Elton John "Madman Across The Water" 50th Anniversary Box Set (3 CDs & 5.1 Blu-Ray)

[marcb]

If it really was that simple, Audio Fidelity would have done that years ago, but I highly doubt that DV could afford to license any of the EJ albums, even if they really wanted to.

Yep. They say everything is for sale, but I seriously doubt the EJ surround catalog is available for license in the real world.

 

[fredblue]

Right now I use two streaming services. Netflix and Apple music. I know more than a dozen friends, family, and acquaintances that use those same services plus others. But apparently, I am the only idiot who actually pays for them. Everyone else just steals it through various means.

In my sons circle of friends (which is young and sizable) no one pays for anything that's streamed it seems. Movies or music. Its services theft on a grand scale.

Netflix just reported that they lost 200k customers in the last quarter. They expect to lose 2 million more in the coming year. They blame a lot of it on the end of the pandemic, but also admit part of it is due to theft and competition.

If you were 16 years old, you probably wouldn't consider paying for streaming. You would probably just steal it like all your friends do.

do Netflix do enough to stop people blagging your account? maybe.. after all my account recently had an unsuccessful attempted login by some malfeasant mound of a hound and i found out about said hound mound after Netflix kindly emailed with an alert about it.

funnily enough, Netflix just emailed this morning to say they were putting up my subscription (again ) i'm thinking now about whether or not to finally ditch them.. i mean there's only so many documentaries on serial killers i can't handle anyway! i mean, comedies and cartoons of course! yes, way too many of them on Netflix! ahem...

 

[fredblue]

Yep. They say everything is for sale, but I seriously doubt the EJ surround catalog is available for license in the real world.

i don't know about right now but at one point in the not too distant past it was absolutely available to AF, just under terms too onerous for them to bear at the time.

 

[marcb]

Right now I use two streaming services. Netflix and Apple music. I know more than a dozen friends, family, and acquaintances that use those same services plus others. But apparently, I am the only idiot who actually pays for them. Everyone else just steals it through various means.

In my sons circle of friends (which is young and sizable) no one pays for anything that's streamed it seems. Movies or music. Its services theft on a grand scale.

Netflix just reported that they lost 200k customers in the last quarter. They expect to lose 2 million more in the coming year. They blame a lot of it on the end of the pandemic, but also admit part of it is due to theft and competition.

If you were 16 years old, you probably wouldn't consider paying for streaming. You would probably just steal it like all your friends do.

That's not going to last.

 

[LuvMyQuad]

That's not going to last.

On the contrary. If history is any indication, it will get more widespread.

 

[Bill B]

Right now I use two streaming services. Netflix and Apple music. I know more than a dozen friends, family, and acquaintances that use those same services plus others. But apparently, I am the only idiot who actually pays for them. Everyone else just steals it through various means.

In my sons circle of friends (which is young and sizable) no one pays for anything that's streamed it seems. Movies or music. Its services theft on a grand scale.

Netflix just reported that they lost 200k customers in the last quarter. They expect to lose 2 million more in the coming year. They blame a lot of it on the end of the pandemic, but also admit part of it is due to theft and competition.

If you were 16 years old, you probably wouldn't consider paying for streaming. You would probably just steal it like all your friends do.

Wow! I did not know that. That is sad but not surprising.

 

[LuvMyQuad]

Wow! I did not know that. That is sad but not surprising.

Google jailbroken firestick.... see what pops up. You'll be amazed.

 

[Bill B]

Calling it a “sizable” subset is a generalization too - and a assumption as well. Sizable according to who and by what standard? Yours or UMe’s, Sony’s, etc.? Because all that matters is the latter. They hold virtually all of the cards - and by almost all evidence, they don’t seem to think it’s particularly sizable.

So that “sizable” subset can dig in its heels and be content with the discs they have and get nothing NEW - and continue to be perplexed why and complain about how much money they’re leaving on the table, blah, blah. Great, but it’s not going to change anything.

And my guess (and likely the guess of the music industry) is many of that “sizable” subset will eventually succumb.

