Pentatone 2016 Remastered Classics Quad SACDs planned releases

[luketsu]

I'm a bit confused...have you spoken to the Pentatone folks about a change in their plans, or is this just from reading their public site? They just released the Boston Symphony / Bartok SACD, and I'm looking forward to hearing it when it arrives. It's giving an error message on the Pentatone site, but it's showing in stock at retailers. Their release planning page shows that the next releases in the series are going to be at least most of the Kubelik Beethoven cycle (presumably to be completed), which will probably be collected into a box set later.

One of the things I've found about being a classical fan who listens in surround that you're so much better off being pleasantly surprised by what comes from Pentatone and others than you are trying to impose what releases you think they should be making. Pentatone changed over their management a few years ago when the Philips folks retired, and they've focused somewhat more on new recordings - but managed to get access to DG.

An expectation that Pentatone would be releasing 100 albums in the near future of remastered quads just doesn't seem realistic. You can call the clearance and licensing process that gets Pentatone access to the master tapes bullshit, but that won't get rid of a fairly complicated legal framework the music business operates in.

And it really seems like you're focused on Pentatone getting access to the titles DGG has kept in print as individual discs, even though that's the exact opposite of what we've actually gotten, which have mostly been titles that only got released on Eloquence or via box sets.

Put another way, the sky isn't falling, and the only real thing we can do is continue to support them. Pentatone knows they'd make a killing on the William Steinberg recording of the Planets, but perhaps Universal doesn't want to cannibalize sales of the 96khz transfer they offer at HDTracks, and there's not much we can do about it.

I have followed this series with great interest since it was launched in 2014. As soon as the first albums came out I purchased four of them (Beethoven/Eschenbach, Berlioz/Ozawa (Fantastique), Mozart/Vasary & Ravel/Ozawa). Speaking about quadraphonic sound I was very impressed what the recording engineers managed to capture back then and PENTATONE's carefully made remasterings (with Polyhymnia International BV) have brought a new lease of life to them.

I'm not a recording engineer - just a young musician who has found totally new way to listen to classical music through Super Audio CD. I have done cooperation with PENTATONE for almost ten months - most of their Spotify playlists from September 2016 to July 2017 are my selections.

The only thing what they told me was that "we definitely will release more albums in the future, there will be plenty of them". As we clearly know the Philips RQR Series contains more than 100 albums, including those 2016 newcomers. Therefore I assumed it would be possible to gather together equal amount of DG quad remasters in the years to come. I am just frustrated for this silence and uncertainty. They included Tchaikovsky's "Pique Dame" for the DG licensing wish list few years ago but the result is still covered with dust. I know most of these already released quad remasters have been available in stereo on Eloquence, Grand Pix or Originals.

Finally it's quite difficult to understand enthusiasm like this if classical music is not as great passion as it is for me. I can't live without classical music. I have found a new world where I can run if things goes badly. I have grown with the music of Sibelius, Grieg and Tchaikovsky. Just close your eyes and imagine. For instance Mahler's First Symphony tells a story between two lovers.

 

[ubertrout]

I have followed this series with great interest since it was launched in 2014. As soon as the first albums came out I purchased four of them (Beethoven/Eschenbach, Berlioz/Ozawa (Fantastique), Mozart/Vasary & Ravel/Ozawa). Speaking about quadraphonic sound I was very impressed what the recording engineers managed to capture back then and PENTATONE's carefully made remasterings (with Polyhymnia International BV) have brought a new lease of life to them.

I'm not a recording engineer - just a young musician who has found totally new way to listen to classical music through Super Audio CD. I have done cooperation with PENTATONE for almost ten months - most of their Spotify playlists from September 2016 to July 2017 are my selections.

The only thing what they told me was that "we definitely will release more albums in the future, there will be plenty of them". As we clearly know the Philips RQR Series contains more than 100 albums, including those 2016 newcomers. Therefore I assumed it would be possible to gather together equal amount of DG quad remasters in the years to come. I am just frustrated for this silence and uncertainty. They included Tchaikovsky's "Pique Dame" for the DG licensing wish list few years ago but the result is still covered with dust. I know most of these already released quad remasters have been available in stereo on Eloquence, Grand Pix or Originals.

Finally it's quite difficult to understand enthusiasm like this if classical music is not as great passion as it is for me. I can't live without classical music. I have found a new world where I can run if things goes badly. I have grown with the music of Sibelius, Grieg and Tchaikovsky. Just close your eyes and imagine. For instance Mahler's First Symphony tells a story between two lovers.

