HiRez Poll Doors - PERCEPTION (DVD-A Box Set)

[timbre4]

Okay The Beatles showed up first and that overshadowed the Doors box. I'm not going to vote just yet. Want to make another pass There ARE surprising moments on the 2nd & 3rd....

DEFECT? I was wrapping up L.A. Woman last night and had to stop short of the Bonus Tracks. The Denon DVD-1815 sat in menu instead of shutting itself off as it usually does. So I clicked Bonus Tracks to get on with it tonight.

Instead of Orange County Suite, it started the middle of Changling and then Riders On The Storm started. When I went to change it, the menu & track buttons were no good. So I shut the player off and re-started fresh twice. Same results every time; didn't have another DVD-A player handy to verify.

Has anyone else played OC Suite and You Need Meat (Don't Go No Further) successfully? I almost put my old LA Woman on eBay..... :

 

[aquadad]

Hello,

I sat through Morrison Hotel today (a few times). It begins and ends hot, with Roadhouse Blues and Maggie M'Gill. Everything in between is luke warm though. A lot of stereo layering in the front and nothing in the rears so I reached over over and punched in the Variomatrix and wua~la!!! the layers peel back and spread around quite nicely. I haven't listened to the others yet, this is the album that I wanted to hear the most and that I am most familiar with. Judging by others comments, I think I will be listening to these by choice through the variomatrix instead of the el lamo mixes. Thank God hi-rez decodes so well. The new sonics are very refreshing for these old tunes but I could live w/o the Tom foolery on the vocal tracks. I really get the impression that these guys just had some new toys to play with and weren't taking the project too seriously.

You know how the marketing geniuses are always saying, "Listen to this new surround mix and here the music for the first time--the way it was always intended to be heard."

Well my response to that in this case is, "This is yet another missed opportunity to do something really great in the world of surround music."

One thing though, with all the pictures that you get to look at I did notice something that I hadn't realized before. Jim Morrison appears to be pidgeon toed in a lot of the pictures. As a kid my buddies and I used to stand outside the Whiskey A Go-Go on Sunset Strip and listen through the doors to the Doors but we never broke on through to the other side. Anyone ever see them live? Was he really PT'd or was he just messing around in these pics? Inquiring minds want to know?

 

[Guy Robinson]

Hello,
Anyone ever see them live? Was he really PT'd or was he just messing around in these pics? Inquiring minds want to know?

He had feet? At Exhibition Stadium in Toronto in 1968 I was too far back. He was probably standing that way so he wouldn't fall over.

 

[Floyfn]

None of the discs will play on my Pionner DV-578A-s, the high res anyway. If
theres a firmware update for it, I can't find it. These are the first high res. disc(s) to do this out of about 30 or so SACD/DVD-A's I own.
Haven't tried the the Video Portion of the disc thru the player yet, but I've listened to the DD portion on the PC anyways. Not impressed so far, mixes are a big yawn after 3 discs. Hopefully a mix somewhere in there will lift my spirits. Is it just my set, or does anyone else need three people to pull the slipcases out? I'm sure the covers will start to show wear after a dozen listens or so because of this. I'd have preferred a simpler box personally.

 

[JonUrban]

For those of you who don't like to shop on line, BB has this in their circular this week for $99.

 

[Chris Gerhard]

I am glad to see Best Buy promoting this set although I don't think the DVD-A surround feature is being clearly identified in the stores. It was also good to see the recent Kinks SACD stereo boxsets at Best Buy. This is surely my first and last purchase of a Doors Boxset. I think Warner did a great job here. The packaging doesn't present any issues for me. The clarity of the music is the standout here and I like the surround mixes. This is way more music than I wanted by this group, but I like it better than I thought I might.

I will give it an 8 and commend Warner for another fine job.

Chris

 

[neil wilkes]

Based on the first rapid run-through, and therefore "First Impressions" along with a large dollop of reading all the whining at The Lizard Lounge, I give this one a 9.
I wanted to give it a 10, but I just couldn't bring myself to do it.
Why?
Main Reason is because I cannot access the lossy streams without resetting the player. That is it.

As far as the content & presentation goes, I think the authoring is superb (with the single possible exception of the missed LFE track on "WFTS", which may or may not be deliberate. You'd think it was the end of the world over at LL though.)
The menus are perhaps a little on the pedestrian side, but to be honest their main function is to get you around the content in a simple & easy manner - and they succeed at this.
Some of the binus content is also superb. It's an eye opener to hear all the out-takes of "Roadhouse Blues", and the other shame is that the Videos all have DD 2.0 audio, but that doesn't matter, it really doesn't.

VFM is great - you get the classic mixes on the CD's, and the new mixes on the DVD-A - both stereo & 5.1 are new. I still think the mix sounds different for LA Woman too - although this may be down to a quick remaster rather than a remix proper - it just sounds punchier to me.

