Styx - The Mission - coming to 5.1 surround Blu-Ray in July!

[dr. simple]

Reasonable, yes - never considered canceling either of my pre-orders and my back-up copy has just shipped from Amazon
That review just sounded like deliberate shooting in the foot... and I just didn't get why at first. Be it as it may, it really doesn't matter once you have the collective wisdom of QQ
Will share my thoughts right after my copy arrives!

My apologies. I just re-read your post, and for some reason I thought you were saying that you were going to cancel your order. Now I see that you meant, "Anyone else NOT on the forum would cancel their order after reading this review." Sorry I misunderstood!

 

[skherbeck]

Well, it sounds like we may have another "Harvest" here in terms of votes ranging from 10 to 1, I'm guessing! I've listened a couple more times and agree that the rears may be a bit hot, so I'm going to try another QQer's advice for fun and turn down the rears 2db (still enjoying the heck out of this, though )

 

[GOS]

I'm listening to Locomotive from The Mission BDA. On this particular song, it does seem in the first quarter (maybe first eighth) that Tommy's vocals are louder in the 2 rears at first.....but man. I think it was on purpose because this piece is so atmospheric, and then as the song evolves, his vocals simply grow louder and sneak from the rears...sort of over your head and to the front. I LOVE that!! I don't think they were going for reproducing what you think a band or surround mix should sound like......I think they are going for effect/mood/space.

I'm glad they didn't go for a Steven Wilson style mix. (vocals locked and loud in the center)
And...don't get me wrong....I Love SW mixing obviously...but I'm not going to lie...sometimes the vocals locked and loud in the center are jarring for me. That's probably why I prefer Quad type mixes where the vocals create more of a ghost center....for me...that is much more enjoyable.

Again....this is just my preference. If all surround mixes simply followed a standard.....I would begin to find it all rather boring. I enjoy these different ways of listening to music.

Long story short, I still absolutely dig the way this whole album/surround adventure sounds. I must...because I keep playing it. My vote of 10 was not knee jerk voting...I still think it's a 10. It's everything I want a surround experience to be... That says something for me...

 

[dr. simple]

I'm listening to Locomotive from The Mission BDA. On this particular song, it does seem in the first quarter (maybe first eighth) that Tommy's vocals are louder in the 2 rears at first.....but man. I think it was on purpose because this piece is so atmospheric, and then as the song evolves, his vocals simply grow louder and sneak from the rears...sort of over your head and to the front. I LOVE that!! I don't think they were going for reproducing what you think a band or surround mix should sound like......I think they are going for effect/mood/space.

I'm glad they didn't go for a Steven Wilson style mix. (vocals locked and loud in the center)
And...don't get me wrong....I Love SW mixing obviously...but I'm not going to lie...sometimes the vocals locked and loud in the center are jarring for me. That's probably why I prefer Quad type mixes where the vocals create more of a ghost center....for me...that is much more enjoyable.

Again....this is just my preference. If all surround mixes simply followed a standard.....I would begin to find it all rather boring. I enjoy these different ways of listening to music.

Long story short, I still absolutely dig the way this whole album/surround adventure sounds. I must...because I keep playing it. My vote of 10 was not knee jerk voting...I still think it's a 10. It's everything I want a surround experience to be... That says something for me...

Well, said, Gene. But... “How can you have any pudding if you don't eat yer meat???”

 

[rtbluray]

So far, this is clearly a very unfocused surround mix. I’m not sure yet whether this is a good or bad mix, so I’ll keep listening. I’ve definitely heard better though, so it’s clearly not a 10 by any means.

There’s good envelopment and use of the surrounds so far, but it’s the position of the lead vocal that is really bothering me. That’s where the focus is lacking IMHO.


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[Cheezmo]

If you've been following all the posts, it sounds like something IS amiss. For some posters to say the Stereo portion of the BD~A sounds better than the 5.1.......obviously something is out of whack.

