Listening to now (In Surround!) - Volume 1

[LizardKing]

Quad by definition of its time-frame is bound to the past and the artists being of their time.. however, there's TONS of 5.1 music from "Post-Quad" artists to discover and enjoy - I refuse to accept that surround music is stuck in the past or for old codgers..!!!!

Here's a list of artists with surround music titles (some of them more than one album) all post-70's Quad era releases and while some are acts from the 70's/active in the 70's they either saw no Quads released in that time.. and many if not all of those 70's survivors who's careers continue to be relevant today .. varied, more modern stuff, even if they're not your cup of tea.

there's way way too much variety and sheer content to be BORED of 5.1 surround music - unless of course you've heard it ALL - or just hate it all...!?!

Train,
Incubus,
Beyonce,
Macy Gray,
Destiny's Child,
Britney Spears,
Kelly Rowland,
Pink,
Five For Fighting,
Porcupine Tree,
Steven Wilson,
Switchfoot,
The Donnas,
Indigo Girls,
The Wallflowers,
Simple Plan,
Rob Thomas,
Lee Ann Womack,
Keane,
Muse,
Oasis,
Alicia Keys,
Snow Patrol,
Foo Fighters,
3 Doors Down,
John Mayer,
Kane,
16 Horsepower,
Nick Cave,
Nine Inch Nails,
Hooverphonic,
Kinobe,
Groove Armada,
Paul Van Dyk,
Beck,
Alice In Chains,
Ginuwine,
John Legend,
Vivian Green,
Mary Mary,
Joe Satriani,
The Thorns,
112,
Soulstar,
Ludacris,
The Cardigans,
Jamie Cullum,
Elvis Costello,
Diana Krall,
Everlast,
Trey Anastasio,
Sheryl Crow,
Larisa Stow,
Everclear,
The Thrills,
Medeski, Martin & Wood,
Midnight Oil,
Toy Matinee,
The Polyphonic Spree,
Sheila Nicholls,
R.E.M.,
Elton John,
The Police,
Jeff Trott,
David Alan,
Crowded House,
Queensryche,
Usher,
Outkast,
Wyclef Jean,
R.Kelly,
Barenaked Ladies,
David Bowie,
Seal,
The Mavericks,
The Corrs,
Bjork,
Disturbed,
Missy Elliot,
Within Temptation,
Faith Hill,
Hootie & The Blowfish,
KD Lang,
Queen,
The Flaming Lips,
Linkin' Park,
Mark Knopfler,
Mana,
Lyle Lovett,
Alanis Morissette,
Steve Stevens,
Natalie Merchant,
Bon Jovi,
Fleetwood Mac,
Megadeth,
Hammerfall,
Toto,
Billie Myers,
Sting,
Don Henley,
Brian Wilson,
Stone Temple Pilots,
Staind,
The Eagles,
Iron Maiden,
Steve Lukather,
Take 6,
Joe Cocker,
Tipper,
Boyz II Men,
Bryan Ferry,
Frankie Goes To Hollywood,
Dire Straits,
