BIG Blu-Ray Audio drive from Universal Music in 2013

[fredblue]

oh and for navigation, this is authored just like the Rolling Stones Grr..! blu-ray in as much as the track skip buttons skip forward one and back one as you hit forward or back, just as they should, which is a bonus.

with the TV on, one quirk carried over from the Stones' disc that I don't appreciate is the little roll-over box that highlights each track number doesn't refresh to then highlight the latest song playing when you skip, which would be nice and might make navigating via the TV a bit easier, although below the album art onscreen there is track number info that updates as each song plays.

also, as with the Stones' blu-ray, there is no track "added" information, no song title, no track length, no lyrics, nothing of any kind. by Pure Audio, they mean just that.

still, I'm left with the feeling right now that I'll probably end up going back to my old CDs for everyday listening, as I won't risk getting a visit from my neighbours (or the fuzz!) with those.. these BDA's are all too bass-heavy for my tastes.

ah, well... it's nice to have yet another format/mastering to clutter up the place..

 

[fredblue]

it appears at least 3 of these are compressed.. (i.e. subject to mastering "Loudness", not artefacts as a result of digital/mp3-type compression)..

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/ume-prepping-blu-ray-audio-titles-for-europe.314383/page-18

"So I've bought yesterday 3 of those 'Blu Ray Pure Audio Disc' :

Bashung 'Fantaisie militaire'
Noir Désir 'Tostaky'
Serge Gainsbourg 'Histoire de Melody Nelson' (maybe the only title that may ring a bell here).

Each disc comes with a card that allows you to download FLAC HD files & mp3.
I've asked Universal if the HD files were identical to the Blu Ray LPCM content & the answer was positive.

After some homework , I can tell that the mastering for all the discs (done by an illustrious unknown named 'Poussin') is clearly affected by the loudness war syndrome.

Bashung shows a DR8 (to give some perspective, the CD, avaliable used everywhere in France for 1 euro or less, is DR10) , Noir Désir, DR6 (DR9 for the cd) and DR8 for Gainsbourg (DR12 for the 40th anniversary CD).

Worst, nothing above 22khz for Bashung & Gainsbourg, only Noir Désir goes up to 25khz.

Are those Blu Ray really aimed to the so-called audiophile audience ?"

 

[fredblue]

I'm not in a position to draw any absolute conclusions after just a few hours listening to these few discs
(Supertramp Breakfast In America, Stevie Wonder Songs In The Key Of Life, Bob Marley Legend) but my initial impressions are that these sound great at first listen (very open, spacious, lively, impressive bass and not overly bright) but due to "loudness" (what I suspect is bass boosting and upper-mid boosting in mastering) these are ultimately tiring on the ears after a while.

this approach to mastering and presenting the music is (imho) not conducive to extended listening and so it is almost a mixed blessing that these discs do not fully utilise the storage capabilities of blu-ray (e.g. by containing several albums by one artist on one disc, let's say..) because it would be too fatiguing to listen to the whole thing over an extended period anyway.

at this point, this trial and its negatives (loudness, less than ideal mastering choices, lack of 5.1 mixes on those albums where 5.1 mixes already exist or have previously been released but are now out of print/hard to find/expensive as a result) mean that these discs will not appeal to their target audience unless (or until) these "issues" are resolved.

if Universal fail to address these stumbling blocks, imho this trial will fail.

I hope someone from Universal is reading this and sits up and pays attention.

These are three albums I know inside out and have lived with in various mastering attempts on various formats for years.

These blu-rays are not the worst presentations I've heard but they're not the best and surely the best is what these releases are striving for, so improvements and changes are needed if they are to have any hope of surviving/thriving.

 

[GabeL]

Thanks for all the posts, pictures, and information Adam. Looks like I'm going to be glad I didn't even try to order these .... for now Cheers!

 

[jasong]

Thanks for all the posts, pictures, and information Adam. Looks like I'm going to be glad I didn't even try to order these .... for now Cheers!

thanks for all the reviews from you folks who have gotten yours. i set up acoount on FNAC. trust me, I didnt know what I'm doing. I think I ordered two of the Supertramps. if I did, when Iget the confirmation that 2 are shipping, I'll have 1 to sale. my sale price will be exactly what it cost-which looks like about $47 us dollars. i'd charge about 3 dollars postage in the US. even tho I don't know any of you well, I have traded with byrdman from this site. i'm sure he would tell you Bruce In Cincinnati is a straight shooter.
I'll let you know when I see what I actually ordered.

 

[leevitalone1]

You're welcome Robert Given all three a play through just once.

Some comments that apply to all (on my setup) so far:

1.) The Red/Green/Blue/Yellow coloured buttons on my remote don't do anything.
2.) The beginning of the 1st track is cut off by HDMI handshaking biz, so go via analogue.
3.) There are track indexing issues - worst on the Stevie, for instance selecting or skipping straight to track 5 cuts off the beginning of Sir Duke! Criminal!
4.) None of these are overloud/mega compressed, they all can get a good cranking without blowing your eardrums.. but there's what sounds like bass and treble boosting in the mastering to my ears.

