Suggestions for Dutton Epoch Classical Multichannel SACDs

[ubertrout]

I've come to the conclusion that the music matters more than the format and level of discreetness, so when it comes to classical music, the performance and mastering is more important than whether the multichannel mix is slightly discrete or mega discrete. This Zander conducted-performance of Mahler's second symphony is relatively discrete but I'm afraid the performance just doesn't do it for me: it's simply too slow. My favourite symphony is Mahler's 3rd and I'd love to hear a mega discrete multichannel mix of a well-mastered first-class performance. I've got this box set of Mahler symphonies by Abbado-Lucerne Festival Orchestra that contains a fabulous 3rd symphony, but it's a live performance and not exactly discrete, so it ticks the right boxes...except the multichannel mix is fairly weak. Still, at least it's great as is

I don't know of a really discrete multichannel mix of the Mahler 3rd, which is a shame - the symphony uses a offstage instruments to great effect, especially in the third movement. I'd only heard the symphony in recordings and the first time I heard it live, at the NY Phil (not even in great seats), and hearing the posthorn solo in the 3rd movement come from above and behind me instead of in front of me was almost like hearing the moment for the first time.

However, I do agree - I'd rather hear a great performance in good stereo than a mediocre performance in great surround. And a lot of SACD labels feature mediocre interpretations with mediocre orchestras, which is a bit of a bummer.

To bring it back to Dutton suggestions, I've recommended the Stokowski Mahler 2 he made with RCA, and I assume the Bernstein Mahler recordings are off-limits. Any other quad Mahler recordings that would be ripe for a reissue by DV?

 

[windhoek]

I don't know of a really discrete multichannel mix of the Mahler 3rd, which is a shame - the symphony uses a offstage instruments to great effect, especially in the third movement. I'd only heard the symphony in recordings and the first time I heard it live, at the NY Phil (not even in great seats), and hearing the posthorn solo in the 3rd movement come from above and behind me instead of in front of me was almost like hearing the moment for the first time.

However, I do agree - I'd rather hear a great performance in good stereo than a mediocre performance in great surround. And a lot of SACD labels feature mediocre interpretations with mediocre orchestras, which is a bit of a bummer.

To bring it back to Dutton suggestions, I've recommended the Stokowski Mahler 2 he made with RCA, and I assume the Bernstein Mahler recordings are off-limits. Any other quad Mahler recordings that would be ripe for a reissue by DV?

Mahler's second symphony is joint second on my favourite symphony list alongside Shostakovich's 5th, so the Stokowski performance sounds intriguing. Does it exist as an old quad mix? I know RCA did lots of 3-channel stuff, but that's not much use to me as I have a 4.0 set up only.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Mahler's second symphony is joint second on my favourite symphony list alongside Shostakovich's 5th, so the Stokowski performance sounds intriguing. Does it exist as an old quad mix? I know RCA did lots of 3-channel stuff, but that's not much use to me as I have a 4.0 set up only.

Derek, here's a list of all the Classical QUAD recordings from Quadraphonic Discography. You may want to Bookmark it for future reference:

http://www.surrounddiscography.com/quaddisc/quadclas.htm

I likewise have a 4.2 MAIN SYSTEM. I have a 5.1 in my bedroom where I watch movies. Don't miss the center channel in my main system at all.

BTW, here's a listing of ALL the Rock/Pop/Jazz QUAD recordings from Quadraphonic Discography:

http://www.surrounddiscography.com/quaddisc/quadpall.htm

 

[ubertrout]

It turns out the recording is on Youtube

It was issued in Dolby Surround by RCA, but that's a half-measure.

 

[windhoek]

It was issued in Dolby Surround by RCA, but that's a half-measure.

Does that mean it's a multichannel-lite release?

 

[4-earredwonder]

Does that mean it's a multichannel-lite release?

It WAS released by RCA as a Quadradisc [CD~4] so it could be discrete, Derek.

ARD1-0852 (CD4) [2 LP] GUSTAV MAHLER: Symphony No. 2 in c,
"Resurrection" (Price, Fassbaender, Stokowski/London Symphony
Orchestra

 

[windhoek]

Yeah, it could be. The words 'half-measure' made me think ubertrout has info on it and not wholly positive on the discrete front. Hopefully, ubertrout can clarify what he meant by half-measure. Over to you, ubertrout...