Deep Purple,
Ronan Keating,
Depeche Mode,
Thumb,
Feeder,
Roxy Music,
The Who,
David Sanborn,
Eric Clapton,
Shaggy,
Jethro Tull,
Michael McDonald,
David Bridie,
Jackson Browne,
Marvin Gaye,
Lionel Richie,
Schiller,
Pink Floyd,
D.J. Thomilla,
Texas,
Rod Stewart,
Luther Vandross,
Paul Weller,
Pete Townshend,
Steve Miller,
Beach Boys,
Shania Twain,
Toby Keith,
Gary Allan,
The Doobie Brothers,
Simple Minds,
The Band,
Billy Joel,
Esteban,
Bonnie Raitt,
Hawkwind,
Aerosmith,
The Beatles,
Johnny Cash,
Celine Dion,
John Hiatt,
The Doors,
Olu Dara,
Vincent Gill,
Aaron Neville,
America,
N.E.R.D.,
Santana,
Blondie,
Spyro Gyra,
Peter Frampton,
Talking Heads,
Carole King,
Herbie Hancock,
Jorma Kaukonen,
Phil Lesh,
David Crosby,
Amanda Marshall,
Tony Bennett,
Miles Davis,
Serge Gainsbourg,
Mary Chapin Carpenter,
Chicago,
Grover Washington Jr.,
Chris Botti,
Poncho Sanchez,
Emerson, Lake & Palmer,
Joe Pass,
Guano Apes,
Dolly Parton,
Genesis,
Nickel Creek,
Maceo Parker,
Graham Nash,
Goldfrapp,
Helium Vola,
Mezzoforte,
Barb Jungr,
Ian Shaw,
Fiona McKenzie,
Claire Martin,
Xandria,
Steely Dan,
Johnny Mathis,
Ray Charles,
Henry Mancini,
David Gilmour,
RPWL,
Nektar,
Caravan,
Branko,
Mike Oldfield,
Willy Porter,
Manowar,
Led Zeppelin,
James Taylor,
Matt Bianco,
Buddy Guy,
Guitar Shorty,
Junior Wells,
Byther Smith,
Weather Report,
Tom Petty,
Yes,
Gloria Estefan,
Earth, Wind & Fire,
George Benson,
David Sanchez,
James Carter,
Barbra Streisand,
Grateful Dead,
Olatunji,
Billy Cobham,
Elvis Presley,
Bruce Springsteen,
Roger Waters,
Meat Loaf,
Steve Tyrell,
Peter Tosh,
Emmylou Harris,
Allman Brothers,
Peter White,
Natalie Cole,
After Forever,
Moya Brennan,
Era,
Nick Drake,
The Carpenters,
King Crimson,
Al Jarreau,
B.B.King,
Salif Keita,
Ladysmith Black Mambazo,
Alison Krauss,
Moloko,
Foreigner,
Indochine,
Peter Gabriel,
Norah Jones,
Alison Moorer,
Jean Michel Jarre,
Sam Cooke,
Mark Reeder,
Storm Corrosion,
Ian Anderson,
Richard Thompson,
The Scorpions,
Eric Johnson,
Nellie McKay,
Alice Cooper,
Donald Fagen,
Super Furry Animals,
Duran Duran,
Bill Withers,
Fairport Convention,
Rory Gallagher,
Buena Vista Social Club,
Janis Joplin,
Blue Oyster Cult,
Wishbone Ash,
Fourplay,
Bela Fleck,
Neil Young,
Motörhead,
Sugarhill Gang,
Yazoo,
Art Of Noise,
Mickey Hart,
Amon Tobin,
Propaganda,
Better Than Ezra...

