How is Dolby Atmos Doing? (2023)

[mandrix]

Yes, that DRP it's all that's out there and it's not available to the general public. AND you would have to manipulate the files quite some to get it to play from what I read online, etc, etc. Dolby's model is restrictive, pure "chokepoint capitalism", like Benn Jordan says in the video posted above. A different model, open source that would scale perfectly to whatever system it plays (quad, stereo, 16 channel, 30 channel, whatever) would probably pick up in time if the content is there and if Google is behind it. The manufacturers hate paying fees to Dolby and they'd be excited to adopt a free version of spatial, with a solid standard. This multiplicity of standards in existence now is just ridiculous.
If you use computer playback, the software could do ALL and much more than what an AVR is doing. It could also transmit the audio through USB audio, PCI-E, etc, without the restriction to HDMI. What we have as options today for stereo would be there for spatial and that could change things!

Yep....and by the way, everything I said is from personal experience.
I DO use a pc for playback. The key is using an app that will bitstream to your AVR. Two I use, as I said are PowerDVD and VLC. PowerDVD has an edge, as it will bitstream MP4/M4A with no complaints, and the AVR does the decoding.

 

[mandrix]

It's the same old game. If you wanna play, you gotta pay. Way it is.
You either find a way to get the DRP and cobble a working system together with 2 AVR's (as I did) or spring the bucks to get an AVR you can be happy with (as I also did). Believe me, being retired for many years now, numerous hospital and other bills in the family, my bank account is not exactly flush with discretionary cash.
What I'm saying is, no one ever gave me jack sh** I didn't earn or pay in to.

 

[Dynamic Editor]

All this streaming-only Atmos content honestly has me worried for music preservation. I don't want another HBO-esque scenario where a bunch of Atmos content is flat-out deleted by Apple or the like for tax reasons. Unlike, say, iTunes-only albums, you don't have a physical release, and I'd be surprised if someone is out there ripping all these surround sound mixes off of streaming services in a pirated fashion. (Note: I am not promoting piracy.)

 

[heavensolid98]

Thoughts?



long story short: Atmos only makes sense in a perfect environment, otherwise it's crap (headphones), as the majority listens to it. Market (for a proper environment...) hasn't grew.

Of course he has negatives about the format because he is not in it. He would have said the same thing for Quad and 5.1 back in the day. Headphone experience is also quite good- dramatic improvement on apple devices. He also never touched on dynamic compression freedom of Atmos because.. well he is not doing it and has no knowledge

 

[Dynamic Editor]

Here is another video on Atmos


I think the main complain here is that "Marketers ruin everything"

But as people pointed on this thread, for many audio engineers it is about "who moved my cheese"

This is an excellent video. More attention ought to be brought to the tedium required to navigate the surround sound world, because that, along with cost, can really turn people off to the concept of consumer surround sound.

Also, the format means nothing if it's not supported by good mixes. A good stereo mix is worth a lot more than a bad Atmos mix. The fact that we often have to question who mixed this or that on streaming services is a fundamental problem with how surround sound is presented to the public, in my eyes.

 

[sjcorne]

Also, the format means nothing if it's not supported by good mixes.

Is a “good mix” not a matter of opinion?

 

[Dynamic Editor]

Is a “good mix” not a matter of opinion?

Yes, it is a matter of opinion, but my point is that it's the mixing engineers that should primarily receive credit for the mixes, not the fact that the music is Atmos.

 

[stoopid]

All this streaming-only Atmos content honestly has me worried for music preservation. I don't want another HBO-esque scenario where a bunch of Atmos content is flat-out deleted by Apple or the like for tax reasons. Unlike, say, iTunes-only albums, you don't have a physical release, and I'd be surprised if someone is out there ripping all these surround sound mixes off of streaming services in a pirated fashion. (Note: I am not promoting piracy.)

This is why I still buy physical media whenever possible. I don't trust any business to do what's in MY best interest.

 

[jaybird100]

I found this very interesting, especially from someone who should know.

