SPOTLIGHT The classical music general discussion thread

[ubertrout]

Now that I've heard just how good classical music can sound in surround, how does the Steinberg performance of The Planets compare to Shostakovich 5 as presented in the D-V set? If it's as good, I'm in. If it's like the 15th, I'm (staying) out.

It's not as active in its use of the surrounds as Ozawa's recordings with the BSO, but it's more active than most modern recordings, if that makes sense.

 

[J. PUPSTER]

It's not as active in its use of the surrounds as Ozawa's recordings with the BSO, but it's more active than most modern recordings, if that makes sense.

Hey, any of you hard core Classical guys/gals ever buy Hi-Res. Classical files from HDtracks?
They have some titles on sale now, but I never considered their stuff that consistent (often too bright and harsh.) Guess it depends what the Labels supply them.

 

[ubertrout]

I buy occasionally from HDtracks - they have a lot of the EMI/Warner remasters where the remastering was done at 24/96 and the only disc issue is a Japanese SACD, so the HDtracks version is both cheaper and closer to the source - and with a discount code cheaper than a full price domestic CD. Also got the big Star Wars soundtrack bundle, and a few recent issues, most recently the fantastic Lisa Batiashvili recording of the Sibelius and Tchaikovsky violin concerti (HDtracks | You can hear the difference. Listen on the go in master studio quality.). I probably order more from eClassical though, where the new release discount - and surround options - make them preferable to discs.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Hey, any of you hard core Classical guys/gals ever buy Hi-Res. Classical files from HDtracks?

Are they offering much multichannel these days?

 

[J. PUPSTER]

Are they offering much multichannel these days?

Not that I'm aware of Kal.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Not that I'm aware of Kal.

Not even from labels that offer it.

 

[J. PUPSTER]

Not even from labels that offer it.

I just don't know, but it appears if they do; it is a challenge to filter any multi-channel...

Categories:
https://www.hdtracks.com/#/categories
DSD:
https://www.hdtracks.com/#/category/5e15399758e146cc0014cd31?i=5
Here's one I have the disc on in MC, and I don't see a MC offering?

https://www.hdtracks.com/#/album/5dbc02ea3819dc25f3f4c6bf
Maybe someone here can help with info or search to find any MC titles?

 

[Kal Rubinson]

I was not expecting a rational reply. I was simply making a point about the near invisibility of surround on the site.

 

[J. PUPSTER]

I was not expecting a rational reply. I was simply making a point about the near invisibility of surround on the site.

Yeah, I figured, just to confirm for myself -Kinda sad though

 

[JonUrban]

As I've said before, I have communicated with them, two-way even, and they firmly believe (or want to believe) that there is no market for it. I have even spoken with label people who told me in no uncertain terms they would be willing to provide the material if they could determine there would be a market for it. Yet here we are, 2020, we have protests, we have quarantines, we have a pandemic, we have social distancing - and what do we not have?

M/C .flac files available at HDTracks or ProStudioMasters.

UGH!

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Yeah, I figured, just to confirm for myself -Kinda sad though

Let me add that I have also come upon a number of new releases from smaller labels and/or proprietary labels (orchestra, festival, etc.) where the presence of an included surround program is not clearly revealed.

 

[humprof]

Let me add that I have also come upon a number of new releases from smaller labels and/or proprietary labels (orchestra, festival, etc.) where the presence of an included surround program is not clearly revealed.

Do tell...

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Do tell...

