Quadio bundle #4. Let the speculation begin!

[millertek]

suddenly thought about these - how about some QUAD from STEELY DAN? I ask as some of you know about current licensing and can predict if Rhino will be allowed to do it....

 

[JediJoker]

suddenly thought about these - how about some QUAD from STEELY DAN? I ask as some of you know about current licensing and can predict if Rhino will be allowed to do it....

Owned by Universal and notoriously tightly controlled by Donald Fagen. No chance.

 

[millertek]

Ah - got it. Well, I guess all we can do is hope...SINCE all these owners of items that we speculate will DENY RHINO...will consider as they have made no effort to release QUAD or new SURROUND mixes...

 

[JediJoker]

...SINCE all these owners of items that we speculate will DENY RHINO...

You misunderstand the issue, at least re: Steely Dan. Although it started as an independent reissue label, Rhino is now a subsidiary of Warner Music Group (WMG). Rhino only releases reissues of WMG catalogue material. If it's not in the WMG catalogue—which includes the labels Warner Bros., Elektra, and Atlantic, among others, as well as some releases that originated on other labels (such as the Chicago and War catalogues)—it's not fair game for Rhino. This is why Rhino would never release Steely Dan material of any kind, quadraphonic or not. As to why the Steely Dan quad mixes won't be rereleased at all, that'll be down to Donald Fagen, who is the final decision maker for the Dan catalogue.

As for actual WMG catalogue titles, although the minimum bar is met for Quadio, there may be additional hurdles for certain artists and albums. Generally, living artists have some say in what gets released. So, if—for example—Don Henley doesn't want the Eagles' quad mixes rereleased, that's that. In other cases, estates of deceased artists may want to prevent a particular release. The only way to guarantee an album is releasable, assuming the master tapes are available, is if all rights now reside with WMG.

 

[user 15634]

You misunderstand the issue, at least re: Steely Dan. Although it started as an independent reissue label, Rhino is now a subsidiary of Warner Music Group (WMG). Rhino only releases reissues of WMG catalogue material. If it's not in the WMG catalogue—which includes the labels Warner Bros., Elektra, and Atlantic, among others, as well as some releases that originated on other labels (such as the Chicago and War catalogues)—it's not fair game for Rhino. This is why Rhino would never release Steely Dan material of any kind, quadraphonic or not. As to why the Steely Dan quad mixes won't be rereleased at all, that'll be down to Donald Fagen, who is the final decision maker for the Dan catalogue.

As for actual WMG catalogue titles, although the minimum bar is met for Quadio, there may be additional hurdles for certain artists and albums. Generally, living artists have some say in what gets released. So, if—for example—Don Henley doesn't want the Eagles' quad mixes rereleased, that's that. In other cases, estates of deceased artists may want to prevent a particular release. The only way to guarantee an album is releasable, assuming the master tapes are available, is if all rights now reside with WMG.

So if that's the case it sure would be nice to see a list of what artists and titles are available to Rhino so we can see if our wish is on the list. Is there any possibility of that? It would save a lot of "oh no, that can't happen" disappointment.

 

[privateuniverse]

Here is a list of the quad titles released by WMG in the 70s. The catalogs of a couple of artists on this list like Zappa and Sinatra no longer reside with Warner Brothers, but the majority of these should be fair game for Rhino.

Also, while some of these may still be distributed by Warners, there may be some artists that are not allowing the quads to be reissued.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/WB.htm

 

[user 15634]

Here is a list of the quad titles released by WMG in the 70s. The catalogs of a couple of artists on this list like Zappa and Sinatra no longer reside with Warner Brothers, but the majority of these should be fair game for Rhino.

Also, while some of these may still be distributed by Warners, there may be some artists that are not allowing the quads to be reissued.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/WB.htm

Thanx for the list privateuniverse.

 

[JediJoker]

Here is a list of the quad titles released by WMG in the 70s. The catalogs of a couple of artists on this list like Zappa and Sinatra no longer reside with Warner Brothers, but the majority of these should be fair game for Rhino.

