List of Best (Most Recommended) Classical Music in Surround Sound

[kap'n krunch]

I'd dare to list this Berliner Philarmoniker / Simon Rattle Beethoven Symphonies Box set , which, I think is VERY well priced considering you get 5 CDs and 1 BD in 96/24 MCH and Stereo (along with 2 BDs of the video performances although with inferior sample rate)
BUT
you also get this handy peeler
...ehem,
Downloads in
Stereo AND MCH in
96/24
AND
192/24
FLAC AND WAV!!!

Also includes a very nice and in depth view of the recordings and their history---

For 69 EUROS!!!!

 

[JonUrban]

Don't forget the great "Crossover Quintett" from QuadroSurround!!

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...-Quadro-Surround-goes-Classical-It-s-a-WINNER!!!!

 

[skherbeck]

Can anyone recommend a "Wagner Greatest Hits" with good, discrete surround action?

 

[ubertrout]

Can anyone recommend a "Wagner Greatest Hits" with good, discrete surround action?

It's not that discrete (more hall surround than active surround), but Neeme Jarvi did a few such albums for Chandos



Also:

 

[skherbeck]

Thought I'd rate the "discreteness" of some classical albums I've been listening to this week:

Discretely Mixed:

Vivaldi - The Four Seasons SACD (Zukerman/The English Chamber Orchestra/Dutton Epoch)- Discrete throughout, and excellent music that even the most casual classical fan will recognize. Highly recommended for surround fans!!
Swingle Singers SACD (Dutton Vocalion)- Famous classical music done vocally in glorious discrete surround sound. Ahhh....

Wide Soundstage Mix (Audible activity in the rears creating a room-filling mix, but not (much) identifiably discrete rear activity... these sound excellent, just not very discrete):

Berloiz - Symphonie Fantastique SACD (Ozawa/Boston Symphony Orchestra/Pentatone)- I almost classified this as discrete... excellent, room-filling mix. Theme from Kubrick's "The Shining".
Vivaldi - 8 Concerti Per Violino SACD (Accardo/I Musici/Pentatone)- My favorite of my Vivaldi discs... the music is very emotional, and the limited instrumentation highlights the virtuosity of the musicians. Every song made my classical playlist.
Mussorgsky - Pictures At An Exhibition SACD (Ponti/Russian National Orchestra/Pentatone) - Another one where every song made my playlist... GREAT for casual classical fans...you'll recognize it!... Night on Bald Mountain (Fantasia anyone?)
Vivaldi - La Stravaganza SACD (Rachel Podger/Channel Classics)- Excellent fidelity and very wide soundstage (but not discrete). I prefer "8 Concerti Per Violino".
Vivaldi - L' Estro Armonico op. 3 (Vol I & II) DVD-A - Sounds great.
Bach - Ouvertures SACD (Suzuki/Bach Collegium Japan/BIS)- Less "room-filling" mix than the above discs, but slightly more than ambiance. Overture III is essential classical (you'll know "Air")

Ambiance Mixes ("Is there anything going on back there?"):

Bach - Brandenburg Concertos SACD (Zukerman/Los Angeles Philharmonic/Pentatone)- Essential classical; great performances. Think I might check out the Tacet version.
Copland - Rodeo/Dance Panels BD-A (Slatkin/Detroit Symphony Orchestra/Naxos)- Great music... think "Beef... It's what's for dinner". I heard the Bernstein version is the go-to for Copland (but from 3 channel source)

Not sure how to classify this one:

Tchaikovsky 1812 Overture SACD (Kunzel/Cincinnati Pops Orchestra/Telarc)- The cannons are discretely heard coming from various (including the rear) speakers; otherwise this is an ambiance mix. BEWARE: the cannons are WAY too loud! If you adjust your volume to handle the cannons "safely", the music will be irritatingly soft. If you turn up the music to an enjoyable level, your speakers may be damaged! My only disc with TOO MUCH Dynamic Range.

Your results may vary.

