ELP Emerson Lake & Palmer Cataloge in 5.1 Surround

[Scott M4]

I saw them live on Feb 21st, 1974 and it was an amazing memorable event. I recognized sound system designer Bill Hough standing by the mixing desk looking at the stage. Despite my only being 14, he did speak to me for a few minutes. He mentioned digital delay lines as something very new they were using. Bill also mentioned that "a Scully Metrotec 24 track is backstage to take down every show." Back Door (ptoduced by Carl Palmer) opened the show.

I've got to say that I think it's very cool that a fourteen year old kid would recognize a sound system designer. Props to the young you!

 

[strat54]

And mountains of multitracks from that tour sitting in vaults? Probably never were made to begin with. The band had no clue what they should be doing and ditto with their management.

Actually I was generalizing about all the classic rock concerts from the 70's and 80's that were recorded with a "mobile" and then not released. I am sure you are correct about about ELP management, some musician friends of mine were under their management....d-bags. Anyways, I found this tidbit about the Roosevelt Field thunderstorm.
http://ladiesofthelake.com/cabinet/Roadie1.html

 

[Scott M4]

The thunderstorm story was scary - reminded me of the Radiohead tragedy here in Toronto last summer. Interesting to learn also that Roger Powell was one of the designers of Keith's big Moog. His description of having to patch it up from scratch at every show reminds me of a related non-ELP moment. Robert Rich played a concert in Toronto that I was involved with and we went to help him unload his van. Inside, lying on its back on top of all the other gear was Robert's rather large (though not as monolithic as Keith's) modular synth which was still completely patched from the previous show. He had designed it into one lightly-framed large unit and it took only two people to carry it up the stairwell to the concert area, though being careful not to catch the patchcords on the handrails. Brilliant solution to the patching problem! There's various photos of his rig throughout this webpage, if you're interested. http://www.theambientping.com/robert_rich_070402.html

 

[Ranasakawa]

I was 2 when Jimi died. Was lucky to see Stevie Ray Vaughan and Jeff Healey before they both left us however. Both were also brilliant guitarists.
I missed out seeing Rory Gallagher, missed my chance on that one.

 

[strat54]

The thunderstorm story was scary - reminded me of the Radiohead trajedy here in Toronto last summer. Interesting to learn also that Roger Powell was one of the designers of Keith's big Moog. His description of having to patch it up from scratch at every show reminds me of a related non-ELP moment. Robert Rich played a concert in Toronto that I was involved with and we went to help him unload his van. Inside, lying on its back on top of all the other gear was Robert's rather large (though not as monolithic as Keith's) modular synth which was still completely patched from the previous show. He had designed it into one lightly-framed large unit and it took only two people to carry it up the stairwell to the concert area, though being careful not to catch the patchcords on the handrails. Brilliant solution to the patching problem! There's various photos of his rig throughout this webpage, if you're interested. http://www.theambientping.com/robert_rich_070402.html

Those Rich photos are very cool, looks like a really neat show.
I didn't know about the Roger Powell/ELP connection.
From my recollection about the thunderstorm, black clouds moved in very quickly, I moved into the bleachers from the field, most people huddled under plastic tarps in the mud, rain was coming down in buckets, the wind was whipping, the clouds turned a sickly greenish color, some hail started falling then a small cyclone ran across the field, it lifted a guy who was clutching his tarp up into the air about ten or fifteen feet and he landed twenty feet away, then all the stuff on stage started coming down. Ah, memories.

I have been to many outdoor concert/weather events.
What do the gods, spirits, demons, aliens or whoever they are have against outdoor music concerts, like Woodstock anyway.

 

[rontoon]

It's not an issue of "...swirling some synths..."on the BSS surround mix but what it actually sounded like in ELP's LIVE surround sound performances on the BSS tour. Nobody here saw at least one of those shows???

Why should a 5.1 mix of the official studio album emulate the quad sound of the live concert experience? Apples and oranges. Moot point unless you refer to a surround mix of WBMFTTSTNE.

If you didn't see them LIVE from 1971-1974, don't comment on their live performances, I don't want to hear your opinions please.

Well that's just farking rude.

 

[tarkusnj]

Why should a 5.1 mix of the official studio album emulate the quad sound of the live concert experience? Apples and oranges. Moot point unless you refer to a surround mix of WBMFTTSTNE.

Well that's just farking rude.

