Suggestions for Audio Fidelity Multichannel SACD Releases

[LizardKing]

What about Gong - You - there was an unreleased Quad mix... according to the liner notes of the Tubular Bells SACD?

 

[rtbluray]

How about doing Blood, Sweat & Tears Greatest Hits, but using the longer, album versions of the songs instead since we already have the edited versions on BS&TII.
I know, that's completely bass-ackwards to the way it should be, but the issue wasn't corrected on BS&TII, soooooooo.......

Besides, It's a good album. One I'd probably keep in the car.

I don't think AF will release BS&T Greatest Hits, cause it would be too much repetition with the two other BS&T SACDs they have released. (Only 4 out of the 11 tracks are not from either "Child is Father to the Man" or BS&T II)
However, if they did release it, I think the track lengths would be exactly the same as they appeared on the Greatest Hits vinyl and 8-track tape.

 

[rtbluray]

What about Gong - You - there was an unreleased Quad mix... according to the liner notes of the Tubular Bells SACD?

Since that album's under Universal's ownership now, I'm not holding my breath for it. So far it seems to be just Sony and Warner Music that came to the Quad party AF are holding.

 

[DuncanS]

An much underrated album IMHO, it would be good in Quad!

What about Gong - You - there was an unreleased Quad mix... according to the liner notes of the Tubular Bells SACD?

 

[JonUrban]

One thing everyone has to understand with regard to these reissues. They are just that, reissues.

They are not allowed to alter tracks, add tracks, swap out tracks (album cuts for single cuts), etc, without going through a whole deal that basically would turn the release into a NEW release, not a reissue. And that probably adds a whole lot of litigation to the mix, including getting the artists approval and all of that crap.

Although it's very easy for us as music fans to create our own homemade dream discs for ourselves, in order for a reissue label to futz with a track list or individual tracks on a release it's not as simple as it may seem.

We all should know by now that what happens in the music business rarely makes sense to the music fans, or anyone else for that matter.

 

[bmoura]

One thing everyone has to understand with regard to these reissues. They are just that, reissues.

They are not allowed to alter tracks, add tracks, swap out tracks (album cuts for single cuts), etc, without going through a whole deal that basically would turn the release into a NEW release, not a reissue. And that probably adds a whole lot of litigation to the mix, including getting the artists approval and all of that crap.

Although it's very easy for us as music fans to create our own homemade dream discs for ourselves, in order for a reissue label to futz with a track list or individual tracks on a release it's not as simple as it may seem.

We all should know by now that what happens in the music business rarely makes sense to the music fans, or anyone else for that matter.

Jon is highlighting a key point here.

What the record label will license to a reissue company like Audio Fidelity, Analogue Productions or Mobile Fidelity is the original album and the artist and record label approved mix in Stereo and Surround.
So that provides some classic albums to remaster and reissue. But it doesn't allow unlimited rights to change the album.

Within that, there are some tweaks that are possible. For example, fixing the out of phase issues on the Surround Sound tracks of Norah Jones' "Come Away With Me" and Jeff Beck's "Blow by Blow" albums (Analogue Productions).
Or tweaking the Surround Sound mix on George Benson's "Breezin'" (Audio Fidelity).

Helpful to recognize that as the reissues in Multichannel SACD continue.....

 

[4-earredwonder]

Jon is highlighting a key point here.

What the record label will license to a reissue company like Audio Fidelity, Analogue Productions or Mobile Fidelity is the original album and the artist and record label approved mix in Stereo and Surround.
So that provides some classic albums to remaster and reissue. But it doesn't allow unlimited rights to change the album.

Within that, there are some tweaks that are possible. For example, fixing the out of phase issues on the Surround Sound tracks of Norah Jones' "Come Away With Me" and Jeff Beck's "Blow by Blow" albums (Analogue Productions).
Or tweaking the Surround Sound mix on George Benson's "Breezin'" (Audio Fidelity).

Helpful to recognize that as the reissues in Multichannel SACD continue.....

"Nitpicking" the efforts of Audio Fidelity at this juncture is, IMO, counterproductive to some of the finest QUAD titles that have been released in many a year since the demise of multichannel SACD/DVD~A releases from the majors.

Sure, we ALL have WISHLISTS {none more than me} but as Jon has repeatedly stated: if you don't like it.......don't buy it.

It's also encouraging that Analogue Productions is re~releasing corrected versions of formerly botched mch releases on SACD and I'm sure, encouraged by sales of AF's renaissance of QUAD releases, there may be future multichannel SACD releases from them as well.

With many more QUAD SACD titles in the pipeline from Audio Fidelity, I encourage continued support of their efforts.

I, for one, am uber excited that they are releasing Laura Nyro's "Eli And The Thirteenth Confession" in QUAD since I never imagined that obscure (at least to some) title would EVER be released in that format. To me, it's as important a title as BS&T's first album (Child Is Father To The Man) and certainly indicative of Audio Fidelity's continued commitment to excellence!

