Scottie-boy
Member
Sorry - Not meant to be harsh. Just saying there is no difference. Understand for collector reasons, etc. But no difference in audio/fidelity
Pink Floyd - "Animals" 5.1 Surround Sound Mix (Blu-Ray & SACD editions out in September 2022!)
- Thread starter César
- Start date
Help Support QuadraphonicQuad:
Just checking that you understand systems process PCM and DSD differently...
Scottie-boy
Member
Sure, just as there are different CODECS - like SACD vs. DVD-A, but the audio result/output is the same with the same mix
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So... You don't understand. Got it.
SACD_ripper
Senior Member
Let's lower the temperature...
One, DSD and PCM are two entirely different digital formats - requiring different coding, filters, analog signal restoration, etc. so...there is 100% a scientific argument they are simply different. And thus can "sound" different.
Two, because they are simply different formats, there is no such thing as a "system equally capable on both with the same mix". Even DTS-HD MA and Dolby True HD can sound different even though they are basically two different ways of losslessly handling the exact same PCM data because...systems aren't equally capable.
Three, for these reasons (among others) comparing DSD and PCM is nothing like the old "monster cables are superior" argument [although there is certainly a solid argument to made that different cables made of different materials and construction can and do sound different (not necessarily better or worse).]
Fourth, if in this case the mixing and mastering were done in the PCM domain and then converted to DSD, that's one more variable which could result in an audible difference.
Having said all of that, the differences may be inaudible to many or all. But they could also be audible to many or all.
I don't have any reason to doubt that people sometimes hear genuine differences between DTS-HD MA and Dolby TrueHD, but I'd sure like to know why.
Maybe I'm thinking of the processing chain incorrectly, but in my head it's Source->Conversion to PCM->Output. Those converted bits should be identical, assuming something funny wasn't done during disc authoring. You can test a version of this yourself: Select a random WAV file. Create an MD5 checksum for it. Convert that file to separate FLAC, ALAC and WavPack files. Convert those three back to WAV and create MD5 checksums for all of them. Unless something went wrong, those checksums should all be the same and match the original one for the WAV you started with.
Having said that, I have on a couple occasions FLACified both the lossless encodings found on a single disc and the checksums have not matched, which certainly suggests that something funny was indeed done during the authoring. But that "something" could be as innocuous as a millisecond timing difference. It makes my brain hurt.
IIRC, when DTS HS MA vs. Dolby True HD has come up in the past, like with Sgt. Pepper's BD, I think it might have to do with additional processing some systems perform on Dolby playback. Like, volume normalization or some such? Some kind of additional Dolby magic sauce it what I recall discussed.
Ah! That would make sense, thank you!
Played the Blu-ray today and the surround sounded very nice. Good bass and surround effects.
Switched to the SACD version but it starting playing what sounds like the stereo remix.
How do you change the menu to 5.1? I haven’t played an SACD in quite awhile but thought their would be a menu.
I’m using a Sony X800.
Switched to the SACD version but it starting playing what sounds like the stereo remix.
How do you change the menu to 5.1? I haven’t played an SACD in quite awhile but thought their would be a menu.
I’m using a Sony X800.
Think in the player itself - there is a setting to read surround or stereo first off the disc.
Yep should be something like “audio“ button on your remote for you player
If the AUDIO button doesn’t change it on the fly, from the top menu of the player it’s:
Setup > Music Settings >
Super Audio CD Playback Layer: Super Audio CD
Super Audio CD Playback Channel: DSD Multi
Setup > Music Settings >
Super Audio CD Playback Layer: Super Audio CD
Super Audio CD Playback Channel: DSD Multi
With this album starting out in "stereo" is probably correct. Both parts of Pigs on a Wing, have 6 tracks but there is only information in the front right and left.
Yes the AUDIO button doesn't change the audio on the fly like other recordings.
I'll try again tomorrow and see if I can change the settings on the Sony X800. While the disc was playing today, pressing TOP MENU did nothing.
With a disc playing you have to press HOME to get to the player’s main menu.
Don't forget SACDs don't have a menu, so TOP MENU would correctly do nothing.
Checked the X800 manual and it doesn't address this particular problem (the manual is more concerned with video Blu-ray/4k playback).
Thinking now its my older Denon 3806 receiver that while it does HDMI, it isn't compatible with the more modern x800.
The screen shows that the x800 found the multi mix but it isn't translating through HDMI to the Denon 3806 receiver.
Looks like I will have to use my Denon 3910 to play this SACD.
Back in 2020 there was a similar problem for fthesoundguy:
Oh well, not a big deal, the x800 plays the Blu-ray version through the Denon receiver and my system very well.
Thinking now its my older Denon 3806 receiver that while it does HDMI, it isn't compatible with the more modern x800.
The screen shows that the x800 found the multi mix but it isn't translating through HDMI to the Denon 3806 receiver.
Looks like I will have to use my Denon 3910 to play this SACD.
Back in 2020 there was a similar problem for fthesoundguy:
Oh well, not a big deal, the x800 plays the Blu-ray version through the Denon receiver and my system very well.
