Music Media Helper (Tools for Multichannel Audio & Music Videos)

[HomerJAU]

New MMH Release:

Version 7.1.7 (November 23 2023)
-------------
Fixes:
MMH Atmos Helper: Decoder fails when channel Layout = 9.1.4 - fixed (v7.1.4 bug 9.1.4 unsupported in ffmpeg 6.1) @LennonCobain

Changes:
MMH Atmos Helper: Decoding - Added support for loading .thd and .truehd files - new @jonnyboio
MMH Atmos Helper: Decoding - Added option to Split MKVs with chapters (previously hardcoded to Yes) @jonnyboio

Updated PDF docs @jonnyboio


Direct link to installer:
https://reva.blob.core.windows.net/mmh7/MMHInstaller.msi

Direct link to latest PDF docs (updates to Atmos Helper tool):
https://reva.blob.core.windows.net/mmh7/Music Media Helper Documentation.pdf

 

[ssully]

Dinking around with some of the true 4.0 files I still have, I think I've stumbled on a reason many are seen as 'stereo' by my Denon AVR: their channel layout (according to foobar2k properties window) is FL FR BL BR. However, one that DOES play as quad has a layout FL FR SL SR

Does 'S' here mean 'Side' or 'Surround'?

Are quad files supposed to be BL/BR or SL/SR?

Can you add an option to move 'B' channels to 'S' channels?

 

[HomerJAU]

What model Denon AVR are you using and what’s the player?

A few years back I tested the two quad variant (side/rear) channel masks and it made no difference, both played as stereo only. That was using a Denon X7200WA playing via Kodi on an Intel NUC.

Move forward to about 2 years ago, same AVR (no firmware update) and a newer version of Kodi and now all my quad FLACs play correctly (discovered by accident), although quite a few were converted to 5.0 (silent C). I have not checked the channel mask again though.

I should be able to add a new remix tool to update the channel mask for quads.

Edit: SL in that context is Surround Left. But it can be used as Side Left. (Dolby uses naming of Ls - Left Surround, Lrs - Left Rear Surround) although the naming is different the internal file bit codes of SL, Ls are the same.

 

[HomerJAU]

Can you add an option to move 'B' channels to 'S' channels?

I presume you missed my last post. I can add a new remix option to change quad files to L, R, SL, SR if that fixes your Denon playback issue?

 

[HomerJAU]

New MMH beta Release:

Version 7.1.8 Beta 1 (November 29 2023)
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Changes:
Chapter Editor tool: Added support for M4A audio files - new @SeeMoreDigital
Remix Channel Layout tool: Added new 'Quad Rears to Sides’ option (updates quad files to L,R,Ls,Rs channel mask) @ssully

Direct link to beta installer:
https://reva.blob.core.windows.net/mmh7/Beta/MMHInstaller.msi

 

[ssully]

What model Denon AVR are you using and what’s the player?

A few years back I tested the two quad variant (side/rear) channel masks and it made no difference, both played as stereo only. That was using a Denon X7200WA playing via Kodi on an Intel NUC.

Move forward to about 2 years ago, same AVR (no firmware update) and a newer version of Kodi and now all my quad FLACs play correctly (discovered by accident), although quite a few were converted to 5.0 (silent C). I have not checked the channel mask again though.

I should be able to add a new remix tool to update the channel mask for quads.

Edit: SL in that context is Surround Left. But it can be used as Side Left. (Dolby uses naming of Ls - Left Surround, Lrs - Left Rear Surround) although the naming is different the internal file bit codes of SL, Ls are the same.

The Denon in question is an AVR-X3300W, which IIRC is a 2017 model.

In my entire file collection, I've found only one album that is laid out FL FR SL SR -- and that was an SQ decode of a quad radio broadcast, created by a fan, not an official quad release. That's the one the plays as multichannel,. The other quads are all FL FR BL BR and play as stereo (Denon only sees FL FR)

Adding a silent channel makes them play correctly, and that's what I had done already for all of them, using MMH. But to test upmixing of 4.0, I needed true 4.0 output.

 

[HomerJAU]

The other quads are all FL FR BL BR and play as stereo (Denon only sees FL FR)

Please test the new Channel Remix option I added in the most recent beta release above and let me know if that solves the issue.

