Lou Dorren: A new CD-4 Demodulator!!! [ARCHIVE]
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loudorren
Well-known Member
Hello CD-4ers,
I will be brief today and answer most of your questions in my next posting. World wide, when CD-4 records were being produced there were only 5 cutting systems. A 1/3 speed in Japan, a 1/3 speed in Indianapolis, 1/2 speed in Los Angeles, 1/2 speed in Japan, experimental real time speed in Japan. That was it, no others. To my knowledge, none still exist, However, I have sent an email to a good friend of mine to confirm.
Lou Dorren
I will be brief today and answer most of your questions in my next posting. World wide, when CD-4 records were being produced there were only 5 cutting systems. A 1/3 speed in Japan, a 1/3 speed in Indianapolis, 1/2 speed in Los Angeles, 1/2 speed in Japan, experimental real time speed in Japan. That was it, no others. To my knowledge, none still exist, However, I have sent an email to a good friend of mine to confirm.
Lou Dorren
Justforthesoundofit
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Any chance the cartage will be available in a “P” mount. I have several linear tracking turntables that I picked up in thrift stores, and for the price of 3” belts, I have excellent turntables. For my use, they have proved to be more consistent than the pivot arm turntable that I have used for years.
I had several chats with Stan, as he always did CES. Brad introduced me to him, very interesting guy. Millions of stories. Has cut everything in the world that was difficult. I am sure he would love a go at that project!!!! He would be the man. Maybe the only one. He has done it before for all Brads work at Mo Fi.
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WEA did press some cd4 in germany and their records have a "Made in Germany" in the runout groove area, however this is not a hint that they had a cd4 cutter facility - especially because the cat.n. is done by hand and the MiG is machine-stamped. They may had used a cd4 platter cut in some other places, USA probably.
loudorren
Well-known Member
Hello All,
Lucanu, winopererThe German CD-4 disks were pressed in Germany but mastered in USA or Japan.
Justforthesoundofit, Keep watching!
Bob Romano, Qudatrade, Stan is an old friend who I have not talked to in a long time. He was chief engineer of the LA JVC cutting center. I will give him a call. I know that he has the record for the highest frequency recorded on a disk. 90KHz.
For anyone interested I have listed a Harmon Kardon 800+ that I fully restored. ebay item 330204698907
Lou Dorren
Lucanu, winopererThe German CD-4 disks were pressed in Germany but mastered in USA or Japan.
Justforthesoundofit, Keep watching!
Bob Romano, Qudatrade, Stan is an old friend who I have not talked to in a long time. He was chief engineer of the LA JVC cutting center. I will give him a call. I know that he has the record for the highest frequency recorded on a disk. 90KHz.
For anyone interested I have listed a Harmon Kardon 800+ that I fully restored. ebay item 330204698907
Lou Dorren
http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/quadraphonicquad/message/1168
Perhaps the contact info with this post still works,
maybe an RCA Quadulator can be located
(and possibly refurbished) and used to create
CD-4 master discs.
Kirk Bayne
Perhaps the contact info with this post still works,
maybe an RCA Quadulator can be located
(and possibly refurbished) and used to create
CD-4 master discs.
Kirk Bayne
I have a testrecord from Sonopress, located in Gütersloh, Germany. A sampler with Schlager and classical/serious music. Rubberstamped "Versuchsmuster".
But don't know nothing about the technology used.
-Kristian
'
I thought Greg was around here on the board for a while, back a year or 2. He may know. Does he still have a handle?
There are 2 German titles in CD-4 that were released with a front sticker only on the CD-4 run. These 2 are Fats Domono Live at Montreux and Passport Handmade. Both on Atlantic. The other 2 i know about are a Raymond Lefevre called Live in Quadraphonic and it is on the Riviera label and one that shows on ebay on occasion, CD-4 Quadraphonic Experience. Atlantic-warner Bros. A various artists lp that does have a cut from Billie Cobham that never made it out here in US. Has 4 sets of lips on the cover. We need the German group to weign in on this too. They may know more.
Next Question is, wonderful new CD-4 ability soon we think(thanks Loren) are the value of mint CD-4 lps to rise?? The rare ones they will be worth a bit more. How about the rock and pop titles? Or Japan titles, will they be worth more?
