HiRez Poll John, Elton - GOODBYE YELLOW BRICK ROAD [SACD/DVD-A/BDA]

[fredblue]

fredblue - my review was based on the DVD-Audio playing Advanced Res Surround. I may try and find the SACD based on your comments (though I imagine I may need a second mortgage to pay for it?)

I have to agree with Lind's comments on the album itself; it's exceptionally good. It's very rare to find so many top class songs in a single (or rather double) album! Even the bonus tracks (which I assume were dropped to make the original fit on four sides of vinyl?) are good! On that point; I don't find the bonus tracks quite so painful to listen to. They're still bright but don't sound as heavily compressed as the rest of the tracks. Anyone else pick this up?

various discussions on merits of GYBR SACD vs DVD-A I found online..

http://www.ecoustics.com/electronics/forum/home-audio/113947.html

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...brick-road-hirez-mastering-sacd-dvd-a.173191/

http://www.avsforum.com/t/395904/is-there-a-difference-between-the-sacd-dvd-audio-versions-of-a-cd

..and some other neat related discussions..

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/elton-john-dvd-a-vs-mfsl-gbybr.246717/

http://www.whathifi.com/forum/mp3mp4/goodbye-yellow-brick-road-sacd-or-9624-download

http://www.sa-cd.net/showreviews/1529

..I read this article and wanted to kill the author..

http://m.cnet.com.au/dvd-audio-vs-sacd-who-cares-240001680.htm?redir=1

 

[kap'n krunch]

the 30th Anniversary SACD + DVD set is still readily available!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Goodbye-Yellow-Brick-Road-DVD/dp/B0000PCUDK

That's where I got my DVD-A about a year ago....(after having the SACD for a few years..still have , don't play it)
Sorry , I'm biased towards DVD-As...and yes , it's bright...but we got it on a decent (if you can turn down the treble) Surround mix....

 

[fredblue]

That's where I got my DVD-A about a year ago....(after having the SACD for a few years..still have , don't play it)
Sorry , I'm biased towards DVD-As...and yes , it's bright...but we got it on a decent (if you can turn down the treble) Surround mix....

as much as I love my SACDs (they're so collectible somehow.. and a lot of them do have great sound and surround mixes, unique to the format, especially a lot of the Sony single-layer discs) with just about every UMG surround release I have on both DVD-A and SACD (SD's "Gaucho", Marvin's "Lets get it on" & Hits Collection, Ryan Adams, etc) I prefer the overall sound presentation on the DVD-A (brighter, ballsier, more detailed) to the SACD.

..how much of that is down to:
- UMG utilising PCM masters for DSD SACDs (and all that entails),
- or my setups playback abilities/deficiencies (my gear maybe better handling PCM than DSD),
- or SACD's upper frequency range dropping off way below DVD-A's,
- or SACD's ultrasonic noise guff colouring the sound in a detrimental way..

..who can say!?!? (I can't!).

 

[sarasota2k4]

The first concert I attended (10 years old) was when my older brother took me to see Dave Mason, John Miles and Elton John put on the bicentennial concert at Foxboro stadium back on July 4, 1976. I grew up the youngest of nine and have a strong affinity for the bands of the 70s. Of course, my first DVD-A would have to be GBYBR and I am thoroughly pleased. I understand others stating it is a little bright, but that only appeals to the fact that DVD-A really allows you to experience the music in a whole new light. I think the use of discrete channels is done effectively and modestly, and the use of the LFE is amazing on Danny Bailey and Grey Seal in my Acura. This has always been a top 10 for me in my CD collection and will certainly be a Top 5 for DVD-A.

 

[Blrac]

10. Reference quality. Get it if you don't already have it. It can be found for under $25 brand new.

 

[blue.monk]

Well, in anticipation of the 5.1 Blu-Ray I thought I'd revisit the SACD and finally vote on it. Of course this is an exceptionally brilliant album but for me it is the least satisfying of the Greg Penny mixes. Don't get me wrong, I think it's very well done with excellent instrument placement and some entertaining active panning. However, the parts don't always seem to 'gel' quite as well as they do with the other Elton titles. Plus the top end is goosed far too much for my tastes. I find I often need to decrease volume to find a pleasant level. As with the other Penny mixes I love hearing little bits from the multis that never made it to the stereo master.

I'm hoping the new Blu-Ray will retain the best qualities of the SACD with better EQ.

9

 

[DennisMoore Jr.]

GBYBR was performed & recorded in 1973 on a 16 track tape machine. What was done here on my SACD, I consider to be absolutely spectacular. It sounds like it could rival any modern recording which is saying quite a lot. I don't notice any extra brightness and my ears are pretty sharp.(its my brain that most people worry about...)

Frankly I am getting tired of voting ten, but this is a ten to me. GBYBR and Capt. Fantastic are absolute must have recordings for any 5.1 listener.