I would only be guessing that any band in live performance wants to reproduce the sound of their studio recording. If they had released BSS in surround back in 1973, I would think it would have sounded close to the BSS DVD-A which was similar to the surround experience in their liver performances of BSS from 73-74. But then again, maybe they wanted the album and live performance and live recording to all sound different. I mean, that's what I would do.

 

[Quad Linda]

EVERYONE's OPINION is welcome at QQ, so long as it is expressed in a polite way that is respectful of others and their right to disagree.

...I don't want to hear your opinions please...

 

[rontoon]

I would only be guessing that any band in live performance wants to reproduce the sound of their studio recording.

If this was the case then the tour would have been in stereo. ELP took some artistic license with their live quad mix. And the quad mix for WBMFTTSTNE was a horrible, uneven mess. If that's a representation of the actual quad mix from that tour then I didn't miss much.

 

[timbre4]

It was a great experience. As to whether many shows were recorded, WHO KNOWS?

I can tell you that the master tapes presented to the CD-4 cutting center were so poorly engineered, no stable CD-4 master could be made and so ended up being a Q8 only release.

Check my QQ photos for Pics from my 1975 visit to JVC CD-4 Cutting Center in Los Angeles. I included scans of the engineers business cards who explained all of this.

They also entertained Ian Anderson, but thats another thread.

 

[bmoura]

It was a great experience. As to whether many shows were recorded, WHO KNOWS?

I can tell you that the master tapes presented to the CD-4 cutting center were so poorly engineered, no stable CD-4 master could be made and so ended up being a Q8 only release.

Check my QQ photos for Pics from my 1975 visit to JVC CD-4 Cutting Center in Los Angeles. I included scans of the engineers business cards who explained all of this.

They also entertained Ian Anderson, but thats another thread.

Are your photos in the Blog section ?

 

[JonUrban]

Everyone knock it off. We all know tarkusnj hates the SW ELP DVD-A's. The majority of the forum, as reflected in the polls, thinks otherwise.

He is not going to convince us, and we're not going to convince him.

So KNOCK IT OFF!!! :howl

(please)

HOW OLD ARE WE?

 

[timbre4]

Brian,

The JVC pictures are under profile; try this:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/album.php?albumid=92

 

[tarkusnj]

Everyone knock it off. We all know tarkusnj hates the SW ELP DVD-A's. The majority of the forum, as reflected in the polls, thinks otherwise.

He is not going to convince us, and we're not going to convince him.

So let's look forward to the next two releases. Who knows, maybe even I will like them then we can all get a warm and fussy feeling together like the good buddies we all are liking surround music. Togetherness...

 

[rontoon]

Brian,

The JVC pictures are under profile; try this:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/album.php?albumid=92

Thanks for reposting that link. Cool pix!

 

[Quad Linda]

What a world it could have been IF most new releases since that time were in Quad and/or 5.1! I'd own 20,000 surround albums, instead of 1,000. IF, IF, IF...

Brian,

The JVC pictures are under profile; try this:

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/forums/album.php?albumid=92

 

[tarkusnj]

If this was the case then the tour would have been in stereo. ELP took some artistic license with their live quad mix. And the quad mix for WBMFTTSTNE was a horrible, uneven mess. If that's a representation of the actual quad mix from that tour then I didn't miss much.

That is the problem with the WBMF release. If you have he Q8 tapes, they are terrible. If you had seen the BSS tour live in quad, it was mind blowing. I guess that is my excuse for the way I am now huh?
And bootleggers never seemed to record these shows to take advantage of the quad setup. The only show I taped, the infamous MSG "Silent Night" show was a nightmare for me. One of my mics died before the show and I had to "borrow" a cheap mic from a lecture hall at my college. The mic sucked and the tapes were stolen in Key West 37 years ago but my recording was bad anyway. But at least I faced one forward and one to the rear. When ELPowell toured and I heard they had a surround system, I setup 5 mics and a portable 4 channel mixer, the fifth mic being the Nak 500's center "blend".

 

[rontoon]

That is the problem with the WBMF release. If you have he Q8 tapes, they are terrible.

Even worse than either SW surround mix.

 

[tarkusnj]

Even worse than either SW surround mix.

When the original stereo WBMF was released, I had the import before it came over to the States. I called DIR Broadcasting in NYC and asked them why it sounded so bad even compared to the radio broadcast. The guy I spoke with just told me to shove it up my ass. I have had a sideways gait ever since...

 

[rusinurbe]

Oof nothing kills a surround mix for me more than this!

But yes, to each his own.

For me its a case of why have a phantom center when you ahve an actual center Pin it its 5.1 not 4.1/4.0