All in all, this has completely reminded me of all the reasons I used to love this band, and I am hearing stuff in awesome quality. Stuff I didn't know was there.
Splendid set - highly recommended to all.

 

[mattB2]

There's an interesting review of this set in the new "Uncut". Apparently "sharing each double-digipack is a 20 minute DVD of television clips and promo films. And that's it." No mention of surround sound or DVD-A. And I thought things had improved with the focus on the surround sound version of "Love". Hey-ho.

 

[Guy Robinson]

Based on the first rapid run-through, and therefore "First Impressions" along with a large dollop of reading all the whining at The Lizard Lounge, I give this one a 9.
I wanted to give it a 10, but I just couldn't bring myself to do it.
Why?
Main Reason is because I cannot access the lossy streams without resetting the player. That is it.

As far as the content & presentation goes, I think the authoring is superb (with the single possible exception of the missed LFE track on "WFTS", which may or may not be deliberate. You'd think it was the end of the world over at LL though.)
The menus are perhaps a little on the pedestrian side, but to be honest their main function is to get you around the content in a simple & easy manner - and they succeed at this.
Some of the binus content is also superb. It's an eye opener to hear all the out-takes of "Roadhouse Blues", and the other shame is that the Videos all have DD 2.0 audio, but that doesn't matter, it really doesn't.

VFM is great - you get the classic mixes on the CD's, and the new mixes on the DVD-A - both stereo & 5.1 are new. I still think the mix sounds different for LA Woman too - although this may be down to a quick remaster rather than a remix proper - it just sounds punchier to me.

All in all, this has completely reminded me of all the reasons I used to love this band, and I am hearing stuff in awesome quality. Stuff I didn't know was there.
Splendid set - highly recommended to all.

Neil,
You are obviously a lot smarter than I. I voted too early as usual and now after my 3rd play through the set and getting the settings right, I would vote a 9 myself as well. The 1 point off is due to the fact that the authoring is off on some of the tracks and things are not consistent from track to track on some of the earlier discs. Anyway, from now on I will try to listen at least 3 times through without voting. Although, I have no patience so this likely won't work.............Oh....and if I had to vote, "Morrison Hotel" is the best disc in the set.

 

[stormchaser]

I brought a bit of baggage with me to this set that requires some explanation. I've always been a casual Doors fan getting by mostly on the two-disc Best of CD set. Many of the songs on these discs then are completely new to me. I was hoping to have the Perception set do for me what the Brick set did. I was only a casual Talking Heads fan before listening to those discs and now I am a huge fan. I remain a casual Doors fan after Perception. Frankly, I find these songs to be uneven in terms of quality. So, my rating for the quality of the music itself is a 7.
As to the sound quality and the surround mix, I'm rather pleased. While the self-titled disc has some recording glitches made more apparent by the hi-rez treatment, the package collectively sounds great with appropriate and discrete use of the surrounds (again, once you get past the S/T disc). If you are a Doors fanatic, the extras here are a must with an average of two new tracks per disc and lots of video content. I will thus allocate a 9 for the sonics and content. Overall, I'll give this an 8 although I am not sure I'd buy the package again if given the chance to rewrite history. Of course, as others have written here, with repeated listening that judgment could change.

 

[daved64]

Neil,
You are obviously a lot smarter than I. I voted too early as usual and now after my 3rd play through the set and getting the settings right, I would vote a 9 myself as well. The 1 point off is due to the fact that the authoring is off on some of the tracks and things are not consistent from track to track on some of the earlier discs. Anyway, from now on I will try to listen at least 3 times through without voting. Although, I have no patience so this likely won't work.............Oh....and if I had to vote, "Morrison Hotel" is the best disc in the set.

I'm going to ask Jon to lock your account until 3 listens.

 

[Guy Robinson]

I'm going to ask Jon to lock your account until 3 listens.

Someone has to save me from myself. Here is the answer on WFTS from The Door website.

Evening Jeff,

I must be dense as it took all of these postings and emails for me to realize what the fans are missing on the album "Waiting For The Sun". It's mentioned more than once that they are missing channel .1. I finally figured out what .1 means. It means the Sub / LF / LFE track. I am a dummy and I apologize. It is true, there isn't a .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track on the entire "Waiting For The Sun" album. During the mix I felt that it wasn't necessary as the tracks had all the punch and bottom that we needed to tell the story. "Waiting For The Sun" is actually a 5.0 album.

To have a .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track just to show that something is there isn't always the right way to go. During the mix, I used a TMH professional Bass Management System to listen through. It automatically generates a .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track that goes to the Sub Woofer but doesn't print to a track, only to the loudspeaker. The use of the Bass Manager is important as many home systems have them built in, i.e. the Bose home theater systems, and it's very easy to over mix the bottom end by not checking it this way. A proper Bass Management System will make its own Sub track and play the actual printed .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track as well. If they aren't balanced carefully the mix will be muddy mess, so the need to listen through a Bass Management System.