 

[4-earredwonder]

Yeah, it could be. The words 'half-measure' made me think ubertrout has info on it and not wholly positive on the discrete front. Hopefully, ubertrout can clarify what he meant by half-measure. Over to you, ubertrout...

Ubertrout may have been alluding to the fact that unless one has a new Surround Master in their system, Dolby Surround on most systems just adds plain vanilla ambience to the rears.

This would indeed be a nice two~fer QUAD SACD release from the folks at Dutton Vocalion.

 

[windhoek]

Ubertrout may have been alluding to the fact that unless one has a new Surround Master in their system, Dolby Surround on most systems just adds plain vanilla ambience to the rears.

This would indeed be a nice two~fer QUAD SACD release from the folks at Dutton Vocalion.

Ah, so the format is half-measure as opposed to the performance or recording and its latent potential. That makes sense - let's hope DV give it a go

 

[ubertrout]

Looking at the Sony list @quadtrade posted (https://www.quadraphonicquad.com/fo...s/sony-titles-official-releases-post-2.24914/), I noticed a lot of Pinchas Zukerman. Those who have been purchasing these recordings know that Dutton's issue of Zukerman playing/conducting Vivaldi with the English Chamber Orchestra is one of the best of the bunch, with a first-class mix and sound quality (the recordings were done at Abbey Road, fwiw): https://www.duttonvocalion.co.uk/proddetail.php?prod=CDLX7335&cat=2. On that disc were the first 8 violin concertos from Vivaldi's Opus 8 set of 12 (the first four concertos are the famous Four Seasons). However, Zukerman recorded all 12 - the remaining LP is listed on the Sony list, and more info is available here: https://www.discogs.com/Zukerman-Pl...ertos-Nos-9-10-11-And-12-From/release/8174728.

To fill up the disc, I'd suggest the three concert pieces (two Rondos and an Adagio) Zukerman recorded with the same forces for this LP, also on the list: https://www.discogs.com/Mozart-Pinc...in-Concerto-No-2-In-D-Major-K/release/6664738. As far as I can tell they've never been released on CD. If so inclined D-V could also do a separate release of the quad mixes of the first 3 violin concertos Mozart wrote, which also don't seem to have been released on CD (Sony has instead repeatedly reissued the recordings Zukerman made a decade later with the St. Paul Chamber Orchestra (once again, these are on the Sony list linked to above).

 

[ubertrout]

March is on the horizon, I wonder what the Wizard of Watford is brewing up for us? As he stirs his cauldron Fredblue is whispering Motown Motown into his ear Steely Dave has dropped off a batch of tapes he acquired during his secret mission to the Eastern Bloc, is he now writing new liner notes? Will Mr Dutton reach into the Teutonic forests and produce a Two Fer of quad Heino? Does he have a hand reaching into the PDU archives? Will he introduce Quad reissues from the Supraphon label?
Or are we getting Robert Goulet and Jim Nabors? Who knows, as he stirs and stirs Simon is flipping a coin in the basement and assigning tracking numbers at random muttering Now that's an easy pound.........

You probably already know about the Supraphone quad SACDs from Japan, but just in case... https://www.hraudio.net/music.php?format=10&genre=0&label=582&page=1

 

[jefe1]

You probably already know about the Supraphone quad SACDs from Japan, but just in case... https://www.hraudio.net/music.php?format=10&genre=0&label=582&page=1

No I didn't! I have a few of those on vinyl two of the Mahler symphonies.
Didn't know about these releases. How do they sound? As I recall the Supraphon vinyl sounded pretty good.

Still DV could make a play for some of them.

 

[winopener]

Intresting that these Supraphon have cat.n COGQ, same as the Tomita SACD, so they are from Denon Japan.

 

[ubertrout]

No I didn't! I have a few of those on vinyl two of the Mahler symphonies.
Didn't know about these releases. How do they sound? As I recall the Supraphon vinyl sounded pretty good.

Still DV could make a play for some of them.

I only have Ma Vlast, but it sounds pretty good!

DV could make a play for them I suppose, although I'm happy with them mining Sony's vaults tbh - plenty more there.

