me and still didn't like it. It makes me sad because I am such a huge Santana fan and it is a real disappointment to me. I also hate almost all live quad and surround albums because most of the time the band is in stereo in the front three speakers and the audience is in the rears. That is not surround sound in my book, that is lazy engineers.

I should have added to my post that one QQer who has the SQ Quad of Lotus said it is discrete. Not sure whether he has the Surround Master decoder.

You're correct that MOST LIVE QUAD albums are mostly ambience and/or audience applause in the rears but there are always the exceptions.

But if you don't like the music then why bother? And $70 ain't exactly peanuts! Think of ALL the 3D movies you can buy for that amount of $$$$?

 

[DuncanS]

I really do like Santana, honest, but I fell asleep watching them at the Knebworth Festival in 1980, whoops! Also on the bill, Beach Boys, Mike Oldfield, Elkie Brooks, Lindisfarne & The Blues Band.

 

[MikeMonaco]

Pre-ordered, can't wait.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Mountain - Twin Peaks !!!

Also there's a Quad Q4 master somewhere's in a void so to speak, I'm thinking of Bloomfield, Kooper-The Live Adventures Of. But my major treasure to be yet uncovered would have to be JEFF BECK LIVE WITH JAN HAMMER . Here's hoping ?

 

[JonUrban]

I know Marshall tried hard to see if he could get the "real" quad masters for LOTUS before they released the title. He asked not only the companies but collectors as well. He was told there were none to be found.

I bet he's a little (!) pissed that all of a sudden Sony Japan finds these masters and is releasing a deluxe version WITH the discrete 4.0 on an SACD. At least Marshall got his out there first, but it's got to be a stab in the back of some sort.

Me, I was never a fan of the album, and never a fan of surround live albums -there are exceptions - so this does not really impact me at all. But I feel for some of you that are big Santana fans, and fans of LOTUS, and you plunked down the bucks for the AF SACD because it was SQ encoded, and now there is a digital deluxe alternative.

Oh well. You have to admit, as surround fans, we take it in the shorts time and time again. Par for the course.

 

[Q8]

It's funny that all the sudden this is happening when the other day, for no reason in particular, I decided to take in the full 2 hours of Lotus with my LPs and the Surround Master. I had a good time. I'm not sure why some Santana fans don't like this one. Sure, it isn't as explosive as Santana and Buddy Miles, but it is still a great album if you like the drawn out contemplative Jazz Rock of Santa. I've really fallen in love with Caravanserai through Borboletta lately.

 

[Simon A]

But I feel for some of you that are big Santana fans, and fans of LOTUS, and you plunked down the bucks for the AF SACD because it was SQ encoded, and now there is a digital deluxe alternative.

Whilst I agree with you Jon, I think it's best to consider the upcoming Sony Japan as a Deluxe Version of the album and not simply a reissue. Granted, it will feature luxurious packaging and Quad, but let's not forget to near 35 minutes of unreleased music. Not that makes it even more special.

What the Audio Fidelity offered for the Santana fans was a Hi-Resolution Stereo version of the album carefully mastered by Steve Hoffman.

Two different beasts if you ask me and both offer immense value on different levels.

It's a win/win scenario.

 

[4-earredwonder]

It's funny that all the sudden this is happening when the other day, for no reason in particular, I decided to take in the full 2 hours of Lotus with my LPs and the Surround Master. I had a good time. I'm not sure why some Santana fans don't like this one. Sure, it isn't as explosive as Santana and Buddy Miles, but it is still a great album if you like the drawn out contemplative Jazz Rock of Santa. I've really fallen in love with Caravanserai through Borboletta lately.

The BIG question: With the Surround Master, is the SQ vinyl of LOTUS discrete?

 

[Dillydipper]

Too bad fans who have a good reason to appreciate both, are asked to not only buy it twice...but at premium prices: the very fans whose support of the album (despite Columbia never even releasing it in the US during the albums' heyday...which means, these fans had to pay an escalated premium price for it from the get-go!) made this release the legendary triumph it was for the label.

So, that's three times they want us to empty our wallets to an extraordinary degree. Pretty-much making us pay the "penalty" for their inability to trust the domestic marketplace to appreciate such a stellar package (but no, I'm not going to insinuate they gave us Moonflower as a "bait-&-switch"...although you could make a rational case for it).

But for me, the most egregious part about this is making the statement in the marketplace that, if you want to support a superior product, we're gonna make you pay through the nose, callously assuming enough hard-core fans will make up for the fans who can't afford these jacked-up prices. EMI gives us 25 years of one of the crappiest masters on the CD shelves in Aqualung, and to "make up for it", we can finally hear it done proper, as long as we pay $150 for a boxfull of crap we didn't ask for. So they led the way, and Sony picked up the torch. I'm a rabid fan, so apparently, I deserve to get soaked for caring so much.

Whilst I agree with you Jon, I think it's best to consider the upcoming Sony Japan as a Deluxe Version of the album and not simply a reissue. Granted, it will feature luxurious packaging and Quad, but let's not forget to near 35 minutes of unreleased music. Not that makes it even more special.

What the Audio Fidelity offered for the Santana fans was a Hi-Resolution Stereo version of the album carefully mastered by Steve Hoffman.

Two different beasts if you ask me and both offer immense value on different levels.

It's a win/win scenario.