 

[ubertrout]

Thought I'd rate the "discreteness" of some classical albums I've been listening to this week:

Discretely Mixed:

Vivaldi - The Four Seasons SACD (Zukerman/The English Chamber Orchestra/Dutton Epoch)- Discrete throughout, and excellent music that even the most casual classical fan will recognize. Highly recommended for surround fans!!
Swingle Singers SACD (Dutton Vocalion)- Famous classical music done vocally in glorious discrete surround sound. Ahhh....

Wide Soundstage Mix (Audible activity in the rears creating a room-filling mix, but not (much) identifiably discrete rear activity... these sound excellent, just not very discrete):

Berloiz - Symphonie Fantastique SACD (Ozawa/Boston Symphony Orchestra/Pentatone)- I almost classified this as discrete... excellent, room-filling mix. Theme from Kubrick's "The Shining".
Vivaldi - 8 Concerti Per Violino SACD (Accardo/I Musici/Pentatone)- My favorite of my Vivaldi discs... the music is very emotional, and the limited instrumentation highlights the virtuosity of the musicians. Every song made my classical playlist.
Mussorgsky - Pictures At An Exhibition SACD (Ponti/Russian National Orchestra/Pentatone) - Another one where every song made my playlist... GREAT for casual classical fans...you'll recognize it!... Night on Bald Mountain (Fantasia anyone?)
Vivaldi - La Stravaganza SACD (Rachel Podger/Channel Classics)- Excellent fidelity and very wide soundstage (but not discrete). I prefer "8 Concerti Per Violino".
Vivaldi - L' Estro Armonico op. 3 (Vol I & II) DVD-A - Sounds great.
Bach - Ouvertures SACD (Suzuki/Bach Collegium Japan/BIS)- Less "room-filling" mix than the above discs, but slightly more than ambiance. Overture III is essential classical (you'll know "Air")

Ambiance Mixes ("Is there anything going on back there?"):

Bach - Brandenburg Concertos SACD (Zukerman/Los Angeles Philharmonic/Pentatone)- Essential classical; great performances. Think I might check out the Tacet version.
Copland - Rodeo/Dance Panels BD-A (Slatkin/Detroit Symphony Orchestra/Naxos)- Great music... think "Beef... It's what's for dinner". I heard the Bernstein version is the go-to for Copland (but from 3 channel source)

Not sure how to classify this one:

Tchaikovsky 1812 Overture SACD (Kunzel/Cincinnati Pops Orchestra/Telarc)- The cannons are discretely heard coming from various (including the rear) speakers; otherwise this is an ambiance mix. BEWARE: the cannons are WAY too loud! If you adjust your volume to handle the cannons "safely", the music will be irritatingly soft. If you turn up the music to an enjoyable level, your speakers may be damaged! My only disc with TOO MUCH Dynamic Range.

Your results may vary.

As you're discovering, a lot of the classical surround issues out there just use the surround channels to create more of a hall ambiance. The classic way to do this is to mount two mics further back, to essentially pick up the reverberation of the sound in the hall. This isn't as much fun as a discrete MC mix, but it's a major improvement over a standard stereo one.

However, in terms of discrete mixes, there are really two types IMO. There's the "always on" discrete mix, which characterizes Tacet and some of the old Columbia quads, and the "offstage instruments" mix, that uses the surround channels for ambience, except when the score calls for instruments to play from elsewhere in the hall. This might be controversial, but I find some of the Tacet mixes almost distractingly busy...it's nothing like hearing a concert live, but instead feels like being in the middle of the piece - cool but not natural perspective. On the other hand, mixes that use the surround channels for instruments that would otherwise get lost in the shuffle, or reserve them for offstage instruments, are the most effective imo.

The classic example of such a piece is the Berlioz Requiem, which calls for four brass choirs in four corners of the church during one of the movements - any surround issue of this piece should use the surround elements to depict this in a way stereo just can't - something the Colin Davis quad recording (Pentatone) does not. The Abravanel quad recording (on SACD from Vanguard or DVD-A from Classic Records) does properly use the four channels. Another piece that uses offstage instruments really effectively is Respighi's popular Pines of Rome. I never knew there were offstage instruments in the finale until I heard it live, and the effect was amazing. The BIS recording (Neschling conducting) uses the surround channels for these offstage instruments, something they credited the fans on the internet for pushing them to do.