Yes, in Germany there have been in the 70's some quadraphonic activities, but together and unfortunately with some confusion and also hesitation. The biggest firm here in that time - the polygram - has made some test Pressings in CD-4 in superb quality, but has offered no one CD-4 record in Germany - the own country. But the Polygram Japan (Polydor) has made around 8 productions in CD-4 in Japan. And they have made further quadraphonic remixes - some from James Last - which are offered with Q8 in Canada. The same with Philips Germany. Nothing offered here, but some CD-4 pressings (Paul Mauriat and Perez Prado etc. in Japan. The classical quadraphonic recordings are offered very late with SA-CDd by Pentatone as "Remastered Quadro Recording".
Another germany record-firm (BASF - known worldwide as also tape manufacturer) has produced any SQ quadraphonic records - but also around 6 of this items are pressed in Japan in CD-4 (Teichiku). A chief-engineer of BASF has told me later, that they self has hold only the 2-channel SQ Mastertapes, but the original 4-channel mastertapes are in Japan. Crazy decisions by crazy managers.
The RCA Germany was beginning with CD-4 unfortunately late in 76 and 77 with quadraphonic remixes. The mastertapes for a CD-4 Sampler and a white pressing from JVC excist. But only a few days before the pressing of the commercial CD-4 record should beginn, JVC as one of the main actor in the CD-4 Scene has stopped all activities. A JVC spokesman told here, that they would -after 5 year fighting for CD-4 - concentrate all power in the battle VHS again some other video formates. They could have not further on two battle fields (especially in the difficult siruation of the oil crisis in the mid of the 70's. And viewing is for some people and managers unfortunately more important as listening.
From "Spectrum" of Billy Cobham excist beneth the track "Quadrant 4" also a second original quadraphonic mix - which is "Stratus". When 2 pieces are remixed in 4-channel I think, that the whole recording is remixed in 4-channel. But the Atlantic (WEA) Europe (Switzerland) told us, that this would not excist. And the later new mix for the DVD-Auduio is only a poor performance.
The Teldec /Telefunken - Decca) here has produced also a quadraphonic sampler. One side in CD-4 and the other in SQ. The Sonopress has produced also a quadraphonic sampler in pure CD-4. And a second CD-4 record named
"The Golden Glories". It was a test and the top mangager in that time told me later, that they have waited, that CD-4 would win. But that is not possible with waiting.
Because the german music and record market was beneth USA, Japan the third (ore second) big in the western world, so it was the biggest error, that the leading managers have only waited and waited. The sound engineers was enthusiated from CD-4 as insiders told later, but the sales departments have been the brakemen. CD-4 production in Germany by the leading record-firms would have helped for a break-through of discrete and generally quadraphony with records. But unfortunately a wasting chance. So far a little oversight of the quadraphonic situation in Gemany.
Dietrich
Another germany record-firm (BASF - known worldwide as also tape manufacturer) has produced any SQ quadraphonic records - but also around 6 of this items are pressed in Japan in CD-4 (Teichiku). A chief-engineer of BASF has told me later, that they self has hold only the 2-channel SQ Mastertapes, but the original 4-channel mastertapes are in Japan. Crazy decisions by crazy managers.
The RCA Germany was beginning with CD-4 unfortunately late in 76 and 77 with quadraphonic remixes. The mastertapes for a CD-4 Sampler and a white pressing from JVC excist. But only a few days before the pressing of the commercial CD-4 record should beginn, JVC as one of the main actor in the CD-4 Scene has stopped all activities. A JVC spokesman told here, that they would -after 5 year fighting for CD-4 - concentrate all power in the battle VHS again some other video formates. They could have not further on two battle fields (especially in the difficult siruation of the oil crisis in the mid of the 70's. And viewing is for some people and managers unfortunately more important as listening.
From "Spectrum" of Billy Cobham excist beneth the track "Quadrant 4" also a second original quadraphonic mix - which is "Stratus". When 2 pieces are remixed in 4-channel I think, that the whole recording is remixed in 4-channel. But the Atlantic (WEA) Europe (Switzerland) told us, that this would not excist. And the later new mix for the DVD-Auduio is only a poor performance.