 

[bluelightning]

Here is a suggestion for another quad organ recording

MQ-33514 (SQ) E. Power Biggs: The Four Antiphonal Organs of the Cathedral of Freiburg/Played Simultaneously (G. F. HANDEL: Fan- fare from "Samson"; Pomposa from "Water Music"; Fugue in G. Sarabande, & Impertinence from "Aylasford pieces". W. A.MOZART: Adiagio, originally for Glass Harmonica. DIETRICH BUXTEHUIDE: Toccata & Fugue in F. HENRY PURCELL: Fanfare in G: Trumpet Tune "Bonduca"; Ayre in G; Rigaudon; Voluntary in C. JOHANN LUDWIG KREBS: Fugue in B.A.C,H. BANCHIRI: Dialog per Orguno. PADRE ANTONIO SOLER: The Emperor's Fanfare. ANDRE CAPRA: Rigaudon)

 

[4-earredwonder]

Here is a suggestion for another quad organ recording

MQ-33514 (SQ) E. Power Biggs: The Four Antiphonal Organs of the Cathedral of Freiburg/Played Simultaneously (G. F. HANDEL: Fan- fare from "Samson"; Pomposa from "Water Music"; Fugue in G. Sarabande, & Impertinence from "Aylasford pieces". W. A.MOZART: Adiagio, originally for Glass Harmonica. DIETRICH BUXTEHUIDE: Toccata & Fugue in F. HENRY PURCELL: Fanfare in G: Trumpet Tune "Bonduca"; Ayre in G; Rigaudon; Voluntary in C. JOHANN LUDWIG KREBS: Fugue in B.A.C,H. BANCHIRI: Dialog per Orguno. PADRE ANTONIO SOLER: The Emperor's Fanfare. ANDRE CAPRA: Rigaudon)

A MOST excellent suggestion. Doubtful the SQ vinyl disc could ever do full justice to this monumental recording. I'd buy it in a ❤ beat!

 

[ubertrout]

Here is a suggestion for another quad organ recording

MQ-33514 (SQ) E. Power Biggs: The Four Antiphonal Organs of the Cathedral of Freiburg/Played Simultaneously (G. F. HANDEL: Fan- fare from "Samson"; Pomposa from "Water Music"; Fugue in G. Sarabande, & Impertinence from "Aylasford pieces". W. A.MOZART: Adiagio, originally for Glass Harmonica. DIETRICH BUXTEHUIDE: Toccata & Fugue in F. HENRY PURCELL: Fanfare in G: Trumpet Tune "Bonduca"; Ayre in G; Rigaudon; Voluntary in C. JOHANN LUDWIG KREBS: Fugue in B.A.C,H. BANCHIRI: Dialog per Orguno. PADRE ANTONIO SOLER: The Emperor's Fanfare. ANDRE CAPRA: Rigaudon)

Great suggestion! Perhaps as a coupling:

MQ-31193 (SQ)/MAQ-31193 (Q8) E. Power Biggs; Music for Organ, Brass & Percussion (GIGOUT: Grand Chorus in Dialogue. MARCEL DUPRE: Heroic Poem. ANDRE CAMPRA: Rigaudon. CHARLES MARIE WIDOR: Lord, Save Thy People. R. STRAUSS: Processional Entry. H. PURCELL: Antiphonal Voluntary. SIGFRID KARG-ELERT: Praise the Lord with Drums & Cymbals; Triumphal March. JEREMIAH CLARK: Trumpet Voluntary)

And while we're talking about E. Power Biggs, a few other possible combos, providing both fit on one disc:

MQ-31424 (SQ)/MAQ-31424 (Q8) E. Power Biggs: Bach organ Favorites, Vol. 5 (J. S. BACH: Fantasy & Fugue in g, S.542; Chorale Prelude "Jesu, meine Freude" S.753; Prelude & Fugue in b, "Great" S.544; Fantasy in G, S.572; Chorale Prelude "Wirglauben all' an einen Gott, Schopfer" S.680; Prelude & Fugue in C, S.545)
and
MQ-32791 (SQ)/MAQ-32791 (DQ8) E. Power Biggs: Bach Organ Favorites, Vol. 6 (J. S. BACH: Concerto No. 1 in G, S.592 Concerto No. 2 in a, S.593; Sonata No. 1 in E sharp; Sonata No. 5 in C)