"...the performances over which he presides are masterful, the work of an ensemble in peak form." —Musical America Full edition of The Cleveland Orchestra’s A New Century recording project available now on all major streaming services Six new recordings conducted by Music Director Franz Welser-Möst Stream A New Century now The Cleveland Orchestra: A New Century is now available to stream in full worldwide. This three-volume recording features six musical works under the direction of Cleveland Orchestra Music Director Franz Welser-Möst, all recorded live in concert at Severance Hall during the last three years. The final volume, available now as part of the full set, consists of recordings of Richard Berne Deutsch’s organ concerto Okeanos and Sergei Prokofiev’s Symphony No. 3; Okeanos appears in its world premiere recording. More information is available here. “In my career, I have found no better place in the world to work and create music than here in Cleveland, with The Cleveland Orchestra,” says Welser-Möst. “From the beginning, I have been inspired by the musicians and the support and keen interest that the entire Cleveland community provides their Orchestra. The six pieces on this new recording are just a sampling of what we have accomplished together." Taken as a whole, A New Century offers a diverse selection, from Beethoven to contemporary composers, with two works each from the 19th, 20th, and 21st centuries. Two world premiere recordings are included, of Johannes Maria Staud and Richard Bernd Deutsch. Both men have served as composers-in-residence through The Cleveland Orchestra’s Daniel R. Lewis Young Composer Fellowship program; in both instances, the recordings document The Cleveland Orchestra’s U.S. premiere of the work. In addition to works by Beethoven and the two living composers, pieces on the set include Richard Strauss’s first tone poem, Aus Italien, Edgard Varèse’s wildly noisy portrait of New York City, Amériques, and Sergei Prokofiev’s Third Symphony. Organist Paul Jacobs is the featured soloist in Deutsch’s organ concerto, titled Okeanos. The entire collection is currently available for streaming on all major streaming services worldwide. Included with the box set is an extensive 150-page deluxe companion book which explores continuity and change at The Cleveland Orchestra, across musical leaders, changes and enhancements to the ensemble’s home concert hall, and the rock-steady influence of a hometown community that constantly demands and responds to great musicians playing great music with new and refreshing perspectives. In both its physical and digital formats, the set is grouped into three volumes or discs, pairing an older and new work. Each pairing showcases the juxtaposition that Welser-Möst often uses in programming to help concerts act as musical journeys for the listeners. “I believe that every concert is as much about creating an emotional journey for the audience as it is a musical one,” says Welser-Möst. “An orchestra’s technique and artistry are not just about serving the music as an art form, but creating a special experience in performance.” “The Cleveland Orchestra has a long and storied catalogue of recordings, providing testament to the ensemble’s ongoing and evolving artistry,” says André Gremillet, President and CEO of the Orchestra. “As we launch a new series of recordings on our own label, this inaugural recording set documents the remarkable abilities and achievements of this ensemble under Franz Welser-Möst’s leadership. The repertoire has been chosen to highlight the breadth, depth, and great artistic partnership between Franz and the Orchestra, with a particular focus on 20th- and 21st-century music.” The Cleveland Orchestra: A New Century Recorded at Severance Hall Franz Welser-Möst, conductor Volume 1 Beethoven: String Quartet No. 15 (version for string orchestra) Varèse: Amériques Volume 2 Staud: Stromab (Cleveland Orchestra co-commission; world premiere recording) Strauss: Aus Italien Volume 3 Deutsch: Okeanos (world premiere recording) with Paul Jacobs (organ) Prokofiev: Symphony No. 3 A New Century 150-page deluxe companion book • Introduction by André Gremillet • Essay “Why Music Matters,” by Franz Welser-Möst • Two interviews with Welser-Möst, about The Cleveland Orchestra and its future • Program notes about the six musical selections, taken from the Orchestra’s program book, written by Welser-Möst, James R. Oestreich, Hugh Macdonald, and Eric Sellen • Articles on Severance Hall’s acoustics and the Orchestra’s history, by Eric Sellen • Portrait of Cleveland as a city, by Suzanne de Roulet • Illustrated with more than 150 photographs, press quotes, and recording details

 

[4-earredwonder]

Martin Gester: Handel Concerti Grossi, Op 6 [BIS/3 Multi~CH SACDs] Stunning in EVERY Respect!

https://www.hraudio.net/showmusic.php?title=5400#reviews

 

[humprof]

