HiRez Poll Cure, The - SONGS OF A LOST WORLD [Blu-Ray Audio (Dolby Atmos)]

[Tres Discrete]

So here’s a photo & a question (since I still consider myself a tenderfoot in these here parts…)
I normally try to keep my speakers within 2 or 3 db’s of each other…but on this album I went way outside those limits to hear anything in the rears or heights.
Is that normal throughout the more experienced Atmos folks?
Still gave it an 8.
Is it the best Cure album? No.
Is it the best mix? No.
Is any Cure album in any surround mix better than 8/10ths of everything else out there?
Yes, IMHO…

 

[Zooboo]

So here’s a photo & a question (since I still consider myself a tenderfoot in these here parts…)
I normally try to keep my speakers within 2 or 3 db’s of each other…but on this album I went way outside those limits to hear anything in the rears or heights.
Is that normal throughout the more experienced Atmos folks?
Still gave it an 8.
Is it the best Cure album? No.
Is it the best mix? No.
Is any Cure album in any surround mix better than 8/10ths of everything else out there?
Yes, IMHO…
View attachment 111919

Do you get any sound from the Center speaker? I can't hear anything on my system. Vocals are splitted between Front Left and Front Right.

 

[Niek]

I bought the album a few days ago. While I really dig the music, the Atmos mix leaves me a bit skeptical. There's no sound coming from my center speaker... how about you? I'm sure the problem isn't with my system, because the center speaker works with any other DVD/Blu-ray I play.

Indeed no support for the central box. It is immediately noticeable when you leave the start-up menu. Nowadays I actually only listen to the stereo version.

 

[Zooboo]

Indeed no support for the central box. It is immediately noticeable when you leave the start-up menu. Nowadays I actually only listen to the stereo version.

Thank you for confirming that.

That's an odd choice not to use all the channels in an Atmos mix...

 

[dobyblue]

I bought the album a few days ago. While I really dig the music, the Atmos mix leaves me a bit skeptical. There's no sound coming from my center speaker... how about you? I'm sure the problem isn't with my system, because the center speaker works with any other DVD/Blu-ray I play.

This is unfortunately a pretty common occurrence with Atmos mixes, usually from new mixers but even that's not a 100% rule. With 5.1 mixes the centre channel in the best mixes is used well - for me often the best use is isolated lead vocals (Billy Joel - The Stranger SACD), guitar solos, maybe a keyboard part, etc.

I asked one of today's more prominent mixers, David Kosten, about it when he was answering some questions over on the SDE site and he was kind enough to acknowledge and respond. I had noticed the new Atmos mix of Keane's Hopes and Fears is almost completely devoid of content in the centre and LFE channels.

It’s an interesting debate for audio mix nerds like me and those (also like me) fairly new to immersive mixing – and I think I agree with you (in general) about it being a cool thing for lead vocals to feature on the centre speaker. My preferences will probably evolve over time and depending on the project I work on too. FYI on one of the mixes I’ve made previously I had to use a stereo lead vocal stem inc effects, so a dry mono centre channel vocal wasn’t an option. And on another the panning of the lead vocals moved around quite a bit, and I wanted to mirror this and ‘bake’ it (and also the lead vocal level) into the LR speaker mix. But on Into The Gap vocal (and mono bass) are happening lots and hopefully nobody’s gonna feel their centre speaker is unloved.

As for ‘Low Frequency Effects’ Atmos mix paths – the .1 sub speaker element ought to be fed from all the available audio paths and not the LFE mix channel alone – there’s tons of low end on the mixes I’ve delivered (including King Ghost which I mixed), though as they’ve been mostly classic 70’s/80’s tracks in Atmos perhaps not as much as say on a modern hip hop record! I don’t use the LFE mix path much it’s true as there’s already plenty enough low and sub in the mixes and it’s really meant more as a special effect boost if needed (historically more for film explosions / effects etc) and not the sole source of low end audio. Official line from Dolby in fact if you chat with them is if you mix music you probably won’t need the LFE mix path that much and the sub will be fed plenty from the overall mix instead. I do tickle it with bass, kick drums and LF one-off moments but as I say, there’s plenty of sub that ought to be going to the listener and sub speaker, LFE path aside. On Into The Gap Tom said I’d ‘opened the gates’ to allow loads of sub present on the drums for instance into the Atmos mix, which hadn’t made it into the original stereo mixes – vinyl mastering trends in ’84 did a good job of shaving off anything much below 50 or 60 Hz. This won’t show on the Low Frequency Effects channel path display but doesn’t mean the .1 speaker isn’t being used!

But I could never revert to the stereo mix for the new Cure album, the mastering is a loudness wars victim.

 

[Tres Discrete]

Do you get any sound from the Center speaker? I can't hear anything on my system. Vocals are splitted between Front Left and Front Right.

Maybe that has to do with the source tape or mixer’s decision?

 

[gorman]

With 5.1 mixes the centre channel in the best mixes is used well - for me often the best use is isolated lead vocals

I personally prefer when vocals are in the C channel but present in FL and FR too.
When they're just on C it feels off, for me.

 

[Sal1950]

Is that normal throughout the more experienced Atmos folks?

No, not at all.
You are completely welcome to re-balance a recording to your hearts content.
OTOH unless you feel an error was made somewhere along the mastering path, the balance you hear
in the recording is the way it was intended to be heard.
BTW, I haven't personally heard this release yet.
YMMV

 

[Tres Discrete]

No, not at all.
You are completely welcome to re-balance a recording to your hearts content.
OTOH unless you feel an error was made somewhere along the mastering path, the balance you hear
in the recording is the way it was intended to be heard.
BTW, I haven't personally heard this release yet.
YMMV

Thanks for the feedback.
I think it was a pretty unadventurous mix to begin with…so I guess I tried to compensate by creating wide variations between the front, rear & height speakers

 

[perzon57]

I love this album, I've played it more than any other release lately. The mix isn't the best, but I have a Denon AVC and when I use Dynamic EQ the surrounds and surround heights are lifted by 3-4 db, and then I store that setting on Quick Select 2 for mixes like this.

 

[Sal1950]

The mix isn't the best, but I have a Denon AVC and when I use Dynamic EQ the surrounds and surround heights are lifted by 3-4 db

Well at least that dumb idea of Audyssey's DEQ was good for something..
I really do wish they would at least make it defeetable.

 

[perzon57]

Well at least that dumb idea of Audyssey's DEQ was good for something..
I really do wish they would at least make it defeetable.

It's defeat able on my AVC 3800, but I use it all the time with different offsets to suit my preferences. I use all 4 quick selects, 3 for music and one for movies with directional bass engaged.

 

[Sal1950]

It's defeat able on my AVC 3800, but I use it all the time with different offsets to suit my preferences. I use all 4 quick selects, 3 for music and one for movies with directional bass engaged.

I think you may have mis-understood my statement there.
Yes of course you can shut off DEQ.
What I am referring to is Audyssey's lame idea of boosting the rear channel volume levels over fronts when DEQ is engaged. I forget Audysseys exact reasoning for this but still, IMHO it's just nuts.