Also, while some of these may still be distributed by Warners, there may be some artists that are not allowing the quads to be reissued.

https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/WB.htm

I'd love to see additional table columns added for "Current WMG Title" and "Digital Rerelease," with different signifiers for Quadio, Blu-ray, DVD-V, DVD-A, SACD, DTS-CD, streaming, and download. (Note: I don't think there are any quad mixes currently available for download.) Links to Discogs entries would also be most welcome. Who has access to edit these non-forum pages?

It's also worth noting that Virgin is now owned by Universal, so the lone Virgin quad mix of Tubular Bells (already rereleased digitally) could never be put out by Rhino.

 

[Sal1950]

Here is a list of the quad titles released by WMG in the 70s.

So what means CNX

 

[fredblue]

So what means CNX

Cancelled release
(a la Captain Beyond, Jimi Hendrix..)

 

[gvl_guy]

So what means CNX

Cancelled could mean that a quad mix was already done but never released. Or, it could mean that they wanted to do it, planned to do it, but never got around to it.

 

[fredblue]

Cancelled could mean that a quad mix was already done but never released. Or, it could mean that they wanted to do it, planned to do it, but never got around to it.

Steve Hoffman said on his own forum years ago that for every Quad mix that saw release, the same again was mixed in Quad but never issued, so there could be a fair few unreleased titles to keep the likes of Rhino (and let's not forget Dutton Vocalion ) busy for quite a while!

 

[Sal1950]

there could be a fair few unreleased titles to keep the likes of Rhino (and let's not forget Dutton Vocalion ) busy for quite a while!

From your lips to Gods ear.

 

[somethingcleveridunno]

Owned by Universal and notoriously tightly controlled by Donald Fagen. No chance.

I expect new Atmos mixes of the whole catalog more than I expect a digital release of the quads. Their surround discography is split across three original quads, two 5.1 mixes of Gaucho, and their last two albums in 5.1.

Aja, the band's commercial peak, has no immersive mix, nor does Royal Scam, or Katy Lied, very big albums for the band. The difficulty of finding multitracks to work from aside, doing a big Atmos binge while maybe retaining the hirez 5.1 mixes in a big upload to the streaming services seems more likely than putting out not particularly well-loved quad mixes.

Business-wise, there's a stronger case for getting the discography out to the streaming services with Atmos or at least 5.1 on everything than having quads mixed in there that, let's be real, could be improved upon anyway.

 

[JediJoker]

...two 5.1 mixes of Gaucho...

Two? I was under the impression there was just one, originally released on DTS-CD and then later DVD-Audio and SACD.

 

[fredblue]

Two? I was under the impression there was just one, originally released on DTS-CD and then later DVD-Audio and SACD.

the 5.1 on the DVD-Audio and MCh SACD is a later revision with some mix differences from the earlier DTS CD 5.1, primarily front to back balances but there are also some differences in the use of the Centre channel between the DTS CD & the DVD-A/MCh SACD

 

[JediJoker]

the 5.1 on the DVD-Audio and MCh SACD is a later revision with some mix differences from the earlier DTS CD 5.1, primarily front to back balances but there are also some differences in the use of the Centre channel between the DTS CD & the DVD-A/MCh SACD

So, not really "two mixes," then.

 

[sjcorne]

There’s also a short tom-tom fill at the beginning of “My Rival” that’s on the DTS-CD but missing from the SACD/DVD-A.

 

[somethingcleveridunno]

So, not really "two mixes," then.

How would you define a different mix if not different information in different channels?

 

[fredblue]

So, not really "two mixes," then.

technically two mixes, i guess (?) but while they are not the same, they aren't radically different enough in my estimation that you'd need both the DTS-CD and the MultiCh SACD/DVD-A

i posted some waveforms and prattled on a bit about it on here a few years ago (can't find the thread at the moment ) but i don't think many folks were too bothered so we kinda just moved on.