​

​ ​ "...the performances over which he presides are masterful, the work of an ensemble in peak form." —Musical America ​ Full edition of The Cleveland Orchestra’s A New Century recording project available now on all major streaming services Six new recordings conducted by Music Director Franz Welser-Möst ​ ​ Stream A New Century now ​ The Cleveland Orchestra: A New Century is now available to stream in full worldwide. This three-volume recording features six musical works under the direction of Cleveland Orchestra Music Director Franz Welser-Möst, all recorded live in concert at Severance Hall during the last three years. The final volume, available now as part of the full set, consists of recordings of Richard Berne Deutsch’s organ concerto Okeanos and Sergei Prokofiev’s Symphony No. 3; Okeanos appears in its world premiere recording. More information is available here. “In my career, I have found no better place in the world to work and create music than here in Cleveland, with The Cleveland Orchestra,” says Welser-Möst. “From the beginning, I have been inspired by the musicians and the support and keen interest that the entire Cleveland community provides their Orchestra. The six pieces on this new recording are just a sampling of what we have accomplished together." Taken as a whole, A New Century offers a diverse selection, from Beethoven to contemporary composers, with two works each from the 19th, 20th, and 21st centuries. Two world premiere recordings are included, of Johannes Maria Staud and Richard Bernd Deutsch. Both men have served as composers-in-residence through The Cleveland Orchestra’s Daniel R. Lewis Young Composer Fellowship program; in both instances, the recordings document The Cleveland Orchestra’s U.S. premiere of the work. In addition to works by Beethoven and the two living composers, pieces on the set include Richard Strauss’s first tone poem, Aus Italien, Edgard Varèse’s wildly noisy portrait of New York City, Amériques, and Sergei Prokofiev’s Third Symphony. Organist Paul Jacobs is the featured soloist in Deutsch’s organ concerto, titled Okeanos. The entire collection is currently available for streaming on all major streaming services worldwide. Included with the box set is an extensive 150-page deluxe companion book which explores continuity and change at The Cleveland Orchestra, across musical leaders, changes and enhancements to the ensemble’s home concert hall, and the rock-steady influence of a hometown community that constantly demands and responds to great musicians playing great music with new and refreshing perspectives. In both its physical and digital formats, the set is grouped into three volumes or discs, pairing an older and new work. Each pairing showcases the juxtaposition that Welser-Möst often uses in programming to help concerts act as musical journeys for the listeners. “I believe that every concert is as much about creating an emotional journey for the audience as it is a musical one,” says Welser-Möst. “An orchestra’s technique and artistry are not just about serving the music as an art form, but creating a special experience in performance.” “The Cleveland Orchestra has a long and storied catalogue of recordings, providing testament to the ensemble’s ongoing and evolving artistry,” says André Gremillet, President and CEO of the Orchestra. “As we launch a new series of recordings on our own label, this inaugural recording set documents the remarkable abilities and achievements of this ensemble under Franz Welser-Möst’s leadership. The repertoire has been chosen to highlight the breadth, depth, and great artistic partnership between Franz and the Orchestra, with a particular focus on 20th- and 21st-century music.” ​ The Cleveland Orchestra: A New Century Recorded at Severance Hall Franz Welser-Möst, conductor Volume 1 Beethoven: String Quartet No. 15 (version for string orchestra) Varèse: Amériques Volume 2 Staud: Stromab (Cleveland Orchestra co-commission; world premiere recording) Strauss: Aus Italien Volume 3 Deutsch: Okeanos (world premiere recording) with Paul Jacobs (organ) Prokofiev: Symphony No. 3 A New Century 150-page deluxe companion book • Introduction by André Gremillet • Essay “Why Music Matters,” by Franz Welser-Möst • Two interviews with Welser-Möst, about The Cleveland Orchestra and its future • Program notes about the six musical selections, taken from the Orchestra’s program book, written by Welser-Möst, James R. Oestreich, Hugh Macdonald, and Eric Sellen • Articles on Severance Hall’s acoustics and the Orchestra’s history, by Eric Sellen • Portrait of Cleveland as a city, by Suzanne de Roulet • Illustrated with more than 150 photographs, press quotes, and recording details

Interesting. Looks like they're taking a page out of Berlin's book. $65 direct from their store (where they're also selling the old Telarc recording of Pictures at an Exhibition and Night on Bald Mountain!), $60 and change from Presto. Since I'm in the middle of Tidal trial, I'm gonna check it out there (in stereo) now.

