DVD/DTS Poll Opeth - Deliverance (Bruce Soord 5.1 Mix) [DTS 96/24 5.1 DVD]

[Bob Romano]

Please post your thoughts and comments on this DVD release containing a DTS 5.1 surround mix mixed Bruce Soord.

Please rate Deliverance separately from Damnation.

 

[rtbluray]

It's too bad that both discs are together in one poll as they are not created equal from a mix standpoint and certainly not from a content standpoint, so I had to average my two votes together into a vote of 7.5, but since the poll doesn't have half-point options, I am being generous and rounding my vote up to an '8', breaking down my vote this way:

Content: 2/3
Surround Mix: 3/3
Fidelity: 3/3
High-Res Disc: 0/1

I'm pasting my comments below from the other "Deliverance"/"Damnation" thread:

I just finished my first full listen-through to "Deliverance" in surround, and were there a poll to vote on it, I would give it a '6' and breakdown my vote as such:

Content: 1/3 ("A Fair Judgment" being the only really good standout track on this album)
Surround Mix: 2/3 (The best Opeth metal surround mix for sure but plagued by a small annoyance, which I will expand on below)
Fidelity: 3/3 (This mix definitely doesn't sound crushed to death compared to the Jens Borgen mixes)
High-Res Disc: 0/1 (Speaks for itself)

I give Bruce Soord a lot of credit for making this album sound the best it has ever sounded, but that still can't make up for the overdriven and lackluster metal tracks that permeate a lot of this album. I did want to give the surround mix aspect of this disc a 3/3, but I just couldn't bring myself to do it given the unusual mixing of the toms. It's just too strange to have some resonate in the front while others resonate in the surrounds, giving it a very disjointed and uneven sound.

I have also listened to all of "Damnation" in surround, and I would give that disc a vote of '9', breaking down my vote this way:

Content: 3/3 (Some really beautiful and fantastic songs on this album)
Surround Mix: 3/3 (A nice discrete mix that fits the album very well)
Fidelity: 3/3 (Gone are the distortions present in the original stereo master and instead we are presented with a clean and dynamic sound. Love it!)
High-Res disc: 0/1 ('Nuff said)

It's too bad that both albums are sold together as I would recommend picking up "Damnation" in a heartbeat were it available on its own in surround.
However, if you really want that disc bad enough (and can even stomach your way through a little bit of metal too) pick up this set.

 

[Bob Romano]

I have now split the discs into two polls

 

[perzon57]

Hello
I don't think this is the right thing to do.These albums was supposed to be released as one release back then,but it did not happen. When they now are released as one I think they should be judged as one too....


Regards

 

[perzon57]

Well,I Really like this set,both the music and the mixes.Gave it 9.:music

 

[edisonbaggins]

I can understand why the albums were split - different surround mix engineers - VERY different mixing approaches.
Seeing as how I like Ghost Reveries just fine (despite its lack of discreteness), I think I'm gonna be ok.
Just hoping Santa comes through with this one, come Dec. 25th...

 

[rtbluray]

I completely agree with Mr Baggins that the polls for these discs should be separate, and I'm glad they now are, even though it meant that it now looks like I rated "Deliverance" on its own higher than I really did. Oh well, at least now I can give "Damnation" its proper due in the other poll thread.

 

[keenly]

I gave this a 6, but is really deserved a 4 for how Bruce butchered the rhythm guitars. Real let down. I am immensely frustrated with this.

 

[Nimbatus]

I gave this a 6, but is really deserved a 4 for how Bruce butchered the rhythm guitars. Real let down. I am immensely frustrated with this.

I totally agree. Opeth is very much guitar driven music. The riffs are one of the most important part and really define the sound of Opeth, at least while they were still a death metal band. This album has to sound HEAVY! Only the mellow parts work for me and seem to be an improvement.

I also gave this 6 points, but I'd rather change that to a 4 or 5. What a missed opportunity this is.

 

[keenly]

I totally agree. Opeth is very much guitar driven music. The riffs are one of the most important part and really define the sound of Opeth, at least while they were still a death metal band. This album has to sound HEAVY! Only the mellow parts work for me and seem to be an improvement.

I also gave this 6 points, but I'd rather change that to a 4 or 5. What a missed opportunity this is.

For me this is the greatest metal album to be mixed in 5.1, thus I am very disappointed. If a Madonna album was released in 5.1, and had a poor mix, I would not care. Deliverance was not a poor recording to begin with. The original Swedish vinyl sounds dynamic, wide open, crystal clear, boy do I wish this did too! Jens would have nailed this.

I initially stated I hope Bruce mixes the rest of Opeth's earlier catalog, I take this back. I am waiting to hear SW tackle some heavy metal, death metal even better. He could do wonders with the drums for a start, although Bruce did some nice stuff with rolls in rears.

I am sure many on here would go ape shit if their fav album got mixed in surround, then turned out to be poor. Just look at the complaints of ELP's BSS done by Jakko, and that is nowhere near as bad as this. Rhythm guitars put into the background? Madness, I tell thee. Surely there must have been a mistake?