 

[LizardKing]

Since that album's under Universal's ownership now, I'm not holding my breath for it. So far it seems to be just Sony and Warner Music that came to the Quad party AF are holding.

Yeah - I know - It was originally a Virgin release.

FYI - It was released independently recently under the Charly label https://www.burningshed.com/store/canterburyscene/product/104/1215/

One can only hope..

 

[newbyquad]

We are not under any responsibility to keep AF going by buying everything they put out. Personally, I have been very disappointed in their releases. A lot of stereo SACD's? A Christmas Album. Judy Collins? What about Spirit 7 Dreams? Ambrosia 1st? I-Robot? Maybe those are out of reach but come on, at least try to come up with something new and amazing for once. So far, mostly a big yawn, just recycled previously-released quads. Hoffman is always talking about how much pull he has but I have not seen it.

 

[key_wiz]

We are not under any responsibility to keep AF going by buying everything they put out. Personally, I have been very disappointed in their releases. A lot of stereo SACD's? A Christmas Album. Judy Collins? What about Spirit 7 Dreams? Ambrosia 1st? I-Robot? Maybe those are out of reach but come on, at least try to come up with something new and amazing for once. So far, mostly a big yawn, just recycled previously-released quads. Hoffman is always talking about how much pull he has but I have not seen it.

I've never gotten the impression that Hoffman was much of a fan of multi-channel and I don't know if he even does the mastering on the 4.0 portion of these releases.

As far as recycling previously-released quads---I'm glad to at least get those. Most of that stuff hasn't been available for decades and many of us are only able to hear these mixes for the first time now. I, for one, don't have and never will have a quad turntable or 8-track player. I think it's smart of AF to realize they can increase their market by releasing titles that cater to the multi-channel crowd as well. I wonder what the sales figures are on these titles compared to the stereo-only releases?

As far as the titles available? I think it's clear their hands are tied primarily by what the labels make available to them. We can wish for all SORTS of titles, but if it isn't something the labels want to give them access to, then it simply isn't going to happen. It would be interesting, however, to know what their process for picking titles is? Do they have several hundred to choose from and from those pick the dozen or so they release every year? Or is it closer to releasing pretty much anything they can legally get their hands on?

It does seem that --- at least with Sony and to some degree with Warner --- if the quad mix was released before, the rights to remaster and release that comes along with rights to release the stereo. As far as those never-before-released mixes? It appears that someone/something else is involved in getting ahold of those. Because isn't it true that we've yet to see one of these see the light of day via AF or some other 'third party' label?

My hope is that, as time goes on and physical product becomes more and more of a niche market itself, that the labels see more value in catering to the MC market. My hope would be we'd even see more new re-mixes with time as the labels become desperate to squeeze the last few dollars they can out of their old catalogues, but that might be a bridge too far?

 

[rtbluray]

We are not under any responsibility to keep AF going by buying everything they put out. Personally, I have been very disappointed in their releases. A lot of stereo SACD's? A Christmas Album. Judy Collins? What about Spirit 7 Dreams? Ambrosia 1st? I-Robot? Maybe those are out of reach but come on, at least try to come up with something new and amazing for once. So far, mostly a big yawn, just recycled previously-released quads. Hoffman is always talking about how much pull he has but I have not seen it.

I don't know what "Spirit 7 Dreams" is, but the other two albums you mentioned have never been released in any surround form, so how on earth do you know that there's even a surround mix of either of those for Audio Fidelity to release?
Plus you have no idea what's really going on behind the scenes in terms of which albums they are negotiating to release, which ones are blocked by the artists, labels, and other reissue companies, or which ones have missing or damaged tapes.
This is a puzzle, and not only do all the pieces have to be present, but they have to fit together in such a way that makes a release possible.
Speaking for myself, I have bought most of the SACDs released and enjoy them all, and I'm certain there will be even more great SACDs to come!

 

[bmoura]

As far as those never-before-released mixes? It appears that someone/something else is involved in getting ahold of those. Because isn't it true that we've yet to see one of these see the light of day via AF or some other 'third party' label?

Actually there have been several unreleased 4 Channel and 5.1 Channel mixes that have made their way to Audio Fidelity Multichannel SACDs:

• Al Kooper, Mike Bloomfield, Stephen Stills - Super Session (5.1)
• Billy Cobham - Spectrum (4.0)
• Blood, Sweat & Tears - Child Is Father to the Man (5.1)
• Bob Dylan - Live 1964 Concert at the Philharmonic Hall (5.0)
• New York Voices - Let It Snow (5.1)

I've never gotten the impression that Hoffman was much of a fan of multi-channel and I don't know if he even does the mastering on the 4.0 portion of these releases.

Steve Hoffman has done the 4.0 mastering on some of the Audio Fidelity Multichannel SACDs.