I'm still waiting for a Mahler 2 that puts the offstage instruments from the final movement into the surrounds. I know in some configurations they're supposed to sound distant, so they put them in a hallway and into the fronts, but I've heard the piece live with the offstage instruments in the rear balcony (I believe NY Philharmonic) and the effect is mesmerizing - I'd love to replicate it at home.

 

[skherbeck]

As you're discovering, a lot of the classical surround issues out there just use the surround channels to create more of a hall ambiance. The classic way to do this is to mount two mics further back, to essentially pick up the reverberation of the sound in the hall. This isn't as much fun as a discrete MC mix, but it's a major improvement over a standard stereo one.

However, in terms of discrete mixes, there are really two types IMO. There's the "always on" discrete mix, which characterizes Tacet and some of the old Columbia quads, and the "offstage instruments" mix, that uses the surround channels for ambience, except when the score calls for instruments to play from elsewhere in the hall. This might be controversial, but I find some of the Tacet mixes almost distractingly busy...it's nothing like hearing a concert live, but instead feels like being in the middle of the piece - cool but not natural perspective. On the other hand, mixes that use the surround channels for instruments that would otherwise get lost in the shuffle, or reserve them for offstage instruments, are the most effective imo.

The classic example of such a piece is the Berlioz Requiem, which calls for four brass choirs in four corners of the church during one of the movements - any surround issue of this piece should use the surround elements to depict this in a way stereo just can't - something the Colin Davis quad recording (Pentatone) does not. The Abravanel quad recording (on SACD from Vanguard or DVD-A from Classic Records) does properly use the four channels. Another piece that uses offstage instruments really effectively is Respighi's popular Pines of Rome. I never knew there were offstage instruments in the finale until I heard it live, and the effect was amazing. The BIS recording (Neschling conducting) uses the surround channels for these offstage instruments, something they credited the fans on the internet for pushing them to do.

I'm still waiting for a Mahler 2 that puts the offstage instruments from the final movement into the surrounds. I know in some configurations they're supposed to sound distant, so they put them in a hallway and into the fronts, but I've heard the piece live with the offstage instruments in the rear balcony (I believe NY Philharmonic) and the effect is mesmerizing - I'd love to replicate it at home.

Wow! The Abravanel version of Requiem is really discrete!!! Listening to the second part right now... as I was being lulled to sleep by the excellent choir, discrete horns started coming at me from all around... thanks for the recommendation

 

[ubertrout]

Wow! The Abravanel version of Requiem is really discrete!!! Listening to the second part right now... as I was being lulled to sleep by the excellent choir, discrete horns started coming at me from all around... thanks for the recommendation

That's exactly what Berlioz intended when he wrote it 180 years ago - a quadraphonic surge of energy. So cool to be able to get it at home. There's a partial list of other such pieces here, not sure about discrete versions of most of them, though: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offstage_instrument_or_choir_part_in_classical_music

 

[MCDave]

I usually prefer a very discrete mix that surrounds the listener with instruments, but for orchestras and chamber ensembles of more than 8 musicians, this just doesn't work for me. I think ambience in the rears is the only "right" way to mix those cases. I've wondered how I might like a string quartet with one instrument in each speaker, or a piano quintet with the piano occupying the center channel. I haven't found a recording like that yet, and probably won't, but it could be fun.

Speaking of brass, the Berlin Brass's "Berliner Dom - Music for Brass and Organ" is a wonderful collection of Gabrieli's works on a Pentatone SACD, and it has the most reverberant sound I've ever heard, either recorded or live. The performances were recorded inside a gigantic domed cathedral (Berliner Dom, the largest protestant church in Germany), with as many as 33 brass pieces playing with organ accompaniment, and the reverb takes more than 10 seconds to dissipate after they stop playing. It's extraordinary. Unfortunately, it can also be a muddy mess at times, as the musicians play over their strong echoes.