All correct. By sizeable I was inferring a number large enough to not be dismissed.
I imagine the one thing that might tip me to streaming is when I get my next vehicle.

 

[fredblue]

Google jailbroken firestick.... see what pops up. You'll be amazed.

wow what a nightmare!

(a bit like this thread! oy i'm Verklempt! i just want Atmos and Stereo on the Blu-ray along with the 5.1 oh and i want an oompah-loompah and i want them all nowwwww!! is that too much to ask!! unless the Blu-ray does have Stereo and Atmos on it as well as the 5.1 and the wallies at Universal have got their terminology wrong.. i mean its not like they've never screwed up before now is it!!

 

[Cheezmo]

This is up on Apple Music now with the Tiny Dancer (piano demo) available now.

https://music.apple.com/us/album/madman-across-the-water-deluxe-edition/1618478418
Interesting that the stereo tracks say remastered 2016. Makes me wonder if this whole thing was put together back before Atmos was even a thing and they were just too lazy to update it.

 

[marcb]

On the contrary. If history is any indication, it will get more widespread.

Napster...

Wait until some average joes start getting prosecuted.

 

[fredblue]

This is up on Apple Music now with the Tiny Dancer (piano demo) available now.

https://music.apple.com/us/album/madman-across-the-water-deluxe-edition/1618478418
Interesting that the stereo tracks say remastered 2016. Makes me wonder if this whole thing was put together back before Atmos was even a thing and they were just too lazy to update it.

"fade it!"

wow.. if all the bonus material in this set is like that demo i'll quit whinging on about the Atmos Schmatmos!

edit: oh yeah! regarding the 2016 remaster thing, i meant to say i'm pretty sure Ludwig remastered a number of EJ albums around that time and they all ended up on vinyl reissues (i remember them being kinda pristine yet a bit loud all at the same time?) but the Madman 2 CD Deluxe that was rumoured was a bit before that, around 2009-10 something like that anyway

 

[LennonCobain]

The only thing which puzzles me about no Atmos disc is that people are puzzled by it - as though it's just an oversight or a bad decision.

Much as people hate to hear it, I'll say it again because folks still seem confused by it. The powers-that-be are trying to kill the ownership model - which means physical discs - and push people toward the rental/subscription model. One of the easiest places to start, now that the delivery channels exist, is atmos/surround music. It has a small, but dedicated, fan base who will sign up for streaming services regardless if surround music is exclusive to streaming. So why give them the option when the profits from the one-time sale of a copy of their property are so small vs a perpetual subscription revenue stream?

Not only do they retain all control over their property, but they don't have to deal with things like production snafus and delays or trying to estimate demand to get the proper balance between revenues and costs to maximize profits.

I know people prefer to complain about speeding trains to create order out of disorder. I do it too. But it's called the music business - and not the music philanthropy - for a reason. Music surround is just the first shoe. CDs and downloads will be soon to follow. And vinyl isn't immune either.

The main point that I will disagree with you on is that there is no reason why Universal could not easily seek to "double dip" for as long as possible. That is, encourage more purchases of the physical box set through the inclusion of the Atmos mix (again, assuming it exists) as a singular release is not going to be a driving force behind streaming subscription purchases or abandonment.

There are plenty of streaming-only Atmos mixes, enough to attract and keep subscribers. But when there is a physical box set release and there is an existing Atmos mix, it is just plain STUPID to exclude it and sacrifice additional sales as a result.

 

[fredblue]

The main point that I will disagree with you on is that there is no reason why Universal could not easily seek to "double dip" for as long as possible. That is, encourage more purchases of the physical box set through the inclusion of the Atmos mix (again, assuming it exists) as a singular release is not going to be a driving force behind streaming subscription purchases or abandonment.

There are plenty of streaming-only Atmos mixes, enough to attract and keep subscribers. But when there is a physical box set release and there is an existing Atmos mix, it is just plain STUPID to exclude it and sacrifice additional sales as a result.

