Why Blu-Ray will make it when SACD, DVD-A, and HD-DVD won't

[elshagon]

Also: how the hell are they gonna fit uncompressed audio like 5.1 PCM on a HD-DVD that has a long film like LOTR on it without sacrificing video quality (STUPID!)

I think the numbers I've seen is you can have 5.1 Dolby TrueHD (lossless audio) with 4 hours of HD video and not suffer any loss in video quality. This covers about 99.8% of all movies. The LOTR theatrical cuts would be fine.

 

[Manmc]

At last I've found the mythical Sony Appreciation thread Is this one of those
' Phase-Hydra' Sony love-ins in the making ????

" if Blu-Ray is REALLY that bad and costs sooooo much than why the hell did other companies, studios and CE manufacturers alike, thought it would be a good path to take? " Maybe , just maybe they had their big 'Paramount-like' payday ahead of anyone else ?

" I do know that SACD works great for my needs, I prefer it to DVD-A. I do know Blu-ray works great for my needs, I prefer it to HD DVD. " Chris , that's fine . I ' prefer pasta to pizza' but I don't think it should be universally enforced as the sole choice for those that are interested . I definitely agree that its a mess that should've been sorted before launch . But ...

Neil is right . Sony is a monster . They've been picking format fights for years in anticipation of replacing their dwindling Cd patent royalties . They almost caused Sd-Dvd to be stillborn before compromising right at the end. IMO they are the single greatest enemy of consumers in the music/movies/electronics
operating today .

The rootkit fiasco showed exactly their own lack of class and their disdain and lack of respect for their customers.

As for HD-Dvd/BD , Paramount didn't invent a 3rd format , we still have just the 2 from last week so why are people so perturbed about it all all of a sudden ? Its a war , nobody ever completely wins a war do they ?

We should all continue to enjoy whatever formats we ever did while this goes
on around us :banana:

All my 0.02c


~M~

 

[Old Quad Guy]

We should all continue to enjoy whatever formats we ever did while this goes
on around us :banana:

And if the market get's flooded with discs of both formats, then we'll have to live with them anyway. If players for both formats are priced under $100 than it won't matter. Unless we're not able to do commercial discs because of cost and the control of any one company or format.

Hopefully some forward thinking manufacturer will step up to the plate and release an all in one "Disc Player To Rule Them All." :sun

 

[elshagon]

And if the market get's flooded with discs of both formats, then we'll have to live with them anyway. If players for both formats are priced under $100 than it won't matter. Unless we're not able to do commercial discs because of cost and the control of any one company or format.

Hopefully some forward thinking manufacturer will step up to the plate and release an all in one "Disc Player To Rule Them All." :sun

There's already combo players out (expensive) and more to come. Also Warner is in development of a combo disc (BD on one side and HD DVD on the other).

 

[lolbroek]

I think the numbers I've seen is you can have 5.1 Dolby TrueHD (lossless audio) with 4 hours of HD video and not suffer any loss in video quality. This covers about 99.8% of all movies. The LOTR theatrical cuts would be fine.

Yes, but what are they going to do with their numerous extras (which is a high selling point for both sides although I couldn't care less)? Include an extra disc and bump up the price for the consumer?

And on another note: although Dolby TrueHD and PCM should virtually be the same, you can find numerous reviews on the net that -after levelmatching- actually prefer the PCM-track.

Now, I don't know if that's silly or not; I haven't -and probably won't for a long time- experienced the difference between both. I'm just wondering about it.

 

[El Guapo]

There's already combo players out (expensive) and more to come. Also Warner is in development of a combo disc (BD on one side and HD DVD on the other).

Well, let's see how this plays out...
After Warner's High-Def Guru quit the company - he was the most outspoken proponent of Warner's neutral stand and support of both formats - the game is wide open! Everyone is just holding their breath, because it seems we can expect Warner to swing completely to one side... And whoever side this is will have a big advantage, because quite frankly, I think that Warner matters much more than Paramount/Dreamworks if you look at the overall market share...

