Suggestions for Dutton Vocalion Multichannel SACD Releases

[fredblue]

It’s been said that Rick Derringer and the Winter Brothers were involved in their quad mixes- in fact there is a pic of Rick Derringer with Larry Keyes in the studio out there somewhere.

The Carpenters were also involved in their quad releases- said to be big fans of the format.

didn't Lennon do the Imagine Quad?

 

[4-earredwonder]

didn't Lennon do the Imagine Quad?

I think he only mixed a few tracks including the title track.

I guess it just wasn't his 'thing...' as if the results aren't telling.

 

[fredblue]

I'd say so. Though in the case of Columbia, when the quad mix was done by the artist's preferred engineer (that may have worked on the original stereo release) instead of one of the in-house CBS quad engineers (like Larry Keyes or Don Young), it suggests to me that the artist may have pushed for their involvement.

Examples of this include:
Chicago's quads- almost all done by Wayne Tarnowski
Aerosmith's quads- all done by Jay Messina
Barbra Streisand's quads- several done by Sy Mitchell

This is all just speculation on my part though.

even outside of CBS, i think this happened a lot more than is acknowledged, with either artists' preferred engineer or engineer doing the album in Stereo also doing the Quad.

you had Geoff Emerick doing the McCartney Quads,
Phil Schier doing the Quincy Jones' Quads,
Bill Schnee did the Garfunkel Breakaway Stereo & Quad,
Bill Szymczyk did The Eagles Quads,
Glen Kolotkin did Azteca and several Santana Quads,
Lou Bradley and the Charlie Rich Quads,
Thom Bell doing The Spinners,
Robin Black did all the Jethro Tull's,
Rubinson & Catero did the Herbie Hancock's,
Margouleff & Cecil did the Isley Brothers,
Roy Halee did the Quad on albums he worked on for Simon & Garfunkel (BOTW, Angel Clare, Paul Simon debut),
Phil Ramone did the other Paul Simon Quads,
i could go on but i have to go!

 

[sjcorne]

Is it just me, or do all of these Dutton Vocalion releases blow Audio Fidelity out of the water (Al Kooper mixes notwithstanding)?

I think AF did a great job too, but I appreciate that DV is going more for the lesser-known titles in the Columbia quad catalog- I didn't think we'd ever get stuff like Chase, Poco, or Rick Derringer on SACD.

 

[4-earredwonder]

I think AF did a great job too, but I appreciate that DV is going more for the lesser-known titles in the Columbia quad catalog- I didn't think we'd ever get stuff like Chase, Poco, or Rick Derringer on SACD.

I think we can also thank Audio Fidelity PROFUSELY for taking a chance on 5.1 SACD releases which, IMO, REALLY sparked a renaissance in Surround Reissues. If only AF was able to license their titles as economically as D~V. But the question arises......would Dutton Vocalion have taken the plunge without Audio Fidelity's trendsetting initial excursion into the format?

 

[admsh]

I think we can also thank Audio Fidelity PROFUSELY for taking a chance on 5.1 SACD releases which, IMO, REALLY sparked a renaissance in Surround Reissues. If only AF was able to license their titles as economically as D~V. But the question arises......would Dutton Vocalion have taken the plunge without Audio Fidelity's trendsetting initial excursion into the format?

Absolutely, and I bought and enjoyed each and every one of them. I'm talking about the fidelity and quality of these releases. I found the sound in most of AF releases to be very thin. I was shrugging it off to old recordings and old masters and such, but then came these... Nothing in the AF catalogue comes close to releases like this one, or Garfunkel, for example. Sounds like it was recorded and mixed yesterday. Is it just better source material, or are they giving the multichannel remastering more care at DV?

 

[4-earredwonder]

Absolutely, and I bought and enjoyed each and every one of them. I'm talking about the fidelity and quality of these releases. I found the sound in most of AF releases to be very thin. I was shrugging it off to old recordings and old masters and such, but then came these... Nothing in the AF catalogue comes close to releases like this one, or Garfunkel, for example. Sounds like it was recorded and mixed yesterday. Is it just better source material, or are they giving the multichannel remastering more care at DV?

I do agree that some of the AF SACD releases were a bit on the thin side [the Collection, IMO, was a very mixed bag] but all in all, I enjoyed most of them. For instance, Al Kooper's brilliant 5.1 remix of Child Is Father To The Man sounds simply astounding on my system as does Loggins and Messina's Full Sail. As with a lot of SACDs, in general, one has to raise the volume [sometimes considerably] on one's system to elicit maximum fidelity.

There were of course a few missteps. They never got George Benson's BREEZIN' right...neither on the DVD~A nor the mch SACD. That was supposedly an audiophile 'darling' on Vinyl but you'd never know it judging from both disappointing remixes.

And when you consider AF had to pay a $30K licensing fee PER DISC...it was a major risk, which unfortunately, caused AF to close its doors. Obviously, Dutton Vocalion is not paying such exorbitant licensing fees as how could they offer two~fers for £11.99? Impossible!

But without AF's pioneering efforts....doubtful D~V would've switched from 'exclusively' reissuing RBCDs [mostly classical, easy listening, big band] to including multichannel/stereo hybrid SACDs, across ALL genres.

 

[bangsezmax]

In light of recent Surround Developments...aka the Beatles, Guns n' Roses, Jimi Hendrix, Rush, the Tulls, the Dutton Vocalion QUAD Renaissance, et alia, perhaps Bruce may have an awakening as to the merits of remixing his core albums into surround.