..when you're bored and have grown tired of that lot, do get back to me

just when you think you've heard it all in surround, there's always more.

Very comprehensive list - but here's some more :

Kompendium
Magenta
Camarillo Blues Triangle
Rambient
Bass Communion
Dar Williams
David Diggs
Gus Black
Jon Lord
Keb’ Mo’
Mineral
Moist
Pere Ubu
Tony Banks
Ambra
Gavin Harrison & 05Ric
Big Head Todd
BT
Cassandra Wilson
Cornelius
Grandmaster Flash
Glen Phillips
Lauren Ellis
LTJ Bukem
Nosound
Philip Glass
Rebecca Pidgeon
Florent Pagny
Styx
Studio Voodoo
The Fixx
Uriah Heep
Atomic Rooster

 

[fredblue]

Thanks LK

Funnily enough I edited the list a bit as I flicked through the shelves.. added Indochine, Outkast & No-Man before you swung by!

I don't think I have any of the others (oh no, I have the Jon Lord "Beyond The Notes", its a great one that!) hence my overlooking them! right that's another 34 to add to the shopping list! :yikes

Very comprehensive list - but here's some more :

Kompendium
Magenta
Camarillo Blues Triangle
Rambient
Bass Communion
Dar Williams
David Diggs
Gus Black
Jon Lord
Indochine
Keb’ Mo’
Mineral
Moist
Outcast
Pere Ubu
Tony Banks
Ambra
Gavin Harrison & 05Ric
Big Head Todd
BT
Cassandra Wilson
Cornelius
Grandmaster Flash
Glen Phillips
Lauren Ellis
LTJ Bukem
Nosound
No-man
Poco
Philip Glass
Rebecca Pidgeon
Florent Pagny
Styx
Studio Voodoo
The Fixx
Uriah Heep
Atomic Rooster

 

[fredblue]

Thanks LK

Funnily enough I edited the list a bit as I flicked through the shelves.. added Indochine, Outkast & No-Man before you swung by!

I don't think I have any of the others (oh no, I have the Jon Lord "Beyond The Notes", its a great one that!) hence my overlooking them! right that's another 34 to add to the shopping list! :yikes

Is the Poco one you're ref'ing to "Crazy Eyes"? No naughty quads, remember!? :spot

 

[LizardKing]

Is the Poco one you're ref'ing to "Crazy Eyes"? No naughty quads, remember!? :spot

Removed Poco....

A lot of those are Silverlines - but they are "winners"...

As an example I was listening to Gus Black - Uncivilized Love - he does a "slow" cover of Paranoid...@: I quite like it...

 

[LizardKing]

Here a Mp3 sound sample (1 min) of the Paranoid track...

View attachment Paranoid.mp3

 

[inquadwetrust]

I'll look out for that QR recommendation for sure - the supplemental information was fantastic and I look forward to watching the documentary.

I couldn't help but imagine the whole Q4 Company score set to an expensive and luxurious animation in the style of Al Hirschfield - a bit like the 'Rhapsody In Blue' section from Fantasia 2000:

http://shelby.tv/video/dailymotion/xetg19/fantasia-2000-rhapsody-in-blue

 

[TVB]

Im listening to several SQ recordings that i recorded in slow speed on a maxell EE reel tape on My Teac X2000R deck. I started with Chicago VI, then Paul Revere- Indian Reservation, then New Riders- Panama red and am up to Aerosmith -Toys in the attic. I have some more room on the tape so i think Ill record Poco 7 and my favorites from Chicagos first album to fill it out. The tape output goes through a Marantz 4100 Quad amp with an SQ-2 decoder plugged into the bottom. The EE tape is supposed to be same sound quality at slow speed as regular tape at fast speed. I must say the albums have fantastic SQ sound. I really cant tell any difference between slow speed and fast speed recordings on EE tape, but im not A- B ing them either.

 

[wappinghigh]

Hi Fredblue. Where did ya get that list, and where do you buy the downloads?

How easy is it to source the surround music? They are all genuine surround recordings: correct?

Seriously

How many of those artists have produced a surround version of a best selling rock, rap or dance number in the last 5 years?

Your kidding me right?

 

[LizardKing]

Hi Fredblue. Where did ya get that list, and where do you buy the downloads?

How easy is it to source the surround music? They are all genuine surround recordings: correct?

Seriously

How many of those artists have produced a surround version of a best selling rock, rap or dance number in the last 5 years?

Your kidding me right?

Freblue can answer further but:

AFAIK - Most of the titles are from "the golden age of 5.1" i.e. 2001-2006(ish)....None are downloads (in surround)...

Yes they are(were) all legitimate releases. Some are rare - others are pretty common.

 

[LizardKing]

Another one for the list is Anathema, and one of their albums is available for download in FLAC 5.1

 

[fredblue]

Hi Fredblue. Where did ya get that list, and where do you buy the downloads?

How easy is it to source the surround music? They are all genuine surround recordings: correct?

Seriously

How many of those artists have produced a surround version of a best selling rock, rap or dance number in the last 5 years?

Your kidding me right?

Hi wappinghigh,

I don't do downloads, I like discs.

