HiRez Poll Dire Straits - BROTHERS IN ARMS [SACD/DVD-A DualDisc]

[rusinurbe]

I do seem to remember reading somewhere around the time of its release that the Producer I am sure it was Neil Dorfsman preferred the DVDA to the SACD in terms of sound quality.

I am sure there were all sorts of Up and down mixing involved as it was recorded at CD 44.1/16 standards, there was a PCM t analogue conversion followed by a reconversion to 96/24 and the last stage on the SACD included a PCM to DSD conversion.

I was always quite pleased with the DVDA version, it did the job of turning an over played record into something new again.

 

[Pibroch]

This disc is definitely loud, but there is definitely dynamic range. Money for Nothing's build blows my ears out in the car when it comes to the final flam. The kick causes me to turn my sub down. But I can see where Mike is talking about reverb.

The snare in MFN on the intro differs from the original mix in the opposite way, though.

 

[keenly]

I never got the feeling of compression on that SACD, in fact that album has generous amounts of Dynamic Range HERE

The SACD is compressed; super loud compared to some SACDs I own, however I think the EQ is nice.

 

[grill]

It would be interesting to see spectral analysis of the DVD-A version to see if it was sourced from the SACD master, like the Beck Sea Change HFPA BluRay was, or if they managed to find the PCM master.

Spectrogram of FL/FR of the DVD-A version:



No sign of ultrasonic noise which means the DVD-A may have sourced from the PCM masters. Btw, the average DR value of the mch mix is 12 (on both DVD-A and SACD).

 

[keenly]

Spectrogram of FL/FR of the DVD-A version:

View attachment 15733

No sign of ultrasonic noise which means the DVD-A may have sourced from the PCM masters. Btw, the average DR value of the mch mix is 12 (on both DVD-A and SACD).

So the DVD A and SACD have the same exact mastering?

 

[grill]

So the DVD A and SACD have the same exact mastering?

Based on the very similar DR and RMS values below it is possible.

foobar2000 1.1.15 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
log date: 2014-06-29 22:36:32

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Analyzed: ? / DIRE STRAITS - Brothers In Arms - DVD-A
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DR Peak RMS Duration Track
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DR13 0.00 dB -15.02 dB 5:11 01-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR12 0.00 dB -15.02 dB 8:26 02-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR10 0.00 dB -12.81 dB 4:13 03-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR11 0.00 dB -14.02 dB 6:34 04-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR13 0.00 dB -15.82 dB 8:31 05-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR13 0.00 dB -15.79 dB 6:58 06-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR11 0.00 dB -15.31 dB 4:40 07-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR11 0.00 dB -13.12 dB 3:41 08-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
DR11 0.00 dB -14.81 dB 6:54 09-Lf-Rf 24/96000 + C-LFE-Ls-Rs 24/96000
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks: 9
Official DR value: DR12

Samplerate: 96000 Hz
Channels: 6
Bits per sample: 24
Bitrate: 13824 kbps
Codec: MLP
================================================================================

foobar2000 1.1.11 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
log date: 2012-03-15 18:28:53

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Analyzed: Dire Straits / Brothers In Arms - 20th Anniversary Edition - SACD
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DR Peak RMS Duration Track
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DR13 -0.09 dB -15.62 dB 5:13 01-So Far Away
DR12 -0.33 dB -15.58 dB 8:26 02-Money For Nothing
DR10 -0.44 dB -13.37 dB 4:13 03-Walk Of Life
DR11 -0.35 dB -14.58 dB 6:34 04-Your Latest Trick
DR13 -0.51 dB -16.38 dB 8:31 05-Why Worry?
DR14 -0.34 dB -16.35 dB 6:58 06-Ride Across The River
DR11 -0.01 dB -15.87 dB 4:40 07-The Man's Too Strong
DR11 -0.32 dB -13.68 dB 3:41 08-One World
DR12 -0.35 dB -15.44 dB 6:58 09-Brothers In Arms
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Number of tracks: 9
Official DR value: DR12

Samplerate: 88200 Hz
Channels: 6
Bits per sample: 24
Bitrate: 6947 kbps
Codec: FLAC
================================================================================

 

[skherbeck]

This was not one of my favorite albums when it originally came out; aside from the hits, my cassette didn't get played much (Iron Maiden, Judas Priest, and Van Halen were in heavy rotation)... Any music with sax or synthesizers was frowned upon. My how 25 years and a perfect surround mix can change things! This is a perfect recording. Sound quality, surround mix, and musical content, all inspirational. A 10 (and I don't give tens often!) A demo disc for sure.