 

[El Guapo]

There's already combo players out (expensive) and more to come. Also Warner is in development of a combo disc (BD on one side and HD DVD on the other).

One interesting announcement Denon made after the Paramount/Dreamworks HD DVD swing is that their Blu-ray player will be delayed. The announcement reads like this:

Denon delays Profile 1.1 Blu-ray player till 2008
Denon’s widely reported Profile 1.1 Blu-ray player is unlikely to launch (certainly in Europe) until Q2 2008. Consequently, it’s unlikely now to be the first profile 1.1 Blu-ray deck to market. So says Denon UK’s Roger Batchelor, who also confirms that the brand’s advanced AVP-A1HD and POA-A1HD pre-power combo have also been delayed. The POA-A1HD is a THX Ultra2 certified 10-channel power amplifier designed to match the AVP-A1HD THX Ultra2 A1HD pre amplifier. The pair was first unveiled at the Munich High-End show, back in May. The A1HD is DLNA (Digital network Living Alliance) compatible, able to access and stream media from PCs or DNLA devices on a home network. It’s also equipped with the latest Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio decoders.
Marketing manager for product planning and marketing, Jun Igarashi, says that the company intends to allow its customers to access to whatever media they have, wherever it is.

I find the last statement (which I put in bold) especially interesting... whatever media they have? This could either mean that they want to make it a combo player, or they want to wait a while longer to see who wins...
Or maybe the delay just is caused by problems with the new BD specs...?

Oliver

 

[solaris]

It all comes down to advertising. If the general public can get over it's anger at having another format war, then who ever gets the public's attention this holiday buying season will win. A cheap price will get the public's attention. Yes the blood will flow at the end of 07.

 

[bmoura]

Last I read they were going for Blu-Ray. It's somewhere on dvdfile.com but I can't be bothered to go find it, sorry. Studying for exams at the moment. (what the hell am I doing here then?!)

They're probably issuing in both formats I'd guess.

 

[Old Quad Guy]

It all comes down to advertising. If the general public can get over it's anger at having another format war, then who ever gets the public's attention this holiday buying season will win. A cheap price will get the public's attention. Yes the blood will flow at the end of 07.

When I was at Comic-Con last month - where the major movie studios tout their future releases - Warner's had one of the biggest buzzes of the 4 day event with the 25th anniversary release of "Blade Runner" coming out this fall. They had most of the actors who we're in the movie at a live panel event. They said it was coming out in HD-DVD this fall and oh yes, BluRay too. I didn't think much about it at the time, but all I heard was HD-DVD this, HD-DVD that, and advertised on huge billboard type posters for all sorts of DVD's. Now I'm seeing on TV ads for HD-DVD this, HD-DVD that. If Warner's switches to HD-DVD only (perhaps because of licensing fee's?) and people actually buy HD-DVD discs and players at a reduced cost, then yes perhaps the wind is shifting and "the blood will flow at the end of 07."

If that happens that would be a radical shift at the end of the year from what appeared to be the inevitability of Blu-ray to dominate the market at the beginning.

This release makes me want to buy a HDTV set and player!

 

[Old Quad Guy]

Question moved to another thread.

 

[bmoura]

Question moved to another thread.

Depends on whether or not Toshiba has another $150 Million, I suppose !

 

[Old Quad Guy]

Depends on whether or not Toshiba has another $150 Million, I suppose !

I moved my question here:

Blade Runner 25th anniversary release. Which format to buy?

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8515

This is why releasing dual formats of the same item separately is wrong. Eventually they're going to pick one format over the other. I'll make a guesstimate: I think Warner's will choose HD-DVD after Christmas because of all the discounted HD-DVD players and discs that people bought. Christmas 2008!

If you already own 50+ titles in any one HD format than you're good IMO, even if no more discs of your format are ever made again.