I'm not clued up as to how to check the waveforms on these discs to see if they have been compressed/brickwalled.. but if anyone here has any pointers as to how to, I will give it a go.

Compared to my go-to CDs they are all brighter and have loads more bass.. I'm still working out what that's doing for
a.) my ears and b.) my neighbours.

For references' sake, here's the CD oranges I'm comparing these blu-ray apples to :

Bob Marley Legend
Tuff Gong
(BMWCD 1 / 846 210-2)
Barry Diament mastering.

Stevie Wonder Songs In The Key Of Life
Motown
(530 074-2 / 530 075-2)
John Matousek mastering.

Supertramp Breakfast In America
A&M Audio Master Plus Series
(A&M 393 708-2)
Unknown mastering.

More feedback to come.

I think there is confusion on / providers, there is the Universal, Naxos, and pure audio
http://www.naxos.com/thehttp://www.pureaudio-bluray.com and the Universal offerings

 

[fredblue]

Thanks for all the posts, pictures, and information Adam. Looks like I'm going to be glad I didn't even try to order these .... for now Cheers!

You're welcome Gabe

I think you can safely say you've had a lucky escape with this particular first batch.

The 3 I bought are not terrible by any means (it helps they're amazing albums!) and I'm sure a lot of casual listeners would think they sound great but we all know that's not who these discs are aimed at and so, for now at the very least, I don't feel they are worth your time/effort/money!

If Universal get some decent remastering on board and start issuing some surround on this format (particularly previously unreleased 5.1 mixes, like the Melody Nelson blu-ray, the lone 5.1 in this wave from what I can gather) it may just have a chance.

Though it has to be said it's a fairly big IF, as where Hi-Rez stereo's concerned, lets face it Universal's track record isn't great.. there's so many UMG SACDs, for instance, that are great in SACD surround but awful in SACD stereo.

As I said weeks ago on here, time will tell.. despite feeling underwhelmed I'm not surprised, I still feel that this is after all a trial and that if enough early adopters/suckers (* delete as applicable) like me support this now, in time who knows..!? Something may come of it, nothing may come of it.. but I guess Universal felt they had to start somewhere somehow and this is it, imperfect as "it" is right now.

 

[fredblue]

I think there is confusion on / providers, there is the Universal, Naxos, and pure audio
http://www.naxos.com/thehttp://www.pureaudio-bluray.com and the Universal offerings

oh YEAH!! Confusion with a capital "C" from Day One!

The crazy way this whole thing has unravelled.. I'm amazed any product was actually ready for launch on Monday, let alone that a few of 'em actually landed on my doormat today to play around with and be
a bit "Woo!"
and
a bit "Meh.."
over in fairly equal measure..!

 

[leevitalone1]

man just to further add to the mishmash of formats, TG they are all BD at least. But it's real sad the intial Universal stuff is like that. It's no way to start this.
And I just thought, what ever happened to Neil Young and his format? Perhaps he stopped in for a lurk.

 

[fredblue]

man just to further add to the mishmash of formats, TG they are all BD at least. But it's real sad the intial Universal stuff is like that. It's no way to start this.
And I just thought, what ever happened to Neil Young and his format? Perhaps he stopped in for a lurk.

you'll be lucky if N.Young's one trick porno Pono even gets out the starting blocks... Warner will either sit the whole physical disc Hi-Rez thing out, or join Universal in this "HF-PA BD-A PA-LL-A-VA" if/when it goes beyond a trial (if by some miracle it hasn't died a death before Christmas).

 

[Dixie4]

Lovely!

Just a tragedy that the opportunity for 5.1 has been missed...

"...in order to pay respect to the original material..." should read, "...couldn't be arsed, so f*** you..."

Two words : COP OUT !!!

( and a load of codswallop !! Basically, they're saying that a release in 5.1 would be detrimental to the original material....NONSENSE !!! )

 

[Dixie4]

oh YEAH!! Confusion with a capital "C" from Day One!

The crazy way this whole thing has unravelled.. I'm amazed any product was actually ready for launch on Monday, let alone that a few of 'em actually landed on my doormat today to play around with and be
a bit "Woo!"
and
a bit "Meh.."
over in fairly equal measure..!

Thanks for all the feedback, Adam....my discs are out for delivery, so should be landing on the doormat sometime today.

 

[fredblue]

OH... :yikes

MY... :yikes

WORD...!!!! :51banana:

Talk about a happy accident..!!!