How's the surround?

 

[ubertrout]

​

​ ​ "...the performances over which he presides are masterful, the work of an ensemble in peak form." —Musical America ​ Full edition of The Cleveland Orchestra’s A New Century recording project available now on all major streaming services Six new recordings conducted by Music Director Franz Welser-Möst ​ ​ Stream A New Century now ​ The Cleveland Orchestra: A New Century is now available to stream in full worldwide. This three-volume recording features six musical works under the direction of Cleveland Orchestra Music Director Franz Welser-Möst, all recorded live in concert at Severance Hall during the last three years. The final volume, available now as part of the full set, consists of recordings of Richard Berne Deutsch’s organ concerto Okeanos and Sergei Prokofiev’s Symphony No. 3; Okeanos appears in its world premiere recording. More information is available here. “In my career, I have found no better place in the world to work and create music than here in Cleveland, with The Cleveland Orchestra,” says Welser-Möst. “From the beginning, I have been inspired by the musicians and the support and keen interest that the entire Cleveland community provides their Orchestra. The six pieces on this new recording are just a sampling of what we have accomplished together." Taken as a whole, A New Century offers a diverse selection, from Beethoven to contemporary composers, with two works each from the 19th, 20th, and 21st centuries. Two world premiere recordings are included, of Johannes Maria Staud and Richard Bernd Deutsch. Both men have served as composers-in-residence through The Cleveland Orchestra’s Daniel R. Lewis Young Composer Fellowship program; in both instances, the recordings document The Cleveland Orchestra’s U.S. premiere of the work. In addition to works by Beethoven and the two living composers, pieces on the set include Richard Strauss’s first tone poem, Aus Italien, Edgard Varèse’s wildly noisy portrait of New York City, Amériques, and Sergei Prokofiev’s Third Symphony. Organist Paul Jacobs is the featured soloist in Deutsch’s organ concerto, titled Okeanos. The entire collection is currently available for streaming on all major streaming services worldwide. Included with the box set is an extensive 150-page deluxe companion book which explores continuity and change at The Cleveland Orchestra, across musical leaders, changes and enhancements to the ensemble’s home concert hall, and the rock-steady influence of a hometown community that constantly demands and responds to great musicians playing great music with new and refreshing perspectives. In both its physical and digital formats, the set is grouped into three volumes or discs, pairing an older and new work. Each pairing showcases the juxtaposition that Welser-Möst often uses in programming to help concerts act as musical journeys for the listeners. “I believe that every concert is as much about creating an emotional journey for the audience as it is a musical one,” says Welser-Möst. “An orchestra’s technique and artistry are not just about serving the music as an art form, but creating a special experience in performance.” “The Cleveland Orchestra has a long and storied catalogue of recordings, providing testament to the ensemble’s ongoing and evolving artistry,” says André Gremillet, President and CEO of the Orchestra. “As we launch a new series of recordings on our own label, this inaugural recording set documents the remarkable abilities and achievements of this ensemble under Franz Welser-Möst’s leadership. The repertoire has been chosen to highlight the breadth, depth, and great artistic partnership between Franz and the Orchestra, with a particular focus on 20th- and 21st-century music.” ​ The Cleveland Orchestra: A New Century Recorded at Severance Hall Franz Welser-Möst, conductor Volume 1 Beethoven: String Quartet No. 15 (version for string orchestra) Varèse: Amériques Volume 2 Staud: Stromab (Cleveland Orchestra co-commission; world premiere recording) Strauss: Aus Italien Volume 3 Deutsch: Okeanos (world premiere recording) with Paul Jacobs (organ) Prokofiev: Symphony No. 3 A New Century 150-page deluxe companion book • Introduction by André Gremillet • Essay “Why Music Matters,” by Franz Welser-Möst • Two interviews with Welser-Möst, about The Cleveland Orchestra and its future • Program notes about the six musical selections, taken from the Orchestra’s program book, written by Welser-Möst, James R. Oestreich, Hugh Macdonald, and Eric Sellen • Articles on Severance Hall’s acoustics and the Orchestra’s history, by Eric Sellen • Portrait of Cleveland as a city, by Suzanne de Roulet • Illustrated with more than 150 photographs, press quotes, and recording details