5.1 mix is dynamic (DR 11 or so). CD/stereo mix is much more compressed, around DR 8.

People using Dynamic EQ, etc. on their processors often have rear channels, too loud, etc. (dynamic EQ boosts the rears at lower than reference level). On a mix like this where the vocals are equal on all channels and supposed to be "center", I can see where this would throw them to the back at less than reference levels.

Lots of reasons for people to "think" there are problems or note that it sounds different, but in actuality it appears to be fine to me.

 

[rtbluray]

This album does appear to get better musically over the course of listening to it. The earlier songs are still not that great IMHO but thankfully as things get better musically I start to appreciate this disc a little more.
The mix is still largely unfocused but thankfully as the music gets better, I tend to overlook flaws in the mixing approach, even though they are still there.


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[Perp]

5.1 mix is dynamic (DR 11 or so). CD/stereo mix is much more compressed, around DR 8.

People using Dynamic EQ, etc. on their processors often have rear channels, too loud, etc. (dynamic EQ boosts the rears at lower than reference level). On a mix like this where the vocals are equal on all channels and supposed to be "center", I can see where this would throw them to the back at less than reference levels.

Lots of reasons for people to "think" there are problems or note that it sounds different, but in actuality it appears to be fine to me.

I agree. I don’t use Dynamic EQ at all because I’m in a small room and the speakers are very close to me.

This mix sounds like an all channel stereo mix (with the exception of the side/rear channels being a bit louder) with discrete elements. Literally, it sounds better with my body turned around to face the rear wall and head in a vice, at dead center in my room. This is only my opinion on the mix. If everyone else likes it, I have no problem with that. So, don’t hate me. My set is being returned to Amazon because of a defective CD. The case is slightly cracked too but doesn’t bother me enough. I do not plan on getting another copy. You folks enjoy!

 

[peterzach]

I have listened to this 4 times now and will comment.
What to like. First off the album itself and its real good 40ish minute listen, time goes by in a flash.
I like the dynamics as they are miles better than the cd so thats a big plus as well.
The 5.1 mix is average to me. I think Tommy Shaw's comment that he loved listening to stuff(Alan Parsons,Pink Floyd) on headphones applies to the surround mix, it feels like a headphone mix with vocals right there in the center of your listening sphere with instruments around you, it is like big stereo to me as well and I don't always consider that a negative, the music still shines so I am still happy to have this 5.1 bluray.
I listened to it twice in DTS 5.1 and twice to Dolby TrueHD 5.1, the dolby truehd 5.1 sounds slightly better to my ears through my system at home.

 

[GOS]

MRS Gos had not heard this yet....I mean...she didn't even know that Styx had a new album..

I put it on...and I go to her room and I say..."who is this". Within 10 seconds, she says... Styx.
I said, which album is this? Mrs Gos says....I'm not sure, but it must be older...

Woo hoo!

 

[LuvMyQuad]

Well this is certainly turning into a polarizing title isn't it? There seem to be as many listeners handing out mucho praise while others are convinced some kind of grievous mastering error has occurred. I cant wait to get mine from the Moose and have a listen for myself. I cant actually recall ever having to turn down the rears for a release.

 

[DuncanS]

Well this is certainly turning into a polarizing title isn't it? There seem to be as many listeners handing out mucho praise while others are convinced some kind of grievous mastering error has occurred.

I think the same, it will be intriguing to listen to it after all the comments, mine will arrive from the USA on about the 7th according to the order tracker

 

[JonUrban]

I ripped the Bluray this afternoon and checked it out on the PC, with the intent of getting it in the car for the drive-time check out.

I was drawn towards "Locomotive". At first glance, the wav files look pretty equal. In fact, looking at the entire disc in Sound Forge you can easily see that this is NOT a Columbia Q8 type mix, there are no empty channels or easily noticed visually individual audio streams. The lead vocal is all-around, that's for sure, but there are quite a few directional passages within the mix. But what's odd is this. In "Locomotive", there is a choral verse from the background singers that you can see moves around the sound field from FL-FR-RR-RL as the lead vocal comes in in the middle of the "spin". However, what sorta hides this "spin" is that while the volume level of the "FL" channel is higher when that vocal is in the FL, that vocal is also in all of the other channels! (Do you follow that?)