I left my AVR on from last night (whoops..) I guess it was processing TV stereo into PLII (often not that successful..!) and I'm just giving the Songs in the Key Of Life blu-ray a quick burst before I go out.. and whaddyaknow its playing back in PLII and it sounds ABSOLUTELY INCREDIBLE ... transformed through PLII (Panorama "On")..!!!!!

If you have this disc, try it through PLII --- I cannot believe what I am hearing..!!!!!!

WOW

 

[fredblue]

Thanks for all the feedback, Adam....my discs are out for delivery, so should be landing on the doormat sometime today.

ROB!! When Stevie comes, play it back through ProLogic II..!!!!

Unbelievable..!!!!!

 

[Dixie4]

ROB!! When Stevie comes, play it back through ProLogic II..!!!!

Unbelievable..!!!!!

Will do Adam, thanks. Will be glad when the DHL van turns up !!

How would you describe the difference soundwise technically now, other than incredible, unbelievable ? I was a little perplexed with your initial feedback, given that these discs are described as " High Fidelity ".

Think I need to try out The Rolling Stones. ( While i'm waiting )

 

[fredblue]

Will do Adam, thanks. Will be glad when the DHL van turns up !!

How would you describe the difference soundwise technically now, other than incredible, unbelievable ? I was a little perplexed with your initial feedback, given that these discs are described as " High Fidelity ".

Think I need to try out The Rolling Stones. ( While i'm waiting )

I'm referring to the amazing, incredible effect PLII has on the soundfield rather than the sound quality/fidelity!

Sit in the sweet spot and you'd be forgiven for thinking this was 5.1..!!!

crikey :yikes

There's still too much bass and vocals too bright for my liking.. and its less crankable once its going through 5 speakers, of course.. although I am open to the possibility that the mastering I've lived with and loved all these years is actually not so great after all, especially in the bass department.. but there's tons more detail to synths and percussion here compared to the old Matousek Motown CD.. its like the covers have been taken off my speakers compared to the old CD (but I never have them on!)...

...maybe this blu-ray is more faithful to the stereo masters (not the multitracks, obv.).. who knows!?

Thanks to the powers of PLII (I never thought I'd say that! I don't think it's much cop a lot of the time!) this disc is transformed.

That lovely warm wrap-around feeling of sound coming at you from the sides and the rear, it's all there.. I've run a lot of stereo things through PLII in the hope I might get something/anything out of them, most of the time it's fruitless.. but this is the very best lucky PLII accident I've yet to stumble across. I'm dumbfounded.

Try it when you get yours Rob. Play any track in straight stereo (kill your Sub or your neighbours will be at your door!).. then process it thru ProLogic II (Panorama set to "ON") and see what I mean.

STUNNING

 

[Dixie4]

I'm referring to the amazing, incredible effect PLII has on the soundfield rather than the sound quality/fidelity!

Sit in the sweet spot and you'd be forgiven for thinking this was 5.1..!!!

crikey :yikes

There's still too much bass and vocals too bright for my liking.. and its less crankable once its going through 5 speakers, of course.. although I am open to the possibility that the mastering I've lived with and loved all these years is actually not so great after all, especially in the bass department.. maybe this blu-ray is more faithful to the stereo masters (not the multitracks, obv.).. who knows!?

Thanks to the powers of PLII (I never thought I'd say that! I don't think it's much cop a lot of the time!) this disc is transformed. That lovely warm wrap-around feeling of sound coming at you from the sides and the rear.. I've run a lot of stereo stuff through PLII in the hope I might get something/anything out of them, most of the time it's fruitless.. but this is the very best lucky PLII accident I've yet to stumble across. I'm dumbfounded.

Try it when you get yours Rob. Play any track in straight stereo (kill your Sub or your neighbours will be at your door!).. then process it thru ProLogic II and see what I mean.

STUNNING

I've never really listened through a disc with ProLogic II ( my favourite setting is HD-DCS ) I'm just giving Grrr ! a spin, but can't turn it up louder at present ( neighbours....and I might miss the DHL man !!...doorbell fnac ered ! )

 

[fredblue]

(just as a technical aside, I had changed my sub X-over the other day while playing around to get some info for QQ member The Bright Side! Oops.. ..anyhoo, now it's back down to 80hz, there's lots of lovely bass in the front pair and a lot less in the sub on this disc now.) PHEW

liking this Stevie blu-ray more and more.. on playthrough number 3 and it really is a revelation putting it through PLII.
I must try my various other CDs of Songs in the Key thru PLII and see what happens!?

 

[Dixie4]

(Panorama set to "ON")

STUNNING

Is that a setting ( processing ? ) on your Yammy, Adam ? I wouldn't have that on my Sony ??

 

[fredblue]

Is that a setting ( processing ? ) on your Yammy, Adam ? I wouldn't have that on my Sony ??

pretty sure its just part of the PLII "Music" options?
(Not available in PLII "Cinema" mode).

my Denon has it too, so not a Yammy-only thing.