Greg Penny himself said he has mixed the whole Madman album in Atmos already, its not up for grabs, its a done deal

 

[atrocity]

But apparently, I am the only idiot who actually pays for them. Everyone else just steals it through various means.

It's also trivial to get a bit-perfect capture of an audio stream, which is theft of a kind even if paying for the service. It's almost like the old days of taping a friend's records since it has to be done in real time.

(To be clear, I only do that when I need to upgrade a track in the library of the community radio station where I volunteer. I don't keep a copy for myself and licensing fees are paid when it's broadcast.)

 

[marcb]

The main point that I will disagree with you on is that there is no reason why Universal could not easily seek to "double dip" for as long as possible. That is, encourage more purchases of the physical box set through the inclusion of the Atmos mix (again, assuming it exists) as a singular release is not going to be a driving force behind streaming subscription purchases or abandonment.

There are plenty of streaming-only Atmos mixes, enough to attract and keep subscribers. But when there is a physical box set release and there is an existing Atmos mix, it is just plain STUPID to exclude it and sacrifice additional sales as a result.

To paraphrase if you can get people to pay $125 for a cardboard box with a few throw-away goodies, why give away the milk for free?

At some point, if they want to move from the ownership model, they need to cut the cord, no? Other similar industries have done it. And it appears that we are in the midst of seeing it happen with surround music being one of the first carrot & stick combos to encourage/force the move.

It’s amazing how quickly it’s happened once the delivery mechanism came on line. What was the ratio of streaming only atmos releases vs physical only or dual physical-streaming releases a year ago? Almost zero. Right now...today? 50 to 1? 100 to 1? More? Even old long out of print or unreleased 5.1 and quad mixes are now streaming only (except Madman, of course...).

It’s all been there in plain site if one thinks outside of their own self-interest or takes off the QQ glasses. You (or I) may not like it, may not understand it, may not think there is a reason to forego dual revenue, etc...but it’s happening and the music industry will decide what shoe will be the next to drop and when.

 

[markshan]

Right now I use two streaming services. Netflix and Apple music.

My company uses iPhones and when they upgraded my device Apple gave me two years of streaming for free.

 

[sjcorne]

Read what I wrote again - without QQ glasses.

It’s all been there in plain site if one thinks outside of their own self-interest or take offs the QQ glasses. You (or I) may not like it, may not understand it, may not think there is a reason to forego dual revenue, etc...but it’s happening and the music industry will decide what shoe will be the next to drop and when.

With all due respect, you've beaten this topic into the ground - I think everyone reading this thread (and others you've contributed to) understands your argument regarding the decline of surround music on physical media, and these condescending remarks about 'QQ glasses' aren't exactly helping sway opinions. I'm not saying anyone is right or wrong, but let's agree to disagree about why there's no Atmos mix on the Blu-Ray and move on.

 

[fredblue]

if i took off my QQ glasses, it'd be so static! a real stinker! i'd get on the dixie lily, via Grimsby, see the saucers with Pinky and the sun would go down on me quicker than you could say "Solar Prestige A Gammon"..!!

i cannot wait to add the Super Deluxe Cari-Boo-Boo to this little lot! Atmos or not, for me its a must!!

.. but how long will we have to wait my fellow QQ spec-wearers??

hear it, hear it.. Ticking, Ticking

 

[rtbluray]

if i took off my QQ glasses, it'd be so static! a real stinker! i'd get on the dixie lily, via Grimsby, see the saucers with Pinky and the sun would go down on me quicker than you could say "Solar Prestige A Gammon"..!!

i cannot wait to add the Super Deluxe Cari-Boo-Boo to this little lot! Atmos or not, for me its a must!!

.. but how long will we have to wait my fellow QQ spec-wearers??

hear it, hear it.. Ticking, Ticking

View attachment 78163

2024 at the earliest maybe for a super deluxe edition of "Caribou".
Pure speculation but I think everything up to and including "Captain Fantastic" could end up with a super deluxe edition.
Just not quite sure yet about anything else after that...