Listening to in Dolby Atmos Streaming, via Tidal/Apple/Amazon

[fredblue]

 

[fredblue]

 

[austinsignal]

Surprised to see this

 

[himey]

Surprised to see this

Have you listened to it? It is an excellent mix. Very aggressive.

 

[austinsignal]

Have you listened to it? It is an excellent mix. Very aggressive.

Not on speakers. Looking forward to it tho!

 

[humprof]

I haven't seen this anything about the upcoming album Moons and Stars by The Mavericks.
Perhaps because the Dolby Atmoslabel is missing?
One of my favorite bands, I've seen them in concert several times and they always get the place rocking. Very few people remain seated!

Raul Malo talking about the album on NPR's Sunday Weekend Edition:
https://www.npr.org/2024/07/07/nx-s...e-mavericks-on-the-bands-new-album-moon-stars

 

[haikubass]

Gia Ford - Transparent Things
This is shaping up to become a very pleasant poprock record with a very good mix - can't wait for the second half

 

[DrKlahn]

Finally broke down and got a subscription to Tidal (don't have an Apple TV to get Atmos from their service). First thing I noticed is Atmos on Tidal is mastered significantly quieter than disc based sources (music and movies). I ended up making a +10dB custom input specifically for this, gave me plenty of headroom. The next thing I noticed is that DD+Atmos seems to be just a bit thinner sounding than DTHD-Atmos. That could easily be placebo/bias on my part though.

The Who - Who's Next: Got a chance to hear Won't Get Fooled Again at Mwave in the Martin Logan Atmos room and knew this was likely to be a great mix. And boy is it. Mr. Wilson knocked this one out of the park. I don't know if it's a 10, but it's at least a 9.5.

U2 - Achtung Baby: This is all over the place. Some instances where it shines and some where I question the intention of the mixer. Is it better than the 2ch? Overall probably. But it was a pretty uneven experience for me. Probably 6-7.

SUSS - Birds and Beasts: Really nice ambient Atmos track. A solid 8, perhaps a bit higher with more seat time with it.

Madonna - Vogue: They used this track at Mwave as both an Atmos and 2ch demo, so this was mainly to compare systems. It's a good Atmos mix. I'm not really a Madonna fan, so I don't feel like I can really rate it. Judging the technical merit of the mix it's solid.

 

[pat bateman]

Finally broke down and got a subscription to Tidal (don't have an Apple TV to get Atmos from their service). First thing I noticed is Atmos on Tidal is mastered significantly quieter than disc based sources (music and movies). I ended up making a +10dB custom input specifically for this, gave me plenty of headroom.

Common complaint. If you happen to have a Denon or Marantz AVR, this can be defeated by turning OFF loudness management. Audio > Surround Parameter. This ignores the dialnorm offset flag.

 

[LuvMyQuad]

The next thing I noticed is that DD+Atmos seems to be just a bit thinner sounding than DTHD-Atmos. That could easily be placebo/bias on my part though.

It's not placebo. The streaming sound quality is lossy and not as good as physical media.

 

[DrKlahn]

Common complaint. If you happen to have a Denon or Marantz AVR, this can be defeated by turning OFF loudness management. Audio > Surround Parameter. This ignores the dialnorm offset flag.

It's off in the preamp. I did find that in a Google search to check though, so great suggestion. I talked with another Lyngdorf owner and his findings mirror mine. Some albums need a boost while others are passable.

Edit: I also checked the Shield to make sure the Dolby options were off in there too.

 

[dabl]

Common complaint. If you happen to have a Denon or Marantz AVR, this can be defeated by turning OFF loudness management. Audio > Surround Parameter. This ignores the dialnorm offset flag.

It's worth noting this applies only to more recent x600 and later models such as X3600H, X3700H.

Alas this option isn't present on my X4500H.

If this somehow magically fixes the ancient problem on Tidal atmos tracks, for many albums, of wildly varying volume levels within the same album I'd really like to know. That would be huge (to me). Tidal is basically unusable for atmos (to me) with my X4500H as is.

As has been much discussed here, we know the root cause is improperly encoded files for the lossy version where the dialnorm parameter was either not disabled or set to some other value than the correct -31dB at the lossy encode stage and that Apple does not suffer this problem because of their use of Dolby MAT.

 

[DrKlahn]

It's worth noting this applies only to more recent x600 and later models such as X3600H, X3700H.

Alas this option isn't present on my X4500H.