On the song "Love Her Madly", when I mixed that album, somehow a .1 Sub / LF / LFE didn't get recorded and it sounded fine to all of us so we left it alone. It's the only song on "L.A. Woman" without this track.

Some of the songs on the .1 Sub / LF / LFE track on "L.A. Woman" the album, are actually full range and not processed for that track, that was also a omission that was left alone.

Hopefully this clears up this particular situation. It's not fatal, it was by design in most cases.

I hope that this will now enable you to enjoy the music, after all this is what it's all about anyway, not the technique.

Bruce

 

[Guy Robinson]

Evening Jeff,

I must be dense as it took all of these postings and emails for me to realize what the fans are missing on the album "Waiting For The Sun". It's mentioned more than once that they are missing channel .1. I finally figured out what .1 means. It means the Sub / LF / LFE track. I am a dummy and I apologize. It is true, there isn't a .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track on the entire "Waiting For The Sun" album. During the mix I felt that it wasn't necessary as the tracks had all the punch and bottom that we needed to tell the story. "Waiting For The Sun" is actually a 5.0 album.

To have a .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track just to show that something is there isn't always the right way to go. During the mix, I used a TMH professional Bass Management System to listen through. It automatically generates a .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track that goes to the Sub Woofer but doesn't print to a track, only to the loudspeaker. The use of the Bass Manager is important as many home systems have them built in, i.e. the Bose home theater systems, and it's very easy to over mix the bottom end by not checking it this way. A proper Bass Management System will make its own Sub track and play the actual printed .1 - Sub / LF / LFE track as well. If they aren't balanced carefully the mix will be muddy mess, so the need to listen through a Bass Management System.

On the song "Love Her Madly", when I mixed that album, somehow a .1 Sub / LF / LFE didn't get recorded and it sounded fine to all of us so we left it alone. It's the only song on "L.A. Woman" without this track.

Some of the songs on the .1 Sub / LF / LFE track on "L.A. Woman" the album, are actually full range and not processed for that track, that was also a omission that was left alone.

Hopefully this clears up this particular situation. It's not fatal, it was by design in most cases.

I hope that this will now enable you to enjoy the music, after all this is what it's all about anyway, not the technique.
Bruce

So everyone is being quiet about this. What is everyone's take on this statement?

 

[BananaSlug]

I don't use a sub and can't understand all the excitement about this. I have large floorstanding speakers that are nearly full range, so it makes no difference to me. Even if I did use a sub as long as all the bass is present in the recording I am happy enough to get it from the main speakers instead of the sub (no balance issues etc). People using a sub/sat system will already be using bass management, so I don't really see the issue.

 

[JonUrban]

I'm not a big "LFE" guy, but WFTS sounds pretty good to me!

 

[Guy Robinson]

I don't use a sub and can't understand all the excitement about this. I have large floorstanding speakers that are nearly full range, so it makes no difference to me. Even if I did use a sub as long as all the bass is present in the recording I am happy enough to get it from the main speakers instead of the sub (no balance issues etc). People using a sub/sat system will already be using bass management, so I don't really see the issue.

A lot of players like both my 45a and the Oppo do not do this kind of bass management for DVD-A. What is mixed/authored is what you get.

 

[BananaSlug]

A lot of players like both my 45a and the Oppo do not do this kind of bass management for DVD-A. What is mixed/authored is what you get.

I did not know that. I've never had a sub so I guess I never looked into it, I just assumed if you set your speakers to 'small' on the player it did bass management.

 

[Guy Robinson]

I did not know that. I've never had a sub so I guess I never looked into it, I just assumed if you set your speakers to 'small' on the player it did bass management.

Unfortunately, some players (quite a few) seem to not have bass management for DVD-A right. SACD, Dolby, DTS works the way you have stated but DVD-A doesn't.

 

[ChristopherLees]

Just played this set last night...wow...


I am in danger of going deaf from playing this set too loud..

Waiting for the sun, Morrison hotel , L.a. woman and the soft parade are fantatstic..

Strange days and the s/t first release suffer from having just the music in the front 3 speakers (although parts of strange days does have true 5.1)...still that's a minor quibble ...after all in 1966/67 nobody was thinking of 5.1 surround...and the bass is amazingly better than any lp or cd....

There may be some individual tracks that are better in quad...riders on the storm is probably better in quad with morrisons vocals seeming to come from above you rather than the centre speaker.....but love her madly is better in 5.1...and the bonus tracks and videos are just a treat...especially the GTK film which I hadn't seen in over 30 years......

 

[neil wilkes]

Has anyone else been able to confirm a different mix on "LA Woman" to the DVD-A release?
It's not just a case of turning up the compression either - it sounds different somehow in a way that cannot be explained by Buss Compression.