MQ-33205 (SQ)/MAQ-33205 (DQ8) E. Power Biggs: Plays Scott Joplin on the Pedal Harpsichord, Vol. 2 (The Cascades; The Chrysanthemum; Something Doing; Magnetic Rag; Felicity Rag; The Entertainer; Paragon Rag; Sugar Cane; Scott Joplin’s New Rag; Great Crush Collision)
and
M-34129* (SQ) E. Power Biggs: Stars & Stripes Forever/Two Centuries of Heroic Music in America

MQ-32933 (SQ)/MAQ-32933 (DQ8) J. S. BACH: Toccata & Fugue in dfor Organ, S.565; Tocata & Fugue in F for Organ, S.540; Toccata & Fugue in d for Organ, "Dorian" S.538; Toccata, Adagio & Fugue in C for Organ, S.564 (Biggs) (this is the rare Biggs Sony SACD, but repeated questions have been raised as to its accuracy to the quad mix)
and
M-34272* (SQ) J.S. BACH1: Jesu, Joy of Man's Desiring (from Cantata 147); Sinfonias from Cantatas 29, 35, 49, 146 & 169; Sonata from Cantata 31 (Biggs, Organ)

 

[4-earredwonder]

that Mahavishnu Orchestra Live album Quad mix is, as sjcorne says, great. i have to be in the mood for it though tbh, some days i'll play it and its fun but a couple of times its just been a bit of racket that rattled my fillings!

there wasn't a lot of Jazz Fusion in Quad in the first place, top of my want list from DV in that sort of sphere that feels doable would be Herbie Hancock's "Sextant", the Quad mix is incredible, its a Columbia Quad held by Sony, we already got Headhunters & Thrust, i'm hopeful!

sticking with CBS/Columbia but at the other end of the Jazz spectrum, i'd love it if DV were to do Maynard Ferguson's "Conquistador".. Blood Sweat & Tears' "Mirror Image".. oh and Ramsey Lewis' "Upendo Ni Pamoja" is a cool Jazz Quad.

there's a number of nice CTI Quads remaining DV could still do (Stanley Turrentine, Grover Washington Jr., Don Sebesky, Johnny Hammond)

if the Arista Quads are available i'd love The Brecker Brothers "Back To Back".

if Vanguard Quads are on the table, "Introducing Larry Coryell And The Eleventh House" would be top of my Jazz/Fusion wantlist.

if DV ever get to do any WEA stuff there's some nice Quads, Mingus Moves, Duke Ellington's New Orleans Suite, Gil Evans' "Svengali", etc.

i'm not sure how much if any of the numerous ABC/Impulse! Jazz Quads exist in discrete master tape form but there's some cool albums in amongst them too.

not sure who controls the Fantasy/Prestige/Milestone catalogue now (Concord?) there's a few cool Quads (Turrentine, McCoy Tyner, Woody Herman, Blackbyrds).

on A&M there's cool things like the 2 x Chuck Mangione Quads and Quincy Jones' 4 Quad albums but the mastertapes probably aren't available.

the Stax Isaac Hayes Quads would go down a storm, especially Shaft, Tough Guys & Truck Turner.. love those 3 in particular but if they did the lot you wouldn't hear me complaining!

perhaps EMI's Quads might be up for licensing? if so, i'd love DV to do Grappelli & Menuhin's "Fascinatin' Rhythm", the Quad mix is.. scrummy.

no idea who has the rights to the Groove Merchant catalogue but Buddy Rich's "Roar Of '74" is a great Quad.

whatever they put out next, hope there's an announcement from DV soon, fair chomping at the bit here so i is!

AS USUAL, ADAM, I'LL GIVE TWO BIG THUMBS WAY UP FOR ALL YOUR MULTICHANNEL REQUESTS! BTW, WARNERS now controls the EMI/ANGEL Classical catalogue and I would love to hear that Grappelli/Menuhin "FASCINATING RHYTHM" QUAD as a D~V SACD title. I own so many ANGEL QUAD LPs [most of them are shitty ticky poppy affairs] and would love to hear them in 'unadulterated' D~V QUAD remasterings .........

Will the Wizard of Watford grant ye your wishes? One could only hope.

Yes, I want to be a REAL boy ...but with a GIGUNDUS D~V QUAD COLLECTION

AND I SECOND THAT MOTION!

 

[4-earredwonder]

Sure Hope the Wizard of Watford shows Us some:



❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

 

[GOS]

I go to Dutton site every day to see if something shows up....man...I'm getting itchy.