My only gripe is with the SACD format which allows no art. I forget why I bought the SACD instead of the DVD-Audio. Did the SACD come out first? I forget...
I do LOVE the wonderful 4 page foldout box design. I do like to have physical product as well. Downloads don't do it for me.

Like my handsome young friend, FredBlue, I eagerly await the sale of the unreleased Greg Penny EJ mixes. That would be HUGE! :yikes

 

[fredblue]

GBYBR was performed & recorded in 1973 on a 16 track tape machine. What was done here on my SACD, I consider to be absolutely spectacular. It sounds like it could rival any modern recording which is saying quite a lot. I don't notice any extra brightness and my ears are pretty sharp.(its my brain that most people worry about...)

Frankly I am getting tired of voting ten, but this is a ten to me. GBYBR and Capt. Fantastic are absolute must have recordings for any 5.1 listener.

My only gripe is with the SACD format which allows no art. I forget why I bought the SACD instead of the DVD-Audio. Did the SACD come out first? I forget...
I do LOVE the wonderful 4 page foldout box design. I do like to have physical product as well. Downloads don't do it for me.

Like my handsome young friend, FredBlue, I eagerly await the sale of the unreleased Greg Penny EJ mixes. That would be HUGE! :yikes

the SACD came before the DVDA ('03 SACD, '04 DVDA)

but did the chicken come before the egg?

either way I liked them so much I gave them all 1's! (oh no that wasn't me, I gave them all 10's!)

 

[DennisMoore Jr.]

the SACD came before the DVDA ('03 SACD, '04 DVDA)

Yes, I remember now. The DVD-Audio wasn't announced when the SACD came out, so I jumped on it. No way in hell I would miss the chance of owning Funeral For A Friend in 5.1.
Did the DVD-A have the same nice 4-fold cardboard packaging & booklet?

 

[fredblue]

Yes, I remember now. The DVD-Audio wasn't announced when the SACD came out, so I jumped on it. No way in hell I would miss the chance of owning Funeral For A Friend in 5.1.
Did the DVD-A have the same nice 4-fold cardboard packaging & booklet?

the DVD-A came in the usual oversized super jewel case I still gave it a 10! I think the BDA will have to go to 11

 

[DennisMoore Jr.]

the DVD-A came in the usual oversized super jewel case I still gave it a 10! I think the BDA will have to go to 11

Oh Dear, I do like the very classy 4-fold paper card version, just like the ELP & Tarkus issues. Kinda like a mini LP.

About voting "11" maybe you have something there. A rare few of my 5.1 discs I would actually classify as elevens. Capt Fantastic, ELP & Tarkus by SW...
Perhaps we should talk to Jon bout that.. naw... there would be no end, somebody else would suggest we add a "12" in the voting section. @:

 

[fredblue]

Oh Dear, I do like the very classy 4-fold paper card version, just like the ELP & Tarkus issues. Kinda like a mini LP.

About voting "11" maybe you have something there. A rare few of my 5.1 discs I would actually classify as elevens. Capt Fantastic, ELP & Tarkus by SW...
Perhaps we should talk to Jon bout that.. naw... there would be no end, somebody else would suggest we add a "12" in the voting section. @:

the GYBR 2003 SACD packaging was very nice.. I only had one gripe, the needless (and cheap and nasty-looking) reworked graphics accompanying the lyrics (look at the naff CG typefaces and stuff used.. is that really the best they could do?!).

as for 11's & 12's, I'm hoping to give Captain Fantastic a 12 when it gets re-released on Blu-ray.. only so long as it comes with all the bonuses intact (including House Of Cards in 5.1.. come on!) and features the same apparent lack of mastering the 5.1 of the new GYBR Blu has.

now just what do I mean by this?

well, I have a theory on the differences I have picked up on between the old SACD/DVDA and the new Blu.. in a nutshell, what we got on the SACD/DVDA was a futzed with (treble boosted and rear channel volume boosted) version of Greg's 5.1 mix and the Blu-ray is Greg's mix minus those rear channel level adjustments and brightness features/issues (*)

* delete as you feel applicable!

it may seem far-fetched or unlikely but put it this way, the GYBR SACD & DVDA (if my theory is proven to be correct) would not be the first example of a perfectly good 5.1 mix that's been screwed up by the time it made it to DVDA or SACD by hamfisted channel level adjustment and/or compression and dodgy EQ decisions made by others (i.e. not by the creator of the remix, in this case Greg Penny).

 

[Bender]

well, I have a theory on the differences I have picked up on between the old SACD/DVDA and the new Blu.. in a nutshell, what we got on the SACD/DVDA was a futzed with (treble boosted and rear channel volume boosted) version of Greg's 5.1 mix and the Blu-ray is Greg's mix minus those rear channel level adjustments and brightness features/issues (*)

* delete as you feel applicable!

it may seem far-fetched or unlikely but put it this way, the GYBR SACD & DVDA (if my theory is proven to be correct) would not be the first example of a perfectly good 5.1 mix that's been screwed up by the time it made it to DVDA or SACD by hamfisted channel level adjustment and/or compression and dodgy EQ decisions made by others (i.e. not by the creator of the remix, in this case Greg Penny).