I feel like The Cleveland Orchestra has a long record of weird direct issues that they overcharge for and then go out of print - I spent years hunting for the 75th Anniversary and Szell Centennial box sets at a fair price. Like others, I'm only moderately interested in this one, although some of the contents are interesting. I feel like it's really aimed at Cleveland Orchestra donors.

 

[windhoek]

It's not as active in its use of the surrounds as Ozawa's recordings with the BSO, but it's more active than most modern recordings, if that makes sense.

I'm listening to it just now and it's as you describe: rears are busier than standard, but not as busy as one would hope. And compared to the surround mix of the Shostakovich 5 by Ormandy, it comes up short by a considerable margin - another (sort of) close, but (definitely), no cigar mix!

If I'd heard the surround mix before pulling the trigger I wouldn't have bothered buying it, oh well. Still, if nothing else it's a reminder that the surround mix on the Ormandy Shostakovich 5 really is the gold standard of what can be achieved with classical surround mixing.

 

[humprof]

I'm listening to it just now and it's as you describe: rears are busier than standard, but not as busy as one would hope. And compared to the surround mix of the Shostakovich 5 by Ormandy, it comes up short by a considerable margin - another (sort of) close, but (definitely), no cigar mix!

If I'd heard the surround mix before pulling the trigger I wouldn't have bothered buying it, oh well. Still, if nothing else it's a reminder that the surround mix on the Ormandy Shostakovich 5 really is the gold standard of what can be achieved with classical surround mixing.

Sorry if it was my enthusiastic report that led you astray, Derek. By classical standards, I still think the Holst is a very active mix, even if it's not quite up to Bartok-Concerto-for-Orchestra snuff with respect to discrete recording & placement. I hope you do check out some of the Ozawa/BSO titles that @ubertrout mentioned, though!

 

[windhoek]

Sorry if it was my enthusiastic report that led you astray, Derek. By classical standards, I still think the Holst is a very active mix, even if it's not quite up to Bartok-Concerto-for-Orchestra standards for discrete recording & placement. I hope you do check out some of the Ozawa/BSO titles that @ubertrout mentioned, though!

Not at all, because you're right: the surround mix is a lot busier than is usually the case with classical mixes; even some reviews on Amazon note that this is the case. I guess it's just the luck of the draw that I heard Shostakovich 5 in superb surround and suddenly thought/hoped that this version of The Planets would be as immersively discrete. The same thing happened to me years ago when I bought Dark Side of the Moon on SACD the day after I bought War of the Worlds on SACD: the latter set a standard the former wasn't able to match.

Still, my copy of Gurreleider from D-V has been dispatched so onwards and upwards

 

[4-earredwonder]

Not at all, because you're right: the surround mix is a lot busier than is usually the case with classical mixes; even some reviews on Amazon note that this is the case. I guess it's just the luck of the draw that I heard Shostakovich 5 in superb surround and suddenly thought/hoped that this version of The Planets would be as immersively discrete. The same thing happened to me years ago when I bought Dark Side of the Moon on SACD the day after I bought War of the Worlds on SACD: the latter set a standard the former wasn't able to match.

Still, my copy of Gurreleider from D-V has been dispatched so onwards and upwards

QUITE unfortunately for all, the Tomita Planets however 'hokey' but enjoyable in its own right, remains the only discrete surround version of the Planets, at present.

Perhaps one day some enterprising conductor and orchestra will dazzle us with a truly discrete definitive version. The new Reference Recording version is dazzling but ambient at best and I have SO many versions of Holst's Planets in my collection unless a new version comes along that is truly discrete, only then will I add it to my already burgeoning Planet's collection.