 

[HomerJAU]

New MMH beta Release:

Version 7.1.8 Beta 2 (December 1 2023)
-------------
Fixes:
*Atmos Helper Decoding: Dialog does not remember last input folder used - fixed

Changes:
*Atmos Helper Decoding: Add support for drag and drop of supported input files - new
Chapter Editor tool: Added support for M4A audio files - new
Remix Channel Layout tool: Added new 'Quad Rears to Sides' option (updates quad files to F,L,Ls,Rs channel mask)

*Updated MediaInfo to 23.11
*Updated MP4box (latest Git non-shared build - MMH Installer file now 40MB smaller)

* new in beta 2

Direct link to beta installer:
https://reva.blob.core.windows.net/mmh7/Beta/MMHInstaller.msi

 

[mandrix]

Bravo, Sir, in how you keep making things better. Much appreciated.

 

[TheYan]

Wow, was just about to ask if it would be possible to add drag and drop but you're one step ahead!
Happy first day of winter

 

[mandrix]

Wow, was just about to ask if it would be possible to add drag and drop but you're one step ahead!
Happy first day of winter

lol. I think it's probably more like first day of Summer where he is.

 

[HomerJAU]

first day of Summer where he is.

December 1st is the ‘first day of summer’ here, although we just had a week of rain, cloud and below average temperatures.

 

[mandrix]

December 1st is the ‘first day of summer’ here, although we just had a week of rain, cloud and below average temperatures.

Sounds just like North Florida. lol.

 

[Mark Anderson]

I have run into an issue when converting Atmos MKV files to M4A using MMH and wonder if their is a work around.
No problems with MMH at all but when I play the M4A file in JRiver I get this

And when playing the M4A in VLC I get this

If I open it Media Player or the old Windows Media Player, works fine.

If I convert to MKA, no issues.

This is only an issue as I use JRiver for most of my listening and prefer M4A over MKA so I can properly tag the file.

 

[mandrix]

VLC seems accepting of M4A & MP4 when it has DD+ Atmos, but not so much with lossless. No clue about JRiver, Mark.

 

[HomerJAU]

I have run into an issue when converting Atmos MKV files to M4A using MMH

MMH is currently using ffmpeg to split and extract the Atmos MKV and remux into the mpeg container. It uses a codecID of 'mlpa' which VLC and JRiver don't recognize a 'trueHD'. (I suspect JRiver is using VLC code - its GPL licenced I think).

VLC should make a change as 'mlpa' and 'trueHD' are identical except for the ID.

Foobar and Kodi are ok with 'mlpa' as they use ffmpeg internally. When I play 'mlpa' in Foobar it shows as 'truehd'


I'll look to change this in the next MMH release (and I'll create a tool to convert old MMH 'mlpa' m4a files to 'trureHD' m4a files).

 

[HomerJAU]

I spent all afternoon on this and can confirm MMH will have a new tool to convert Atmos ‘mlpa’ codecIDs to ‘TrueHD’ codecIDs so M4As will play in VLC and JRiver (and others that don’t like ‘mlpa’ codecIDs. Initially it will only do m4a files but I may add mp4 support in future.

It's a multiple step process but is reasonably fast on my PC with NVME SSD drives:
Add multiple files or folders and the tool will load just M4As with ‘mlpa’ codec, then will recursively for each file: extract the mlp, then recreate a new m4a and copy all the tags from the original m4a to the new TrueHD m4a. Users can use the usual MMH output options: Overwrite, in a ‘Remix’ sub-folder or in a user defined folder.

I’ll release a new beta version when it’s ready, probably Monday AU time.

 

[HomerJAU]

Bad news on getting Atmos TrueHD into MPEG M4A and MP4 without using the 'mlpa' codecID. The Mpeg spec says 'mlpa' only.

A fix is needed in VLC as it has 'mlp' as the Codec for TrueHD. Someone has added 'mlpa' but its not been implemented correctly in the code by the look of a check-in in the source I found on the web.

Anyway, there goes a weekend of hard work... In all my testing yesterday I thought I found away to force mlpa into a m4a file with a different codecIDbut I was wrong. Now the MMH code is completed and I'm testing!!!! (pulls hair out!)

The good news is its a bug in VLC so we know where to go to get it fixed.

 

[Mark Anderson]

Is their a possible fix for JRiver?

 

[HomerJAU]

Is there a possible fix for JRiver?

Its possible JRiver is using the VLC library (I guess, in which case fixing VLC will fix JRiver):
https://www.videolan.org/vlc/libvlc.html
In the mean time you can use Atmos mka files with sidecar xml files created by MMH. The sidecar xml files contain the tags that JRiver loads into its library.

For both VLC and JRiver someone needs to report the issue with ‘mlpa’ codec in M4A/MP4 files and provide a small sample file for the developers to use to replicate the issue and test a fix. (I can upload a small test file if anyone needs one, non-copyrighted)