Never say Naah Bruce. We all know you won't be in it for the money [his net worth is 1/2 billion] ...... but your albums will surely sound BETTER in Surround!

The one I'd love to have in surround is The Wild, the Innocent and the E Street Shuffle. It's such a beautiful work and so ripe for surround treatment (esp "Kitty's Back," "E Street Shuffle," and "New York City Serenade.")

 

[4-earredwonder]

yeay! Twangtastic, Captain! thanks Ralphiepie! not that i needed a nudge into buying these, I'm in for all 10 new releases but to get so near to "Last Time I Saw Him" in Quad.. and yet so far.. i'm not complaining as Dottie's take there sounds nice.. but a small shame its not Miss Ross' rendition in Quad.. but maybe, just maybe, someday, if all of Tomita's Planets align.. i mean, if anybody can get those Motown Quads out, its Dutton Vocalion, right!

My Blue Angel, the last time I saw HER was at this year's Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade......Big hair 'n all. Would love those Motown Quads on SACD!

 

[Q-Eight]

The Motowns would be outtasight. How about some of the Japanese Phillips (or are they Mercury?) CD-4's? I know there were more, but the one I have in my collection (as a Q4 dub) is Jerry Lee Lewis' "SuperSession". To have that in a modern, cleaned up, discrete format would be awesome!

 

[windhoek]

Mowtown? Then we gotta have Masterpiece and All Directions by The Temptations in surround

 

[erebus]

Any possibility they could do Tears of Joy by Don Ellis, with regards to the rights? I saw a copy of the quad LP at the record store the other day for 7 bucks and almost bought it.

 

[sjcorne]

Any possibility they could do Tears of Joy by Don Ellis, with regards to the rights? I saw a copy of the quad LP at the record store the other day for 7 bucks and almost bought it.

Great choice! I have the SQ LP myself (paid more than $7). I've never head the discrete mix- officially it was only released in SQ vinyl with no tape counterpart, though it is listed among the robin reels.

It's a pretty obscure recording, so I would guess it shouldn't be too hard to license.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Any possibility they could do Tears of Joy by Don Ellis, with regards to the rights? I saw a copy of the quad LP at the record store the other day for 7 bucks and almost bought it.

It was just reissued in the UK in 2017 [with Connection] but it would make for a great D~V two~fer

https://www.importcds.com/tears-of-joy-connection/5017261213174

 

[sperezmore]

Mowtown? Then we gotta have Masterpiece and All Directions by The Temptations in surround

That will be my dream come true.

Regards,

 

[fredblue]

Mowtown? Then we gotta have Masterpiece and All Directions by The Temptations in surround

yeay! the Quads of "All Directions" & "1990" are fabulous!!

 

[bmoura]

yeay! the Quads of "All Directions" & "1990" are fabulous!!

Now if they were only in the Sony Music catalog....

 

[fredblue]

Now if they were only in the Sony Music catalog....

Motown = Universal.

DV have licenced and released Universal titles in MultiCh SACD already (Swingle Singers, Mauriat, Ray Davies Button Down Brass) and they're just about to do so again with the Paul Mauriat 2-fer in January.

 

[quicksrt]

yeay! the Quads of "All Directions" & "1990" are fabulous!!

"What's Going On" is the major masterwork from Motown mixed to quad. And it's a wonderful listening experience. The album might still be selling good based on the Deluxe edition, and that the early "Detroit Mix" was of interest on both CD and vinyl issues.

Once an album begins to flatline in sales, new ideas begins to emerge on what to do next with it. Quad repurposed to 5.1 is the logical step when they get ready to do the 50th anniversary of that one.

Watch the missing tapes just suddenly reappear!

 

[fredblue]

"What's Going On" is the major masterwork from Motown mixed to quad. And it's a wonderful listening experience. The album might still be selling good based on the Deluxe edition, and that the early "Detroit Mix" was of interest on both CD and vinyl issues.

Once an album begins to flatline in sales, new ideas begins to emerge on what to do next with it. Quad repurposed to 5.1 is the logical step when they get ready to do the 50th anniversary of that one.

Watch the missing tapes just suddenly reappear!

absolutely! its a masterpiece but its also one of UMe's magical cash cows we just know they're gonna milk to oblivion. i wouldn't be at all surprised to see the Quad (or maybe even a new 5.1 remix) of "What's Going On" released in some shape or form someday, a new 2-disc Deluxe Edition perhaps could have the Quad or a 5.1, though that seems unlikely, rather in a premium priced stuffed to the seams Super Deluxe (there have been both DE & SDE of WGO already but as we know that's no barrier to doing another one!) although Universal did just do a Deluxe Ed of Minnie Riperton's "Perfect Angel" and that included everything BUT the Quad.. uh oh!

above that though, my worst fear is that Universal "find" the 'missing' Quad tapes and then downmix the Quad to Stereo and whack it on a 2nd CD, like Hip-O Select did with Diana Ross' "Last Time I Saw Him" Deluxe Edition.. i mean, seriously, they had the Diana Ross Quad in their hands and that's all they did with it.. they could've put it on a DVD in Dolby Digital at least (we'd still be moaning it wasn't DTS or DVD-A but.. )

oh well.. meantime, at least the Motowns were all released in a discrete old Quad format and there are several conversions of each Motown title 'out there'.. so its not like any of them are mythical unicorns like Isley's Heat Is On Quad.. or stuff like the SQ-only CBS mixes.. as much as i'd love the Motowns, i'd rather see those kind of things released first and if Sony's the path of least licencing resistance, there's a better chance of them appearing too!