 

[sjcorne]

I found this very interesting, especially from someone who should know.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...er-interview-from-feb-2022.32998/#post-652784

 

[mandrix]

"Gaslighting your fans with Dolby Atmos"
Well you start out with crap, you end up with crap. I understand he was trying to do this on a budget, but still...
I started with a 5.1.2 AVR/system. With well done Atmos - primarily on BD - I found enough difference to convince me there was something there.
Then I built my "Frankenstein" two AVR system for 7.1.4. Sea change. THAT was enough to convince me to buy an AVR capable of processing 11.1, and with true overhead speakers,not some gimmicky soundbar stuff. I already had all the speakers I needed for 7.1.4 except a pair for side surrounds which I bought as refurbs off the Amazon. I already had two AVR's. I bought the two speakers and a Monoprice HDMI > 7.1 extractor. So other than speaker wiring about $200.
Anyway the experience was enough to convince me to buy the already mentioned AVR capable of processing for a 7.1.4 system. Yeah it was a pricey investment for an old retired guy, and I don't own any $1000 dollar speakers. But I'm good with that, works for me.

He was never going to take it to a level in speaker placement that would have given better results, nor play a BD with good Atmos content, nor bitstream from a pc, etc etc. On the headphone and earbuds, I have no idea as I don't use headphones, ever, and my earbuds don't do Atmos. I'm not a gamer either so have no idea how Atmos comes across in games. The whole thing about speakers reflecting off a ceiling at the start did not sound appealing to me. I think normal speakers elevated at least 3 feet above the base speakers would have been more of an improvement. That could be achieved easily with those tiny satellite speakers, though how good any of them sound I have no idea on that either.

I think he's just not very smart.
I do take his points on expense and Dolby licensing fees/hoopla in advertising.
This just turns more people off and he was never going to spend any time figuring out what works or doesn't or... he's just not very smart. If he had spent any time on a forum like QQ he could have educated himself instead of just throwing money at it. Or maybe he just can't hear, IDK.

 

[Dynamic Editor]

"Gaslighting your fans with Dolby Atmos"
Well you start out with crap, you end up with crap. I understand he was trying to do this on a budget, but still...
I started with a 5.1.2 AVR/system. With well done Atmos - primarily on BD - I found enough difference to convince me there was something there.
Then I built my "Frankenstein" two AVR system for 7.1.4. Sea change. THAT was enough to convince me to buy an AVR capable of processing 11.1, and with true overhead speakers,not some gimmicky soundbar stuff. I already had all the speakers I needed for 7.1.4 except a pair for side surrounds which I bought as refurbs off the Amazon. I already had two AVR's. I bought the two speakers and a Monoprice HDMI > 7.1 extractor. So other than speaker wiring about $200.
Anyway the experience was enough to convince me to buy the already mentioned AVR capable of processing for a 7.1.4 system. Yeah it was a pricey investment for an old retired guy, and I don't own any $1000 dollar speakers. But I'm good with that, works for me.

He was never going to take it to a level in speaker placement that would have given better results, nor play a BD with good Atmos content, nor bitstream from a pc, etc etc. On the headphone and earbuds, I have no idea as I don't use headphones, ever, and my earbuds don't do Atmos. I'm not a gamer either so have no idea how Atmos comes across in games. The whole thing about speakers reflecting off a ceiling at the start did not sound appealing to me. I think normal speakers elevated at least 3 feet above the base speakers would have been more of an improvement. That could be achieved easily with those tiny satellite speakers, though how good any of them sound I have no idea on that either.

I think he's just not very smart.
I do take his points on expense and Dolby licensing fees/hoopla in advertising.
This just turns more people off and he was never going to spend any time figuring out what works or doesn't or... he's just not very smart. If he had spent any time on a forum like QQ he could have educated himself instead of just throwing money at it. Or maybe he just can't hear, IDK.

I think you're sorta missing the point. Dolby Atmos is presented to consumers as a whole as the future of music listening, and packaged in a ton of products that make it appear as though Atmos is ready to be presented in a variety of great forms, through headphones, soundbars, and more discrete speaker systems. The video essentially implies that Dolby is diminishing the standing of Atmos as a whole by recklessly packaging it in products it has no business in, while overpromising how the audio will sound. Plus, if Atmos products are being sold to the average consumer, then their setup and use should be relatively intuitive and/or straightforward.

For the average consumer, setting up a suitable Atmos setup just isn't possible, so Dolby should instead be more reserved its marketing, as they honestly look silly trying to present their product as the new listening standard.