Right, but that catalog of now 111 quad SACDs took them fifteen years or so to build. Doing the math there were some rich years like 2014, and some leaner years. More would be nice, but that's no reason to think the sky is falling.

As for the silence and uncertainty, part of making a contract is keeping the negotiations secret - in all areas of business confidentiality is expected of the parties to a contract, and one party talking about the contents of the negotiations can often destroy the contract. It kind of sucks for those who want the results of said agreement, but it is what it is.

What I meant about Eloquence is that it's been Universal Australia's rarities label. By contrast almost nothing that's been released so far by Pentatone has been on Originals, which is DG's worldwide re-release label for their top recordings.

We're all here because we love the music. Otherwise, what a colossal waste of time this would be.

 

[bmoura]

As for the silence and uncertainty, part of making a contract is keeping the negotiations secret - in all areas of business confidentiality is expected of the parties to a contract, and one party talking about the contents of the negotiations can often destroy the contract. It kind of sucks for those who want the results of said agreement, but it is what it is.

And sometimes even the signing of a contract doesn't mean the reissue ends up being released.
The key is being patient and letting the players in the reissue process do their thing.

If you've seen some of the ups and downs of albums being licensed, prepared and then not hit release as I have, it could drive you wild.

 

[MCDave]

There are several relatively recent releases for sale on the Pentatone site, but nowhere else yet. How long does it usually take before these releases are available from 3rd party retailers?

 

[ubertrout]

Have you looked at European retailers like Prestoclassical?

 

[humprof]

The customer service folks at Presto once told me that there's a lag of several weeks before Pentatone releases are made available to them.

Have you looked at European retailers like Prestoclassical?

 

[MCDave]

Have you looked at European retailers like Prestoclassical?

Nope, this is the first I've heard of Prestoclassical. But Pentatone themselves ship from Europe, so I'm not sure what Prestoclassical can do for me unless they offer the releases at a discount. That's why I asked about 3rd party retailers - I'm hoping to get these for less than what Pentatone is offering. I like to buy from Amazon US, Elusive Disc, Music Direct and other places that have frequent sales and discounts, and low shipping prices. Just wondering how long it takes THOSE places to start shipping new Pentatone releases. Thanks though; I've bookmarked Prestoclassical.

The customer service folks at Presto once told me that there's a lag of several weeks before Pentatone releases are made available to them.

Seems about right. I'll keep an eye out.

 

[humprof]

I've bought at least six Pentatone titles from Presto in the past six months. They're always 3 or 4 dollars cheaper than anyone else, with quick shipping to the US.

Nope, this is the first I've heard of Prestoclassical. But Pentatone themselves ship from Europe, so I'm not sure what Prestoclassical can do for me unless they offer the releases at a discount. That's why I asked about 3rd party retailers - I'm hoping to get these for less than what Pentatone is offering. I like to buy from Amazon US, Elusive Disc, Music Direct and other places that have frequent sales and discounts, and low shipping prices. Just wondering how long it takes THOSE places to start shipping new Pentatone releases. Thanks though; I've bookmarked Prestoclassical.



Seems about right. I'll keep an eye out.

 

[bmoura]

There are several relatively recent releases for sale on the Pentatone site, but nowhere else yet. How long does it usually take before these releases are available from 3rd party retailers?

That's generally the case.

Pentatone has the SACDs available before release date on their web site.
And you often get to download the Stereo and Surround Sound DSD Music Files ahead of release date on NativeDSD Music.

The other sites get them on or after the release date.

 

[luketsu]

The first album to Beethoven/Kubelik bunch is now available for pre-order: https://www.pentatonemusic.com/beeethoven-symphonies-lso-ipo-kubelik

 

[ubertrout]

The first album to Beethoven/Kubelik bunch is now available for pre-order: https://www.pentatonemusic.com/beeethoven-symphonies-lso-ipo-kubelik

I'm really interested in the recording details for this cycle - as far as I know it's the only one done by one conductor with nine different orchestras. Presumably the recordings were mostly done in different venues then, but was the production team the same or different? There's an interesting review of an early Japanese release of the 6th from this cycle here: http://www.sa-cd.net/showtitle/2721. I don't have any of these on CD, not sure if anyone else here does to look at the liner notes. This cycle is one where I'd be curious to hear what Thomas Mowrey has to say, but he hasn't been around in a year or two.