I've found the vast majority of them quite easily and quite reasonably, you just have to be resourceful - as you would when looking for & buying quality stereo vinyl pressings & re-pressings, stereo SA-CDs, etc.

Shops and stores are no longer the main purveyors of quality recorded music on physical media, regardless of musical genre/number of channels of sound/actual disc format itself.

Surround music is not alone in being something you go fishing around for online or in thrift stores now. You want decent surround discs, you go online and pays yer money/makes yer choice, just as you would when looking to buy stereo records & discs now.

Yes, they're all genuine, 100% surround 5.1 music mixes, released on DTS CD, SA-CD, DVD-Audio, DualDisc/DVD-V.

I'm (uncharacteristically, ordinarily a bit of a joker you see..) deadly serious on this, yes.

Probably not many - but if 300+ artists represented by surround music in the last 10 or so years isn't enough for you, you're wasting your time here and my time now.

Wrong - I'm not kidding.

 

[ndiamone]

I'll look out for that QR recommendation for sure - the supplemental information was fantastic and I look forward to watching the documentary.

Strangely enough - Penne had already gotten permission to go film NNN sessions even though it was still in out of town tryouts, wouldn't open on Broadway in over nine months and wouldn't be booked for recording - also at Thirtieth Street - until almost a year later.

I'm listening to several SQ recordings that I recorded in slow speed on a Maxell EE reel tape on my Teac X2000R deck. The tape output goes through a Marantz 4100 Quad amp with an SQ-2 decoder plugged into the bottom. The EE tape is supposed to be same sound quality at slow speed as regular tape at fast speed. I really cant tell any difference between slow speed and fast speed recordings on EE tape, but im not A- B ing them either.

The only reason I did EE tape when I did it is NOT because I could get 7-1/2 fidelity at 3-3/4 (you can - but it's a little bright especially since everybody recorded with 35µs EQ and played back at 50 (or 50 and 70 and recorded with the Dolby on and played back with it off - or recorded in IEC and played back in NAB just like people did later on with chrome cassettes - including a great deal of labels who recorded at 70µs but said to play it back at 120 for best response.)

I found out that if I recorded straight SQ, QS, EV or DY at 3-3/4 - if I tried to decode it later - even through genuine professional decoders - I never got the kind of result I wanted - be it fidelity or decoding ability or whatever.

So since I had to demodulate CD-4 anyway before recording it on tape since no tape recorder in those days could capture the carrier signal with any degree of reliability (yes we tried a 1-inch video recorder and a few high-band instrumentation decks from the computer lab) - I recorded on all that Genuine BASF Real DuPont Chrome Reels (LPR-35CR) that my uncle - who was stationed in Germany in the early 80's - could get for as-cheap or cheaper than the normal red-rust/white-box trash tape people were getting from Olson Electronics.

And by cheap I mean INCLUDING SHIPPING TO THE STATES BY THE CASE FULL on a MAC flight from Mannheim which is right there by Ludwigshafen where the factory was. So while everybody else was having to pay 9.99 a reel at Pacific Stereo or wherever, I was getting whole cases of TEN-INCH for 39.95 - and occasionally they'd have an overrun of 7-inch, and I'd get a case of that for 24.95 back in the days of close to DM4 to the dollar.

Then the school's band department had a nice Teac 3340 still sitting in a production suite that hadn't been used in so long it had dust bunnies and cobwebs a foot thick. I cleaned it - and the room all up - got new belts rollers and heads and swept out the cobwebs and dust bunnies - and my friends and I started recording that way because we could get 15 IPS studio fidelity at 7-1/2.

So after the original 3-3/4 IPS tests described above - all my Quad LPs from those days - as well as whoever else's fathers' I could borrow - especially once people's fathers were wanting copies of other fathers' albums - we started getting allowed to go in the language lab studio to dub them onto other reels - after which - before I inherited the deck and gearmyself a few years later - we started recording at the college's music department during off-hours instead of during lab time in class.

it wouldn't have mattered anyway because we'd already come to lab with all of our production done already - but the whole idea of doing this during lab just stuck in the craw of the Director of Music Engineering who taught the class. But by the time I graduated - he acknolwledged our talent in engineering and tried to draft us to go on and be tenure-track engineering teachers at the college - but we said we wanted to give the real world a try first just as he had for 25 years before going on to teaching.