 

[JonUrban]

Paramount and Dreamworks just signed on exclusive HD-DVD today...This is going to get really stupid

And now WB has gone Blu. What's a consumer to do?

Once again, a format war may be determined not by which system is better, but by which system has the "better" titles!

 

[The Rang]

And now WB has gone Blu. What's a consumer to do?

This consumer will do nothing.

Every videophile I know, the type of people who are traditionally early adopters, are all waiting this one out.

Now that my TV is finally working properly I can see what an amazing job my Denon 3930 can do on SD. I'm good for now.

 

[bmoura]

And now WB has gone Blu. What's a consumer to do?

It must be a bitter pill for Toshiba given the work that Toshiba and Warner did earlier on co-developing DVD Video and DVD Audio.

I see Toshiba just issued a news release expressing "surprise" at the Warner announcement. See http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/new...Surprised_By_Warner_Blu-ray_Announcement/1326

=========================================================
"TOKYO, Jan. 4 /PRNewswire/ -- Toshiba is quite surprised by Warner Bros.' decision to abandon HD DVD in favor of Blu-ray, despite the fact that there are various contracts in place between our companies concerning the support of HD DVD. As central members of the DVD Forum, we have long maintained a close partnership with Warner Bros. We worked closely together to help standardize the first-generation DVD format as well as to define and shape HD DVD as its next-generation successor.

We were particularly disappointed that this decision was made in spite of the significant momentum HD DVD has gained in the US market as well as other regions in 2007. HD DVD players and PCs have outsold Blu-ray in the US market in 2007.

We will assess the potential impact of this announcement with the other HD DVD partner companies and evaluate potential next steps. We remain firm in our belief that HD DVD is the format best suited to the wants and needs of the consumer."

=========================================================

 

[Old Quad Guy]

I suspect Warner's waited until they got rid of their excess HD-DVD stock during Christmas before announcing. Now will be the time to pick up HD-DVD titles in the bargain bin for cheap. Works for me.

This part is interesting from: "Warner Bros. Picks Blu-Ray Over HD-DVD" By ALEX VEIGA

"Still, one alarming trend Warner keyed on was that consumers didn't appear motivated by price reductions on high-definition disc players.

"When we saw that was not impacting sales in the level that it should have, and the consumer research that we did indicated that the consumers were holding back from buying either one of the two formats ... we thought it was the right time to act," Tsujihara said, noting that even sales of standard DVDs were affected because consumers appeared unsure over which format to go with.

"That was kind of the worst of all worlds for us," he said."

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5g5o_jtobEI9M5f_SARKDatmaSU3QD8TVC9M80

 

[bmoura]

I moved my question here:

Blade Runner 25th anniversary release. Which format to buy?

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/showthread.php?t=8515

This is why releasing dual formats of the same item separately is wrong. Eventually they're going to pick one format over the other. I'll make a guesstimate: I think Warner's will choose HD-DVD after Christmas because of all the discounted HD-DVD players and discs that people bought. Christmas 2008!

If you already own 50+ titles in any one HD format than you're good IMO, even if no more discs of your format are ever made again.

Well, you were close. Warner did pick - they just went to Blu-Ray today.

 

[Old Quad Guy]

Well, you were close. Warner did pick - they just went to Blu-Ray today.

I totally forgot about Warner until mid December and that post until now. But the price was so low with free discs it was worth it. I did factor HD-DVD losing out when buying. I'll just buy blu next Christmas - if it's under $200 - and hopfully get more free discs. We still need to be able to play our DVD-A / SACD titles. And content providers should be able to make discs without a lot of extra cost or hassle.

There is a question whether or not the average person sees a reason to buy these new HD players. They seem to be satisfied with regular DVD, especially with a bad economy getting worse. And I could not buy The Ramones new DVD on either HD formats.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Once again, a format war may be determined not by which system is better, but by which system has the "better" titles!

Makes sense to me. ;-)

Kal