It's like the vocal is in all of the channels, but at a higher volume at one channel at a time as is spins around the listener. In the Columbia Q8 days, this vocal would be isolated in each channel - not here. But then, this is a 2018 mix, and I am sure they were striving not to get saddled with the "gimmicky" label.

I will say this, as a new release, it has a lot more "surround" than "Hypnotic Eye" did/does, and I happen to really like that album, music wise.

So yes, it looks like this mix is indeed one that will get praise from some and a negative reaction from others - but that's cool! At least it's a new release, it's 5.1, and it didn't cost a fortune and come with marbles.

I am looking forward to listening to the entire presentation to see if it catches my attention. Until then, keep discussions going. At least we have something new to talk about.

 

[sjcorne]

Great analysis Jon!

I just ripped mine and I'm listening live from the disc now. I really like it! The concept is a lot of fun and the songs are really catchy.

The surround isn't the greatest, but it's far better than I expected. Definitely no channel swaps with this disc. I just did a lossy DTS disc for the car and I'll check it out there as well before I vote.

 

[Clint Eastwood]

I just received my copy today and Jon has nailed it...there is nothing wrong with the disc in the way of mistakes....it's just different...and I must admit that difference really works for me...but I can understand how some have a template of what they expect in the way of instrument and vocal placement....so they might be opposed to this type of mix...but the key word here is "fun"...and this title has a ton of that...and for me.. enjoyment is top of my list of "wants"...I don't vote in the polls anymore but if I did...it would be a strong 9 and part of that high score would be the creative nature of the mix...a nice change of pace...and just like this release...totally unexpected....there is a lot to like on everybody's list of "wants"...the best format...a standalone product with no vinyl or books or other accessories you are forced to buy...and super inexpensive....and a new release not some re-issue...I mean if you are at all objective....this one hits most of the list...IMO..

 

[Perp]

I was getting ready for work this morning and went to grab this disc set to return it and a lightwent off in my head and something told me to keep the darn thing. It doesn’t bother me that there’s a nick out of the center spindle on the CD, it’s got a scratch on the playing surface and the back of the jewel case is cracked. I got it cheap enough and the music isn’t bad. When I listened to it, the first thought I had that something was not right with this mix. After hearing from many of you, this is not the case. I will try and play with it some more. If anything, I have a brand new type of surround mix on my hands. One that I can compare to other mixes.

 

[4-earredwonder]

I was getting ready for work this morning and went to grab this disc set to return it and a lightwent off in my head and something told me to keep the darn thing. It doesn’t bother me that there’s a nick out of the center spindle on the CD, it’s got a scratch on the playing surface and the back of the jewel case is cracked. I got it cheap enough and the music isn’t bad. When I listened to it, the first thought I had that something was not right with this mix. After hearing from many of you, this is not the case. I will try and play with it some more. If anything, I have a brand new type of surround mix on my hands. One that I can compare to other mixes.

Good move, Perp. You can always buy replacement double RBCD replacement cases [I just ordered 10 from Amazon]. https://www.amazon.com/Mediaxpo-Bra...rd_wg=ZNBua&psc=1&refRID=RDCC5ZH14MADZVWB7VZ7

 

[Perp]

Nah! I hate CD cases.

 

[Clint Eastwood]

Nah! I hate CD cases.

Me too

 

[4-earredwonder]

I FINALLY received my copy of The Mission and fortunately, NO cracked case so now I can ascertain FOR MYSELF, without undue speculation, what the FUSS is Or is NOT about.

I have my homework cut out for me....on this dreary, humid New York evening!

I'm tingling with excitement!