 

[Clint Eastwood]

We are not under any responsibility to keep AF going by buying everything they put out. Personally, I have been very disappointed in their releases. A lot of stereo SACD's? A Christmas Album. Judy Collins? What about Spirit 7 Dreams? Ambrosia 1st? I-Robot? Maybe those are out of reach but come on, at least try to come up with something new and amazing for once. So far, mostly a big yawn, just recycled previously-released quads. Hoffman is always talking about how much pull he has but I have not seen it.

Spirit 7 Dreams?...never heard of it..I'm familiar with the Band Spirit...but no album or single 7 dreams by them that I'm aware of...and you question Judy Collins...strange indeed..and why you mention Hoffman is another mystery...he doesn't own a record company...has nothing to do with selecting titles for AF...he sometimes works on projects...but that's the extent of his involvement...fortunately you views don't mirror very many...I guess your Spirit 7 Dreams is better than Winelight...Homecoming...The Doors...Jeff Beck...Billy Joel...at least people have heard of them...

 

[wavelength]

We are not under any responsibility to keep AF going by buying everything they put out.

You are absolutely correct. This viewpoint has been supported throughout AF's existing-Quad-to-SACD campaign from the very beginning - even from AF's president Marshall Blonstein.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Brian, would AF EVER consider re~releasing the wonderful Elliot Scheiner 5.1 remix of Layla on SACD?

I missed out on the box set (A Japanese box set is now available on ebay for $400 with three SHM~CDs and the DVD~V DTS/DD 5.1 Scheiner remixes) but I REALLY want the mix in Hi Res (I have the SACD but I heard there's NO comparison).

 

[rtbluray]

Now that George Martin has passed away, I really hope that AF make it a priority to release a Multichannel SACD of America's album "Holiday" complete with the classic Quadraphonic mix, that way it can go alongside the multichannel SACDs of "Hearts" and Jeff Beck's "Blow by Blow" as a wonderful representation of some of George Martin's best-produced albums in Quadraphonic.

 

[rtbluray]

One could only wish (but NOT holding my breath) that Universal releases Layla as a stand alone mch BD~A.

It would have been loverly if Universal could have got it right the first time by including the ES 5.1 mix on the 2013 HFPA Blu-Ray, but unfortunately that was released when they were still in their 'stereo-only' mindset. (https://www.discogs.com/Derek-The-Dominos-Layla-And-Other-Assorted-Love-Songs/release/6174651)

(I'm also not holding my breath that the Blu-Ray will be reissued with the surround mixes anytime soon…)

 

[leahypc]

Ryan, I also modified my post to eliminate "schoolmarmish....." as in retrospect, I deemed it caddy and non productive.

Everyone has a right to their opinions and my query to Brian was a result of a session I had late last night listening to the Universal mch SACD of Layla (which actually sounds GREAT on my system but lacks a tangible surround envelopment...which I understand the LOSSY Scheiner mix has in SPADES).

One could only wish (but NOT holding my breath) that Universal releases Layla as a stand alone mch BD~A.

I'd like to see it get the AF SACD treatment, and I'd definitely grab a copy of it even though I have the DVD. Hopefully their relationship with Universal will take a turn for the better and we'll be able to see things like that...

 

[bmoura]

Brian, would AF EVER consider re~releasing the wonderful Elliot Scheiner 5.1 remix of Layla on SACD?

I missed out on the box set (A Japanese box set is now available on ebay for $400 with three SHM~CDs and the DVD~V DTS/DD 5.1 Scheiner remixes) but I REALLY want the mix in Hi Res (I have the SACD but I heard there's NO comparison).

This sounds like a 2-part question:

1. Since the Layla Anniversary Edition Set was a recent release on CD, and Audio Fidelity's primary market is Stereo CD and SACD fans, it would be too soon for an Audio Fidelity Multichannel SACD edition.

2. As to the "ever" part of the question, Eric Clapton is one of the most released artists in the Audio Fidelity catalog of SACDs. So it's easy to imagine a future Multichannel SACD edition of Layla in the future.

And that could include the 5.1 mix by Elliot Scheiner or the Universal Music 5.1 mix - depending on which one was made available by Universal Music, artist and record label licensing, etc.

 

[4-earredwonder]

This sounds like a 2-part question:

1. Since the Layla Anniversary Edition Set was a recent release on CD, and Audio Fidelity's primary market is Stereo CD and SACD fans, it would be too soon for an Audio Fidelity Multichannel SACD edition.

2. As to the "ever" part of the question, Eric Clapton is one of the most released artists in the Audio Fidelity catalog of SACDs. So it's easy to imagine a future Multichannel SACD edition of Layla in the future.
And that could include the 5.1 mix by Elliot Scheiner or the Universal Music 5.1 mix - depending on which one was made available by Universal Music, artist and record label licensing, etc.

.