OK, Fredblue,

I am going to defer to you on all things Elton. In case I missed it somewhere, how do you rank the 5.1 sound of the BLU, DVD, and SACD? (I have the SACD and DVD and 99% of my concerns are sound only! I generally don't care if the issue includes posters of Dee and Nigel or whatever, it's cool, but I really care most about the music, 99% of that is the 5.1 mix, to me it totally opens stuff up).

I would really love your rank, and if possible note any key differences.

Bender

 

[fredblue]

OK, Fredblue,

I am going to defer to you on all things Elton. In case I missed it somewhere, how do you rank the 5.1 sound of the BLU, DVD, and SACD? (I have the SACD and DVD and 99% of my concerns are sound only! I generally don't care if the issue includes posters of Dee and Nigel or whatever, it's cool, but I really care most about the music, 99% of that is the 5.1 mix, to me it totally opens stuff up).

I would really love your rank, and if possible note any key differences.

Bender

Hi Bender,

between me posting in this thread and you posting here just now, QQ member steelydave has posted in another EJ GYBR thread a very comprehensive set of results of his analysis of the 5.1 including comparisons of waveforms, Dynamic range info, etc of the new Blu-ray & old SACD.

Well worth your while checking out everything steelydave has posted to help you and everyone else here who is interested make a seriously informed decision whether to buy the Blu or not.

personally I think the Blu sounds great in both stereo and surround..

on the one hand I'm blatantly biased because of the material and who its by..

on the other hand, scrap all that!

regardless of what it is and who its by, I really cannot abide a good number of abysmal masterings of this album (Gus' 95 remaster, the Hybrid SACD Stereo chief among them, they are worse than awful) I have many many years of hardcore listening to this album in both surround and especially stereo and really I'm very pleased with this disc on its own merits, it does a very good job of acquitting itself to just about every other version going. nit-picking the 80's DJM CD sounds more like the LP, which I love but the new Blu is a different, smoother somehow presentation but no less engaging and enjoyable.

the stereo sounds much better than any DR would suggest (I've seen other analysis over at the SHF that the Blu stereo is identical to the CD, only the CD shows lots of clipping that the BD doesn't).. so how they can be truly identical I don't know.. I shall defer that to the technically minded QQ-ers, I just know what I hear -- and both the 2014 CD and BD in Stereo and the Surround SACD and 5.1 BDA certainly sound different on my gear, in my house, to my ears -- and I prefer the BD by quite some margin in both respects.

 

[Perp]

The half-speed mastered LP is Direct Disk Labs. I also believe the Mofi Gold CD is the best stereo master. It IS better than the half-speed. I've owned six copies of this album. Although the Mofi is the best stereo, I'd rather listen to the 5.1 SACD.

Tumbleweed is still my favorite, but I ask you, how many artists have ever made an album this good, even on a single disc?

Every time I play this, I'm in awe. An album I need to listen to more often, even though I've heard it thousands of times.

Come over and see me, come over and please me. Alice, it's my turn today!

Linda, I love you.

Will you two get a room, already?!

 

[Snood]

I rated it a 9...........pretty close to a 9.5

But........

I thought the mix for Capt Fantastic was a wee bit better on the drums and total surround.

Thoroughly enjoyed the DVD-A and have brought it out a couple times in the past few weeks..........even though the number of well known songs on it are numerous compared to Capt., not including the bonus tracks on Capt which are amazing too. I had never heard the Capt album before Fredblue made me buy it (kidding)........I was pretty much awed by it.

This one was Super Great but not in the fashion of Capt.

 

[Perp]

I had never heard the Capt album before Fredblue made me buy it (kidding)........I was pretty much awed by it.

He's pretty good at that! LOL

 

[Perp]

So, last night, I whipped out my SACD copy of GBYBR to have a listen. I have not played it for a couple of years and have newer speakers. I was playing the disc loud and what I noticed right off during the first track which carried all the way through to the end of disc one is how loud my side/rear speakers were. And I use room correction! When I get a chance, I'm going to have to check my other EJ discs to see/hear if all of them are mixed this way. I feel the mix to the rear speakers are way to loud. At times, they almost sound louder than the front speakers. Also, I noticed I never voted on this disc and still haven't voted on many discs.@:

 

[PK]

I had never heard the Capt album before Fredblue made me buy it (kidding)........

I hear ya. Fredblue is burning a hole in my pocket :howl but my ears are really happy

 

[keenly]

Mix is a 10, mastering is a 5. TOO much compression. Victim of the stupid loudness wars.