Beatles Revolver Box Set (Dolby Atmos Mix available for streaming; No Blu-Ray)

[MidiMagic]

They must have the pre bounce tapes in the vault of at least some of the tracks. Yellow Submarine on the 1999 DVD is very discrete despite not having today's separation technology. Then there is the mash up of Eleanor Rigby on the Love album.

Yellow Submarine was made using Foley or Moviola sound tracks on film. You can synchronize as many pieces of film as you have film transports. The sprocket holes keep them in lock.

 

[ar surround]

That's interesting...what free AI demixing tech would you recommend?

That's interesting...what free AI demixing tech would you recommend?

I have been using this one. @zeerround mentioned it another thread.

https://mvsep.com/
I use Ultimate Vocal Remover HQ to separate instruments / vocals. Then I use Demucs3 Model B to separate the drums, bass and other instruments. After I get these stems, I tear them apart where possible and decide where each element goes.

I also contrive of all sorts of machinations just to see what comes out. For example, I made a multichannel of There's A Place. I took the vocal side of the stereo version and the mono recording and ran it through Ultimate Vocal Remover to see what would come out. I ended up with vocals that were "everywhere but not quite anywhere." I liked the way it sounded so I used it. I also ran some crazy manipulations to the harmonica to get overtones across the rear channels.

And just for the heck of it, I made a 5.1 of A Taste Of Honey using simply the MONO recording.

Another thing that I noticed is that the more channels there are, the less separation artifacts are noticeable. It seems that the brain can only process so much information at once. I believe that was one of the bases for the quadraphonic logic decoders of yore...as well as the more sophisticated Surround Master.

It's a lot of fun to do and one only has to please one's self. Give it a try.

 

[dobyblue]

Please, Paul - be correct about the inclusion of a blu-ray with surround mixes

https://superdeluxeedition.com/news/giles-martin-confirms-that-revolver-is-the-next-beatles-reissue/

I think much of his article stems (oh that's punny) from what has been discussed here.

 

[key_wiz]

I really doubt that. Those contain many overlapping frequencies. I do not see this as feasible.

It is pretty amazing how well the technology can separate such elements these days. Certainly there will be instances where an instrument will never be fully discreet. But enough so that one can create a satisfying surround mix? Yes.

 

[dobyblue]

Perhaps @PaulatSDE might be of help here?

Paul can you comment on the costs involved with surround BD titles in 2022? Can you ballpark, for an average release, how many copies you need to sell to break even? Thanks for any insight you can provide.

 

[dobyblue]

Yeah, the software apparently used for demixing in this instance can't separate something like two guitars recorded on the same track, or at least it couldn't when it was used extensively for Peter Jackson's Get Back. He demonstrated its' capabilities in an interview at the time, taking a mono Nagra recording of an 'I've Got A Feeling' rehearsal and separating it cleanly into drums, bass, voices and guitars IIRC. These could then be balanced and EQd separately in order to make a much more satisfying stereo image.

If, say, that technology (reportedly far better than Abbey Road's in house version) were applied to 'Taxman', the track layout of which @dobyblue has kindly provided above, it can be seen that the main problem lies in the fact that drums, bass and one guitar were recorded directly onto one track right at the beginning...other, later overdubs present less of problem. The software would in this case be capable of separating drums, bass and the guitar into separate tracks.

Other songs present similar problems, e.g. 'She Said, She Said' where drums and bass were initially recorded together on one track with two guitars on another.

And just to give credit where credit is due, the initial post with the Taxman tracks comes from QQ member @boxhead here:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/threads/remixing-the-beatles-pre-sgt-pepper.31308/

 

[key_wiz]

Perhaps @PaulatSDE might be of help here?

Paul can you comment on the costs involved with surround BD titles in 2022? Can you ballpark, for an average release, how many copies you need to sell to break even? Thanks for any insight you can provide.

I'm not Paul, but I think the biggest cost would be paying someone to do the mix. Especially if they are a known quantity like a Steven Wilson.

Take something like The Tipping Point. SDE sells it for around $20. They probably keep around $5 of that. If they sell 1,500 copies, that'd be $22,500 in wholesale back to the band/original label to cover the orginal cost of the mixing, mastering, pressing of the artwork, plastic box, the disc itself, etc. What does Steven Wilson charge to do a surround mix? Plus whatever various producers and others might be making if they are tied into the profits.

Obviously they make a profit on 1,500 copies but it can't be a WHOLE lot.

 

[LuvMyQuad]

Take something like The Tipping Point. SDE sells it for around $20. They probably keep around $5 of that. If they sell 1,500 copies, that'd be $22,500 in wholesale back to the band/original label to cover the orginal cost of the mixing, mastering, pressing of the artwork, plastic box, the disc itself, etc. What does Steven Wilson charge to do a surround mix? Plus whatever various producers and others might be making if they are tied into the profits.

Wasn't The Tipping Point mix already in the can when SDE decided to release it? I thought it was initially put in motion by Apple. SDE would then just license it, not pay for the mix that was already completed.

Same with the Gilbert O'Sullivan release, and for that matter, the squashed INXS release.