 

[mandrix]

I think you're sorta missing the point. Dolby Atmos is presented to consumers as a whole as the future of music listening, and packaged in a ton of products that make it appear as though Atmos is ready to be presented in a variety of great forms, through headphones, soundbars, and more discrete speaker systems. The video essentially implies that Dolby is diminishing the standing of Atmos as a whole by recklessly packaging it in products it has no business in, while overpromising how the audio will sound. Plus, if Atmos products are being sold to the average consumer, then their setup and use should be relatively intuitive and/or straightforward.

For the average consumer, setting up a suitable Atmos setup just isn't possible, so Dolby should instead be more reserved its marketing, as they honestly look silly trying to present their product as the new listening standard.

Oh, I get it. Totally agree about Dolby, I think I addressed that with the "hoopla" remark.
But look. If you are going to go on YouTube and tell everyone something is utter BS, you better know what you talking about, IMO. He should have educated himself better before he set off on his failed adventure. That the marketing of Dolby is sometimes BS I would think he would have already known that, or...he's just not very smart and doesn't take the time to inform himself.

If his sole mission was to show that Dolby marketing is BS, well he succeeded I suppose.

 

[srbjab]

I think the real danger for Dolby (and Apple) is over hyping the sonic benefits of Atmos (or Spatial or Immersive) audio when played back on inherently limited equipment. The idea that anyone will hear a mind-blowing immersive sound bubble experience using just a single speaker, a soundbar, headphones, or ear buds, etc. that is comparable to an actual commercial or well equipped home theater setup is inherently ridiculous - and I think most people in the business know that. Unfortunately, the vast majority of potential consumers don't know that, but will quickly discover it when they try to implement Atmos/Spatial/Immersive audio on the cheap.

Most people on this forum understand that building a really good immersive sound system is not easy, nor is it cheap. Yes, you can be smart about what you buy and how and where you install your equipment, but to get really good results it takes some real effort and money. The proof is in the hearing, though. For most of us the sacrifice is worth it to experience both movies and music in the best, most thrilling way possible. However, I doubt the majority of consumers will ever think so.

 

[mandrix]

I think the real danger for Dolby (and Apple) is over hyping the sonic benefits of Atmos (or Spatial or Immersive) audio when played back on inherently limited equipment. The idea that anyone will hear a mind-blowing immersive sound bubble experience using just a single speaker, a soundbar, headphones, or ear buds, etc. that is comparable to an actual commercial or well equipped home theater setup is inherently ridiculous - and I think most people in the business know that. Unfortunately, the vast majority of potential consumers don't know that, but will quickly discover it when they try to implement Atmos/Spatial/Immersive audio on the cheap.

Most people on this forum understand that building a really good immersive sound system is not easy, nor is it cheap. Yes, you can be smart about what you buy and how and where you install your equipment, but to get really good results it takes some real effort and money. The proof is in the hearing, though. For most of us the sacrifice is worth it to experience both movies and music in the best, most thrilling way possible. However, I doubt the majority of consumers will ever think so.

Agreed.

 

[sjcorne]

Dolby is diminishing the standing of Atmos as a whole by recklessly packaging it in products it has no business in, while overpromising how the audio will sound.

5.1 music was marketed only as an audiophile/home theater experience and look how that turned out. Can you really blame them for wanting to take a different approach this time?

 

[mandrix]

5.1 music was marketed only as an audiophile/home theater experience and look how that turned out. Can you really blame them for wanting to take a different approach this time?

Well....no.
But on some of the equipment they apparently approve is not going to render a very positive experience, overall.
Surround sound has always been "surrounded" by too much hoopla. I think the old Quad ads were less misleading.
But I take your point.

 

[CINERAMAX]

i like panning sue me Elliot!!

 

[Dynamic Editor]

The idea that anyone will hear a mind-blowing immersive sound bubble experience using just a single speaker, a soundbar, headphones, or ear buds, etc. that is comparable to an actual commercial or well equipped home theater setup is inherently ridiculous - and I think most people in the business know that.

Unfortunately, the vast majority of potential consumers don't know that, but will quickly discover it when they try to implement Atmos/Spatial/Immersive audio on the cheap.

Honestly, I think consumers will draw a worse conclusion, that Atmos is all hype, no substance, when in fact good Atmos mixes can sound stunning when you have a good playback setup. (Or so I've heard; I don't have an Atmos setup myself.)

 

[woody]

I don’t think this interview has achieved much apart from tarnishing the appearance of someone I held in high regard. He comes across as a curmudgeon- with pride inhibiting his capacity to grow.