The music lab already had in storage - untouched by human hands for over a decade - a real Tate II SQ unit and the Sansui QSD-10 (as well as a 5 and a 1) a JVC CD4-50 and 4DD5 and a whole host of other gear I later inherited - and we sat there until the wee hours of the morning taping both matrix and discrete quadraphonic LPs onto 4-track one-direction reel-to-reel.

And then when I myself got stationed over in Mannheim and could go and buy the ``seconds'' off the BASF factory dock myself - the rec rooms on base all had Norelco Continental four-speed 7-inch reel to reel decks.

So I took all the leftover 7-inch and cut the 10-inch apart to make two 7's out of it and recorded whole box sets of stuff at either 1-7/8 or 15/16 to get 16 or 32 hours of high-fidelity stereo music on one tape for the roller and ice rinks at the on-base rec centers to use and to use as background for the bowling alleys and pizza parlors they had on base.

Took me weeks to do one tape - but then just like doing the same thing back in middle school high school and junior college - it got a fat boy out of gym class which is always a good thing.

My 1982-83 transfers of No, No Nanette, Company, A Little Night Music and the various SQ Capitol samplers we did at three o'clock in the morning or whenever still hold up - if the tapes play without squealing. And then if they do, I bake em - apply the dry silicone lubricant from 3M and I get about three days to work with it before it goes back to what it was.

And every year they still blow my Music Engineering students away.

 

[wappinghigh]

Nice discussion Fred.

I actually think 5.1/Quad should move to a streaming service. Kinda like a "Rhapsody in the round" dedicated music channel.

That way "what are you listening to now" type threads...well could be answered..well..by everyone.

In other words *everyone* could have instant ability to source *every* surround track.

I mean why not? We stream movies this way now. Why not DVD-A.. or even SACD (although I'm told file size might limit buffering here)...

Anyway I'm probably dreaming

Cheers.

 

[fredblue]

Nice discussion Fred.

I actually think 5.1/Quad should move to a streaming service. Kinda like a "Rhapsody in the round" dedicated music channel.

That way "what are you listening to now" type threads...well could be answered..well..by everyone.

In other words *everyone* could have instant ability to source *every* surround track.

I mean why not? We stream movies this way now. Why not DVD-A.. or even SACD (although I'm told file size might limit buffering here)...

Anyway I'm probably dreaming

Cheers.

I don't disagree with you, streaming surround music & so on would be great, I wish surround and quad could be opened up to a wider audience and be readily available to all I really do - but its not happening now and its not imminent, long term plans who can say!? let's face it, surround, like Hi-Rez/audiophile, is niche at best. either you opt into it the way it is or you don't.

I'm a bit of a collecting nut anyway (vinyl, laserdiscs, vintage video games, etc., I'm a longtime hardcore collector, if I say so myself) the fact that some (not all) of this surround stuffs not something you can just get in stores or acquire easily through online vendors appeals to the collector in me - it helps I love music and surround sound in general, of course, otherwise it'd just be collecting the damned things for the sake of it! Heaven forbid..!! @:

 

[TVB]

by Ndiamone.....

I found out that if I recorded straight SQ, QS, EV or DY at 3-3/4 - if I tried to decode it later - even through genuine professional decoders - I never got the kind of result I wanted - be it fidelity or decoding ability or whatever.

I only have experimented with SQ recordings. After the signal goes through my decoder(pre amp out), I send the front and rear channels through their own separate equalizers while adding 30 to 60 hz bass and treble from 8k up. To me, this improves the listenability.
I have also done the unpardonable....... I equalize SQ recordings before recording them on Q4 tape and notice better separation when playing them back. I did this after reading an internet note on Marantz SQ decoders which said there wasnt a difference between the SQ 1 and SQ 2 decoders because SQ Software wasnt recorded with enough dynamics to test the differences in the decoders. My mindset is this....what if these SQ recordings had been marketed on CDs. Wouldnt they have more bass and more treble? Anyway, Try it, you might like it.!