 

[skherbeck]

Now that I voted, I've gotten to see the voting distribution... A 3, really? I wonder what that voter would give a ten to, because I want that disc!

 

[Franklin]

I just checked, and it was me! (Which is possibly harsh, I don't think I've listened to it since around the time I voted, but I've learned more about the way my AV amp and current player interact since then. Mind you I wasn't keen on the disc on the old player either...) I gave a 10 to Fleetwood Mac's Rumours.

Now that I voted, I've gotten to see the voting distribution... A 3, really? I wonder what that voter would give a ten to, because I want that disc!

 

[skherbeck]

I just checked, and it was me! (Which is possibly harsh, I don't think I've listened to it since around the time I voted, but I've learned more about the way my AV amp and current player interact since then. Mind you I wasn't keen on the disc on the old player either...) I gave a 10 to Fleetwood Mac's Rumours.

Rumours rocks!

 

[fac23]

I probably shouldn't say this out loud but… I dislike everything about this band. The attitude, the singer, the style, the sound. This album however - no matter how many bad 80s clichés it's partly responsible for - doesn't have a single track that's not top notch songwriting. The surround mix is superb. So, it's a reference disc I will rate at an 8.

 

[Franklin]

What is most interesting about this disc for me is listening to the centre infomation. Why Worry is amazing, albeit with lots of silent patches.

 

[The Bright Side]

I probably shouldn't say this out loud but… I dislike everything about this band. The attitude, the singer, the style, the sound. This album however - no matter how many bad 80s clichés it's partly responsible for - doesn't have a single track that's not top notch songwriting. The surround mix is superb. So, it's a reference disc I will rate at an 8.

Funny, I've always loved Dire Straits... But I very much appreciate your post! If you can get into Brothers in Arms after all, do give "Love over Gold" another chance. Or two or three. It's really brilliant.

 

[sbrom]

I'm late to this party. Please forgive my newbieness.

BIA is among my top five favorite albums. An amazing musical and technical achievement in the use of nascent digital recording.

To my ears the original Stereo CD and MFSL Sacd sound open and clear, with unique three dimensional qualities. The surround mix adds to this feeling. If I close my eyes it becomes almost out-of-body.

My only minor "ding" with the surround Sacd mix is "Ride across the River". Beginning at 1:00 into the track there's a background trumpet that's way too soft relative to the rest of the mix. To me this detail sounds better in the Stereo mixes.

Overall a 9.

 

[JonUrban]

I just checked, and it was me! (Which is possibly harsh, I don't think I've listened to it since around the time I voted, but I've learned more about the way my AV amp and current player interact since then. Mind you I wasn't keen on the disc on the old player either...) I gave a 10 to Fleetwood Mac's Rumours.

Just an FYI - You can now change your vote with the new forum software. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but a '3' is a bit harsh to me on this one. But that's me!

 

[markshan]

Just an FYI - You can now change your vote with the new forum software. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but a '3' is a bit harsh to me on this one. But that's me!

It won the Grammy as best surround recording that year. A 3?

 

[Franklin]

I wasn't aware the Grammy's had to dictate my tastes, but in less feisty terms I was comparing it partly to releases from various years and not the period of time that it was compared against other mixes in the same release window.

 

[Franklin]

Just an FYI - You can now change your vote with the new forum software. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but a '3' is a bit harsh to me on this one. But that's me!

You may be right, now that I've heard more mixes, but I don't think I would want to go higher than a 5. The strange thing is, moderating it up could be - for me I guess - acknowledging a large amount of disappointment mixes I've heard, like saying they're fine enough within their field. There's at least a couple of approaches with us here with inevitable cross over, I reckon: those who like/love surround as a format in its own right, and those who like to hear music they like in surround. I fall much more into the latter category, so for example the Dutton stuff doesn't currently hold much interest to me. Brother in Arms is an album I've been familiar with (and largely liked) since the 80s although moreso in the original edited vinyl form. The surround mix just doesn't draw me to the album, there are no wow moments for me. I don't like the sound of the SACD either. I know these things can change with system upgrades, and there's probably been a few since I last gave it a go, so maybe I might enjoy it more. This is an album I'm more likely to approach in stereo, which when that is considered makes a low score make sense albeit maybe not as low as 3 in comparison to what else I've heard since.

 

[JonUrban]

I wasn't aware the Grammy's had to dictate my tastes, but in less feisty terms I was comparing it partly to releases from various years and not the period of time that it was compared against other mixes in the same release window.

Actually, the Grammy's usually have an opposite effect on me!

 

[Franklin]

Yeah!