This is it - http://www.hraudio.net/showmusic.php?title=9043

 

[Kal Rubinson]

I usually prefer a very discrete mix that surrounds the listener with instruments, but for orchestras and chamber ensembles of more than 8 musicians, this just doesn't work for me. I think ambience in the rears is the only "right" way to mix those cases. I've wondered how I might like a string quartet with one instrument in each speaker, or a piano quintet with the piano occupying the center channel. I haven't found a recording like that yet, and probably won't, but it could be fun.

Try this one. You can get whiplash from the Scherzo.

 

[MCDave]

Thanks Kal, I'll give that a go.

 

[skherbeck]

Orff - Carmina Burana SACD (Runnicles/ Atlanta Symphony Orchestra and Chorus/ Telarc Surround)

The aging King Arthur, his strength and spirit reborn after partaking from the Grail, rides forth determinedly with the last of his knights of the round table for one last epic battle, their silver armour sparkling in the early spring sun, cherry blossoms showering them like confetti, and the triumphant music of Orff's "O Fortuna" setting the stage. This scene from Excalibur has been a part of my DNA since I was 12, so you can imagine my joy discovering a version of the music in high definition with a DISCRETE surround mix!

I have to confess, I first heard this as an SACD rip I found on the internet and downloaded, but it was so good I had to own it, and today my copy arrived from ebay!:banana:

The music is beautiful throughout, a mixture of group choruses and orchestral music... I've bought many classical discs, most of them only having a few or even one piece of music that I listen to, but this one is enjoyable to the end. And the mix is discrete (not mind blowing, but great as far as classical surround mixes go). Highly recommended!

 

[MCDave]

Excalibur is one of my favorite movies. Great music, and the over the top acting is a hoot!

 

[ubertrout]

@fredblue (I believe) asked on another thread what the discrete Pentatone Quad issues were. This seems the logical place to continue this discussion, and to be worth expanding beyond just Pentatone, since the question seems to come up a lot - so let's make this a clearinghouse of sorts for that question. A few that come to mind to start, some of which were mentioned above.

Pentatone: Ozawa Conducts Berlioz (Symphonie Fantastique and Damnation of Faust) and Ravel, and Bernstein conducts Carmen. Also Les Percussions de Strasbourg: East Meets West (Philips recording of avant-garde percussion music using all four channels).
Channel: Rachmaninoff - Vocalise (coupled with his 2nd Symphony, but only the Vocalise is recorded in "conductor perspective")
BIS: Respighi - Pines of Rome (Neschling/OSEP), Aho: Symphony No.12 ´Luosto´

 

[humprof]

@fredblue (I believe) asked on another thread what the discrete Pentatone Quad issues were. This seems the logical place to continue this discussion, and to be worth expanding beyond just Pentatone, since the question seems to come up a lot - so let's make this a clearinghouse of sorts for that question. A few that come to mind to start, some of which were mentioned above.

Pentatone: Ozawa Conducts Berlioz (Symphonie Fantastique and Damnation of Faust) and Ravel, and Bernstein conducts Carmen. Also Les Percussions de Strasbourg: East Meets West (Philips recording of avant-garde percussion music using all four channels).
Channel: Rachmaninoff - Vocalise (coupled with his 2nd Symphony, but only the Vocalise is recorded in "conductor perspective")
BIS: Respighi - Pines of Rome (Neschling/OSEP), Aho: Symphony No.12 ´Luosto´

I'd be willing to compile a spreadsheet on this, if there's interest. (Is there anywhere such a document can "live" on QQ...?)

 

[sjcorne]

Not really a big classical listener, but that "Pulnicella" disc released by D-V is incredible. You can clearly hear different string parts in each corner, but there's still some ambience/bleed between the channels. It was probably a mess in SQ, but the discrete mix with perfect fidelity on SACD is breathtaking.

I've also always been a big fan of that "Boulez Conducts Bartok: Concerto For Orchestra" album that was mic'd and recorded for quad. I recently (finally!) found a Q8 so I'll be able to hear what that one was actually intended to sound like. Though of course now that I have the tape D-V will announce an SACD of that one

 

[4-earredwonder]

Not really a big classical listener, but that "Pulnicella" disc released by D-V is incredible. You can clearly hear different string parts in each corner, but there's still some ambience/bleed between the channels. It was probably a mess in SQ, but the discrete mix with perfect fidelity on SACD is breathtaking.