 

[ndiamone]

After reading an internet note on Marantz SQ decoders which said there wasnt a difference between the SQ 1 and SQ 2 decoders because SQ Software wasnt recorded with enough dynamics to test the differences - I've done the unpardonable....... I equalize SQ recordings before recording them on Q4 tape and notice better separation when playing them back. After the signal goes through my decoder (pre amp out), I send the front and rear channels through their own separate equalizers while adding 30 to 60 hz bass and treble from 8k up.

Recording with Dolby at 7-1/2 IPS at 250 nWm onto chrome tape at 35µs EQ and playing back without Dolby at 185 nWm 50µs (i.e. recording with NAB curve and playing back with CCIR/IEC) does pretty close to the same thing - adds in a sort of Trident console ``smile'' type EQ.

My mindset is this....what if these SQ recordings had been marketed on CDs. Wouldnt they have more bass and more treble?

A few have been - i.e. Aerosmith's Rocks etc have the SQ mixes and encoding intact on certain issues of the CD - and no, the resulting CD is still midrangey as all hell in a number of cases because that's how it was prepped to cut the resulting LP.

 

[Quad Linda]

Do you know which pressings (catalog #'s) of Rocks CD's are SQ encoded?

 

[ndiamone]

Do you know which pressings (catalog #'s) of Rocks CD's are SQ encoded?

Guys were talking about `em on the board here awhile back. There's a few others besides that which retain their SQ encoding on certain issues of their CD.

 

[inquadwetrust]

View attachment 10735

View attachment 10736

I'm a Sondheim fan, and Company is his best, IMHO. The surround mix of Company is indeed a great one. I also have the documentary DVD. Elaine Stritch OWNS the role of Joanne. "Does anyone still wear...a hat?"

View attachment 10737

In '07, I saw the revival cast with Raul Esparza twice at the Barrymore on 47th St. It is staged far differently. There is no orchestra. Instead, the cast members all play musical instruments. It was also run on PBS. I have that performance on Blu-Ray and CD. I also have a poster in my home that is signed by the entire revival cast. Raul Esparza is a far better Bobby than Dean Jones. Esparza OWNS the role. As terrific as the original is, I prefer the revival because of Esparza.

I also got a t-shirt of the revival cast. One day I was wearing the shirt around town, and a woman says, "nice shirt, but it doesn't say which company it's advertising!" @:

The remastered CD SK 65283 of the 1970 cast features a bonus track: Being Alive with Larry Kurt as Bobby.

Could I ask if the DVD documentary is worth the now silly prices as it's now OOP? I watched the Youtube of it and I loved it but is the picture quality and audio mastering any good? Is it PCM? Sorry, I realise these are visual questions on an audio blog. I'm listening to this again with new wonder based on the nature of just how it was recorded. I couldn't find it in the 4-channel review section though. I've ordered the Bluray though and thanks again for background and anecdotes!

 

[Quad Linda]

I like the documentary, but I've only watched it once or twice. Audio mastering is OK for what it is, but it's not audiophile quality. As to PCM, I can't say, because i don't recall. It's in a box and I'm moving tomorrow. Sorry. Would I pay big $$$ for the documentary? No. I would pay big $$$ for the Quad of the original or a Blu-Ray of the revival w/Esparza. Fortunately, those aren't big $$$.

Could I ask if the DVD documentary is worth the now silly prices as it's now OOP? I watched the Youtube of it and I loved it but is the picture quality and audio mastering any good? Is it PCM? Sorry, I realise these are visual questions on an audio blog. I'm listening to this again with new wonder based on the nature of just how it was recorded. I couldn't find it in the 4-channel review section though. I've ordered the Bluray though and thanks again for background and anecdotes!