 

[Ge Someone]

I started to like this album. The title track is epic.
My gripe has to be the mastering, I don't like it. Still an 8 for this disc of the release.

 

[paligap]

I knew I would like this album much less than Damnation; I'm just not a fan of the growling and speed drums, or whatever the term is. I doubt the content will grow on me, although I liked tracks 3 and 4 and some of track 6. The mix isn't SW-good, but I didn't notice any glaring problems. The cheap packaging also led to scuff marks on the dvd. I give this one a 6.

 

[von kulper]

Thought I'd chime in on this one:

This is certainly a polarizing mix... It seems that hardcore fans of Deliverance have some real qualms with the mix, while people who are indifferent to this album, or outright dislike death metal, have responded a bit more warmly. I tend to fall in to the latter category.

Now, in no-way would I consider myself a sort-of, "casual, clean vocals only" Opeth fan; I LOVE Ghost Reveries, and am very fond of Still Life, Blackwater Park, and Watershed. But everything on Deliverance has always just blended together for me and has always felt monotonous (with the exception of "A Fair Judgement" - one of my absolute favorites, and "For Absent Friends," which I think is an excellent little transitional piece). As for the rest of it - too few quiet or clean parts to add some dynamic contrast throughout; too few melodic vocals - just a brutal attack on the senses. Of the post-Blackwater Park Opeth, Deliverance is my least favorite...

With that said, this is one release that has me feeling a little conflicted. I think Keenly, and a few others, have voiced some valid concerns regarding some of the mixing choices, and the overall mastering, and I can certainly understand their disappointment. I agree that something seems a little off with some of the heavy sections, like maybe the guitars are lacking some oomph. But I do think that the pros outweigh the cons...

With Soord's surround mix I can say that for once, I can enjoy listening to this in its entirety, despite its flaws. And that's probably the best thing I can say about it. I think A Fair Judgement, and the clean sections throughout, sound absolutely phenomenal, while the heavier sections, although a little anemic, keep a lot of things going on in the surround fields, and keeps things interesting. And personally, I like the approach of the drum mix.

So, this pretty much sums up my feelings: Could this have been better? Absolutely. But for me, this has been an improvement over the standard stereo mix, at least with regards to my overall enjoyment. I went with a 7 on this. And I would recommend a purchase based on the strength of "A Fair Judgement," alone (and of course, the included Damnation album...)

 

[edisonbaggins]

I could just copy/paste Von kulper's post...

 

[edisonbaggins]

Better on 2nd listen...

 

[edisonbaggins]

'Bout the same on 3rd listen...
lol
**This is at its best at volume - between -14 and -12db much of the guitar/drums/vocal balance evens out, to my ears.
At that point, the toms pop a bit from the rears, but that is no biggie to me. Might bug some.
Anyway, Baggy's advice is to pump this muther hard. The louder the better.**

 

[skherbeck]

This is a great prog metal album filled with a dynamic mix of heavy & mellow elements, light & dark passages, and growls & clean vocals. From a content standpoint, I find this disc much more enjoyable than Damnation (which, while I love it, suffers slightly from a "sameness" throughout the album). Regarding the mix, I guess I'm in the minority here: I think Bruce did an excellent job... There are various rhythm and solo guitar elements and background vocals coming discretely from the rears and the guitars in general have plenty of punch to my ears. Also, I really enjoy the way the drum fills/toms wrap around me in the surrounds... if only the drums had been mixed the same way on the Rush surround mixes! The fidelity is generally good, although there is some mild compression and distorted-sounding cymbals audible at times (at least that's what it sounds like to me... I haven't looked at any waveforms). Overall I was quite surprised at how good this sounds after reading the other lack luster reviews... Highly recommended for metal fans! 9.

 

[Thonolan]

A solid 8 for me. I love this album. It's a bit of a hit & miss at times, but contains some of the very best moments of the whole Opeth discography.

I was tempted to give the album a 9, but I sort of agree with some of the issues that both Keenly and Nimbatus commented. However, I found out that the mix sounded weird to my ears during the first listen because Bruce Soord's mixing approach was totally new to me back then. Had to experiment a little bit with speaker levels and now it sounds balanced & very satisfying overall. Honestly I really like how it sounds now, especially when played loud! I recall being mighty impressed during the 3rd listen.

I still enjoy Andy Sneap's stereo mix though, but the surround mix is definitely an improvement. I like the way Soord placed the drums because it's exactly how I would do it myself, and they sound great, except for the bass drum which is a bit weak and muddy. Clean vocals and acoustic/soft parts sound much better now. Heavier sections (regarding the mix) are an acquired taste I guess. Some I really like, others not that much - I think Andy Sneap is very good at mixing heavy stuff, and he nailed it on the stereo. But generally it sounds good to me.

There's only one specific part I dislike: I don't get why Bruce decided to place the first Deliverance guitar solo on the rears. It seems unnatural.