The Teldec /Telefunken - Decca) here has produced also a quadraphonic sampler. One side in CD-4 and the other in SQ. The Sonopress has produced also a quadraphonic sampler in pure CD-4. And a second CD-4 record named
"The Golden Glories". It was a test and the top mangager in that time told me later, that they have waited, that CD-4 would win. But that is not possible with waiting.
Because the german music and record market was beneth USA, Japan the third (ore second) big in the western world, so it was the biggest error, that the leading managers have only waited and waited. The sound engineers was enthusiated from CD-4 as insiders told later, but the sales departments have been the brakemen. CD-4 production in Germany by the leading record-firms would have helped for a break-through of discrete and generally quadraphony with records. But unfortunately a wasting chance. So far a little oversight of the quadraphonic situation in Gemany.
Dietrich
Thanks Dietrich for that informative post!
Dietrich, your ability to write English is *infinitely* better than my ability to write any language other than English, and I really do appreciate your posts to this board. So hopefully, I will not offend you if I ask you and/or the group to help me understand the paragraph above that I have quoted. Is there an unreleased quadraphonic mix of Billy Cobham's "Spectrum"?
J. D.
Hi J.D. if you look closely to the M.A. list of sampler there's a "Quadraphonic Sampler" record made in Germany I posted that contains "Quadrant 4" in quad. But it seems to be the only official release where you can find the quad mix. Maybe it was done but never released.
Hello J.D. and Lucanu. There have been some obscure situations by the production of CD-4 records or general quadraphonic software. Like the unreleased CD-4 from Peggy Lee and others, although it has already a cat. number. The same with "Spectrum". The one title "Quadrant 4" is to listen on the sampler "Quadraphonic Experience" - as known. But I have heard a few years ago by a fan, who was working in earlier years by the german RCA, also the discrete mix of a second title "Stratus". In quadraphonic times there have some enthusiasted sound-engineers secretly again the top management a contact among each other.
So I think, the Atlantic have mixed all titles of Spectrum in 4-channel, but the WEA says "no", what may also mean, that it is not released in CD-4 or Q8, but may nevertheless excist on mastertape. I
self have also only the title on "Q-Experience". But in comparison with the new mix for the DVD-Audio production it shows, how much better the quadraphonic mix was/is. A real nuisance, that we can listen on CD-4 all titles with the quadraphonic mix.
But there is another problem with the old quadraphonic mastertapes - like those for 2-channel : The stability for a playback - or not. Many mastertapes are through the years unfortunately not playable. Our own professional tapes are now - and after 15 years - to play only once by a rescue action with re-recording to S-VHS tapes with a Alesis Adat recorder. So I think, there are many 4-channel mastertapes unfortunately
and irretrievably lost. So it should have a priority to start also by the commercial firms a rescue action. But who can do this or will be allowed to do that?
So it is a fortunately circumstance, that we fans have the CD-4 records, which will play well also many years in the future. And so it is together very pleasing, that we can this shortly (?) do with the new CD-4 demodulator from Lou Dorren with a new level of quality.
Dietrich
So I think, the Atlantic have mixed all titles of Spectrum in 4-channel, but the WEA says "no", what may also mean, that it is not released in CD-4 or Q8, but may nevertheless excist on mastertape. I
self have also only the title on "Q-Experience". But in comparison with the new mix for the DVD-Audio production it shows, how much better the quadraphonic mix was/is. A real nuisance, that we can listen on CD-4 all titles with the quadraphonic mix.
But there is another problem with the old quadraphonic mastertapes - like those for 2-channel : The stability for a playback - or not. Many mastertapes are through the years unfortunately not playable. Our own professional tapes are now - and after 15 years - to play only once by a rescue action with re-recording to S-VHS tapes with a Alesis Adat recorder. So I think, there are many 4-channel mastertapes unfortunately
and irretrievably lost. So it should have a priority to start also by the commercial firms a rescue action. But who can do this or will be allowed to do that?
So it is a fortunately circumstance, that we fans have the CD-4 records, which will play well also many years in the future. And so it is together very pleasing, that we can this shortly (?) do with the new CD-4 demodulator from Lou Dorren with a new level of quality.
Dietrich
He says "he thinks" that the whole album being remixed in quad, since two songs being included on samplers, and that probably no one remixes titles just to include them on samplers.
(...hope I got this right...)
-Kristian