 

[luketsu]

I asked few questions concerning to these Beethoven recordings and here's the answer of Thomas Mowrey:

"Hi Luukas. Thanks for passing this along. I did not produce any of these, although I was present for the 5th in Boston and the 8th in Cleveland. All of these recordings will have only ambiance in the rear channels, which will be pleasing if not riveting".

 

[ubertrout]

I asked few questions concerning to these Beethoven recordings and here's the answer of Thomas Mowrey:

"Hi Luukas. Thanks for passing this along. I did not produce any of these, although I was present for the 5th in Boston and the 8th in Cleveland. All of these recordings will have only ambiance in the rear channels, which will be pleasing if not riveting".

Good to know. The Kubelik Beethoven cycle is an important one which hasn't been well treated on CD, it will be good to have in stereo/quad, even if the surrounds are just ambience. Frankly, aside from possibly the 9th, I don't think most Beethoven symphonic works really require a more active surround presentation.

I'm curious about Mr. Mowrey's opinion of the Bartok release though...did he produce or have any thoughts about the Kubelik Concerto for Orchestra from 1973? I see he did produce the Music for Strings, Percussion, and Celesta; should we be clamoring for the Miraculous Mandarin suite it was originally paired with? https://www.discogs.com/Béla-Bartók...ndarin-Music-for-Strings-Percus/master/239006

Edit to add: It's going to be cool to hear the Beethoven 8th from Cleveland...the orchestra was still close to its peak at the tail end of the Szell era, and his Beethoven 8 is masterful.

 

[luketsu]

The second album to Raphael Kubelik's Beethoven cycle is now available for pre-order: https://www.pentatonemusic.com/remastered-classic-beethoven-symphonies-2-5

 

[luketsu]

Available now for pre-order: https://www.pentatonemusic.com/beethoven-orchestredeparis-kubelik-remastered

 

[luketsu]

Yesterday PENTATONE sent the following message to me:

"Hi Luukas, the new release plan will be made available soon on the website.. Stay tuned "

Be ready for the new bunch of REMASTERED CLASSICS!

 

[ubertrout]

Looking forward to it! It hasn't been a great year for Quad reissues, but we've gotten a few - and it's been a decent year for their original recordings too.

 

[luketsu]

I knew it! The first quad remaster for 2018 has been announced on release planning:

February 2018
REMASTERED CLASSICS Beethoven Symphony 9
Rafael Kubelik
Ludwig van Beethoven

Check out: https://www.pentatonemusic.com/releases

 

[ubertrout]

I knew it! The first quad remaster for 2018 has been announced on release planning:

February 2018
REMASTERED CLASSICS Beethoven Symphony 9
Rafael Kubelik
Ludwig van Beethoven

Check out: https://www.pentatonemusic.com/releases

I'm guessing they'll release the 3rd also and complete the cycle. A little awkward with the spread onto 6 discs, but I guess that's the only way it would work. I'll probably pick this cycle up, but I suspect I'll wait for a box - I don't have a desperate need for another Beethoven cycle.

Not exactly overwhelmed by the other offerings - I'm willing to be wowed, but there have been 20+ recordings of the Mahler 4th on SACD already: ‎http://hraudio.net/recordings.php?work=3

Ditto the Mendelssohn Symphonies - stiff competition especially in the 4th: http://hraudio.net/recordings.php?work=1619

Note that they just added April as well. No additional quad releases mentioned. I suspect they're filling it out as we speak.

 

[skherbeck]

I'm guessing they'll release the 3rd also and complete the cycle. A little awkward with the spread onto 6 discs, but I guess that's the only way it would work. I'll probably pick this cycle up, but I suspect I'll wait for a box - I don't have a desperate need for another Beethoven cycle.

Not exactly overwhelmed by the other offerings - I'm willing to be wowed, but there have been 20+ recordings of the Mahler 4th on SACD already: ‎http://hraudio.net/recordings.php?work=3

Ditto the Mendelssohn Symphonies - stiff competition especially in the 4th: http://hraudio.net/recordings.php?work=1619

Note that they just added April as well. No additional quad releases mentioned. I suspect they're filling it out as we speak.

I’ve got all the Beethoven Symphonies on Tacet Blu-ray... any reason I should purchase them again on Pentatone? (Besides completing my “Remastered Classics” collection). What would you consider to be the best set of Beethoven Symphonies in surround?