I've also always been a big fan of that "Boulez Conducts Bartok: Concerto For Orchestra" album that was mic'd and recorded for quad. I recently (finally!) found a Q8 so I'll be able to hear what that one was actually intended to sound like. Though of course now that I have the tape D-V will announce an SACD of that one

Sjcorne, you might enjoy this one as well. Excellent and very discrete: https://www.duttonvocalion.co.uk/proddetail.php?prod=CDLX7334

 

[ubertrout]

Not really a big classical listener, but that "Pulnicella" disc released by D-V is incredible. You can clearly hear different string parts in each corner, but there's still some ambience/bleed between the channels. It was probably a mess in SQ, but the discrete mix with perfect fidelity on SACD is breathtaking.

I've also always been a big fan of that "Boulez Conducts Bartok: Concerto For Orchestra" album that was mic'd and recorded for quad. I recently (finally!) found a Q8 so I'll be able to hear what that one was actually intended to sound like. Though of course now that I have the tape D-V will announce an SACD of that one

The Pulcinella/Petrushka combo is one of the best D-V releases - there's a great review of just the stereo layer here: https://www.davidsclassicalcds.com/...-of-old-cbs-stravinsky-recordings-from-boulez

I'd really like Boulez's recording of the complete Firebird as well. Boulez's complete recordings of Stravinsky from the beginnings of his career as a conductor were released as part of a 3-CD set recently: https://www.amazon.com/Pierre-Conducts-Stravinsky-Symphony-Orchestra/dp/B0748J86QZ/. The D-V issue includes most everything except the complete Firebird, Firebird Suite, Rite of Spring, and Suites for Small Orchestra. I believe everything was mixed to quad - https://www.discogs.com/Boulez-Cond...hka-1911-Firebird-Suite-1910/release/12663218 has the Firebird Suite and Rite of Spring, while https://www.discogs.com/Boulez-Cond...omplete-Original-1910-Version/release/6338369 has the complete Firebird.

Given that the superb 1969 recording of the Rite was only released in quad for Japan, I do wonder if the quad mix is going to be as engaging. It's also still in print as a Japanese single-layer stereo SACD (the very first such Japan-only classical release, as I recall).

 

[humprof]

@fredblue (I believe) asked on another thread what the discrete Pentatone Quad issues were. This seems the logical place to continue this discussion, and to be worth expanding beyond just Pentatone, since the question seems to come up a lot - so let's make this a clearinghouse of sorts for that question. A few that come to mind to start, some of which were mentioned above.

Pentatone: Ozawa Conducts Berlioz (Symphonie Fantastique and Damnation of Faust) and Ravel, and Bernstein conducts Carmen. Also Les Percussions de Strasbourg: East Meets West (Philips recording of avant-garde percussion music using all four channels).
Channel: Rachmaninoff - Vocalise (coupled with his 2nd Symphony, but only the Vocalise is recorded in "conductor perspective")
BIS: Respighi - Pines of Rome (Neschling/OSEP), Aho: Symphony No.12 ´Luosto´

Others (which have been mentioned before):

Haydn, Mass in Time of War (Bernstein/NYPO, Dutton)
Holst, The Planets & Strauss, Zarathustra (Steinberg/BSO, DG)
Mahler 1st/Brahms 4th (Levine/LSO/CSO, Dutton)
Prokofiev, Alexander Nevsky (Ormandy/PSO, Dutton)
Ravel, Orchestral Works (Ozawa/BSO, Dutton)

[Still working on a draft spreadsheet of discrete classical recordings, by the way. Keep 'em coming! Comments and corrections welcome.]

 

[4-earredwonder]

A Few More Discrete Classical Titles:

Mixed by Thomas Mowrey

Additionally, the TACET label is renowned for their moving surround Classical releases: https://www.hraudio.net/search.php?format=0&keywords=tacet

For point of reference, before their switch to SACD, Tacet did produce a number of fine sounding MLP DVD~A discs.