If this somehow magically fixes the ancient problem on Tidal atmos tracks, for many albums, of wildly varying volume levels within the same album I'd really like to know. That would be huge (to me). Tidal is basically unusable for atmos (to me) with my X4500H as is.

As has been much discussed here, we know the root cause is improperly encoded files for the lossy version where the dialnorm parameter was either not disabled or set to some other value than the correct -31dB at the lossy encode stage and that Apple does not suffer this problem because of their use of Dolby MAT.

Luckily I haven't ran into any issues in the same album. I'll keep an ear open for it though. I think in my case the preamp must ignore the dialnorm setting altogether.

Planning on seeing if Tidal has the new Pearl Jam album in Atmos and giving that a listen.

 

[dabl]

Luckily I haven't ran into any issues in the same album. I'll keep an ear open for it though. I think in my case the preamp must ignore the dialnorm setting altogether.

Planning on seeing if Tidal has the new Pearl Jam album in Atmos and giving that a listen.

It's rare that I find a Tidal atmos release without the problem sadly. I can easily provide example titles and the tracks for those titles that have wildly varying volumes within the same album

For the Pearl Jam (Dark Matter), that just happens to be one without any gross problems, however the tracks are encoded with a dialnorm value of -18 dB with some at -17 dB so will in general play much quieter than tracks encoded with a dialnorm value of -31dB

For a recent example Tidal album with the problem, see Wilco 'Hot Sun Cool Shroud'.

If your system has the problem I'm describing the first track will play LOUD and the second track MUCH quieter.

The first track is encoded with a dialnorm value of -31 dB (good) but the second track is encoded with a dialnorm value of -16 dB.

Track 3 is also encoded at 16 dB so won't sound radically different in volume than the previous track, however track 4 is back to LOUD (dialnorm value of -31 dB) if you have the problem I'm describing.

 

[DrKlahn]

It's rare that I find a Tidal atmos release without the problem sadly. I can easily provide example titles and the tracks for those titles that have wildly varying volumes within the same album

For the Pearl Jam (Dark Matter), that just happens to be one without any gross problems, however the tracks are encoded with a dialnorm value of -18 dB with some at -17 dB so will in general play much quieter than tracks encoded with a dialnorm value of -31dB

For a recent example Tidal album with the problem, see Wilco 'Hot Sun Cool Shroud'.

If your system has the problem I'm describing the first track will play LOUD and the second track MUCH quieter.

The first track is encoded with a dialnorm value of -31 dB (good) but the second track is encoded with a dialnorm value of -16 dB.

Track 3 is also encoded at 16 dB so won't sound radically different in volume than the previous track, however track 4 is back to LOUD (dialnorm value of -31 dB) if you have the problem I'm describing.

I'll have to give the Wilco one a try. I wanted to listen to it anyway.

 

[dabl]

I'll have to give the Wilco one a try. I wanted to listen to it anyway.

From what I'm hearing reported so far I suspect you will see (hear) the problem I described and this Denon Loudness Management feature is not in fact a magic fix for this specific long time chronic problem with lossy encoded atmos files as delivered by Tidal and in theory any other provider delivering streaming atmos other than Apple.

 

[DrKlahn]

From what I'm hearing reported so far I suspect you will see (hear) the problem I described and this Denon Loudness Management feature is not in fact a magic fix for this specific long time chronic problem with lossy encoded atmos files as delivered by Tidal and in theory any other provider delivering streaming atmos other than Apple.

Why would Apple be different here? Are they getting a different file?

 

[Franck]

Why would Apple be different here? Are they getting a different file?

Apple expects -18dB LUFS, they get the same Atmos master ADMBWF as Tidal and they convert it to DD+JOC for Apple, E4-IMS for Tidal but Apple did an update to ensure rendered loudness between atmos and stereo tracks is not too different especially when played on headphones. It was an early complain when Apple introduced Atmos.

 

[Pibroch]

EDIT - I'm dumb.

 

[Bob Romano]

I can’t find anything by searching. Meat Loaf - Bat Out of Hell showed up for me in Dolby Audio - I took a listen to “Paradise” and it sounds to me like they found an alternate take of Ellen Foley’s vocals and have remixed it. I haven’t done much critical listening or comparison, but it’s definitely a different mix than the SACD.

The notes in the booklet say that the vocals had to be redone because the original tape was lost in a fire as I remember. The vocals were redone by Karla DeVito.