 

[key_wiz]

Wasn't The Tipping Point mix already in the can when SDE decided to release it? I thought it was initially put in motion by Apple. SDE would then just license it, not pay for the mix that was already completed.

Same with the Gilbert O'Sullivan release, and for that matter, the squashed INXS release.

I didn't mean that SDE paid for the mix themselves directly. I was simply trying to figure how much profit anyone would have made from it. Another way to look at it is 1,500 copies selling for $20 each is $30,000. Out of that has to come the costs of everything from the mix to the final product being sold by the retailer. A lot of people to be paid and looking to make a bit of profit from not a whole lot of money. And that's if they sell all 1,500.

So what's the break-even point? Someone else could probably answer that better than I could.

Now if what you are saying is everyone made money more easily because Apple had already paid for the surround mix, then that might be true, but that doesn't make us any less dependent upon the streaming platforms to be successful.

 

[kap'n krunch]

It’s just a bummer that in some cases like Taxman, the initial Track One combined drums, bass and Guitar 1. Would be ace bananas if they had done them on Tracks 1-3 then bounced!

First off, I am highly doubtful that this was in 1963!!!
ANYWAY, typos aside, then it's not that bad cause I think that separating gtr, bass and drumsis fairly easy with the demixing software nowadays and back then they also did it that way on purpose to then add more gtrs and have then sound separate, so no biggie there...we could have the tambourine in the HEIGHT channels, LOL!!!

 

[edisonbaggins]

Thankfully the cowbell won't be drowned out!

Does it need more?!

 

[Tres Discrete]

Does it need more?!

Always!

 

[zobalob]

I have been using this one. @zeerround mentioned it another thread.

https://mvsep.com/
I use Ultimate Vocal Remover HQ to separate instruments / vocals. Then I use Demucs3 Model B to separate the drums, bass and other instruments. After I get these stems, I tear them apart where possible and decide where each element goes.

I also contrive of all sorts of machinations just to see what comes out. For example, I made a multichannel of There's A Place. I took the vocal side of the stereo version and the mono recording and ran it through Ultimate Vocal Remover to see what would come out. I ended up with vocals that were "everywhere but not quite anywhere." I liked the way it sounded so I used it. I also ran some crazy manipulations to the harmonica to get overtones across the rear channels.

And just for the heck of it, I made a 5.1 of A Taste Of Honey using simply the MONO recording.

Another thing that I noticed is that the more channels there are, the less separation artifacts are noticeable. It seems that the brain can only process so much information at once. I believe that was one of the bases for the quadraphonic logic decoders of yore...as well as the more sophisticated Surround Master.

It's a lot of fun to do and one only has to please one's self. Give it a try.

Thanks!

 

[boxhead]

First off, I am highly doubtful that this was in 1963!!!
ANYWAY, typos aside, then it's not that bad cause I think that separating gtr, bass and drumsis fairly easy with the demixing software nowadays and back then they also did it that way on purpose to then add more gtrs and have then sound separate, so no biggie there...we could have the tambourine in the HEIGHT channels, LOL!!!

Hey Kaptain, you're quite correct. There's a misprint in the book and it should have read 1966. The dates they worked on this track were:

April 21
April 22
April 27
May 16 and
June 21

All in 1966!

 

[dobyblue]

First off, I am highly doubtful that this was in 1963!!!
ANYWAY, typos aside, then it's not that bad cause I think that separating gtr, bass and drumsis fairly easy with the demixing software nowadays and back then they also did it that way on purpose to then add more gtrs and have then sound separate, so no biggie there...we could have the tambourine in the HEIGHT channels, LOL!!!

Yeah but they could have just used another tape and started with guitar 1, drums and bass being on separate tracks then bouncing them.


Stupid Beatles!!
[\sarcasm]

 

[Belgiumliver]

I am currently using DeMix Pro which does an excellent job of separating the various elements, drums, bass, guitars and vocals. I am amazed how well it can separate lead vocals from backing. All of these stems need some manual work in a spectral editor but it can be done and I'm sure Giles Martin has access to more advanced software than the rest of us.

OK, sounds great, optimism is a good thing. I will wait and see.

 

[MidiMagic]

It occurs to me that the software might be looking at the waveforms of each part instead of just frequency bands. Each part would have a distinct waveform due to the combination of harmonics from the unique construction of each sound generator. That waveform should repeat throughout the recording.

 

[5.1 4 Life]

The deluxe edition of The Beatles' Revolver now has a date-10/28/2022.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BB3F4J1J/?tag=imwan-20

 

[J. PUPSTER]

The deluxe edition of The Beatles' Revolver now has a date-10/28/2022.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0BB3F4J1J/?tag=imwan-20

Hmm, 5 CD, but number of discs “6”, and a mere $140 smackers!
Where’s @rtbluray with that official announcement

 

[Bill B]

Hmm, 5 CD, but number of discs “6”, and a mere $140 smackers!
Where’s @rtbluray with that official announcement

"number of discs “6”

At least there is hope that the 6th disc is a blu-ray with multi-channel.