70'S QUAD FM SYNDICATIONS AND SIMULCASTS-OTHER THAN BBC, KBFH

[quadaholic]

That's what I expect, although I'm sure there are some folks on here that know this stuff way better than I. There were supposedly other stations in the country broadcasting in quad, at least for a time, and I have to assume that there would have to be some stereo stuff that have to be "fudged" up to four channels, as there couldn't have been enough encoded material to broadcast day in day out. Kind of like the early days of MTV, where they started with something like 70 video clips and crossed their fingers that the industry would catch up to them.

Well you guys are getting me excited. I loved the KBFH as a teenager and listened to it often. At the time I had a Radio Shack basic SQ decoder but for some reason was under the impression they had broadcast in QS. My bad, but the decoder I had wasn't going to do much, and who knows what the phasing was like by the time it reached my receiver. In 1976 I made a recording of a show that was referred to as 'The Best of the Biscuits' eating me to assume it was a rebroadcast of an earlier recording. It was Linda Ronstadt. Now me being into quad and it being 1976, it was recorded onto a Maxell 8 Track tape. Again, its terrifying to think what the phasing was like, but I am fairly sure that I still have that tape (don't judge me) so now I am thinking I want to dig it out and run it through my Audionics S&IC. What could go wrong?

Marsden,
If you wanted to make it simpler for yourself, you can find a good quality air check version of this particular show at one of the trader sites. It's a good show, but not sure what it would sound like if decoded.

 

[Marcsten]

Marsden,
If you wanted to make it simpler for yourself, you can find a good quality air check version of this particular show at one of the trader sites. It's a good show, but not sure what it would sound like if decoded.

Hey thanks! I have been off QQ for a few years because of something I used to do called working. Now that I am retired I have time for all this again! So what sites can I check for these shows? I Have looked at the usual Ebay-type sites over the years and never found anything helpful on these broadcasts Thanks!!

 

[quadaholic]

Marcsten, I am not sure what the rules are concerning chat about download sites. You can PM me if you like.

 

[Marcsten]

Good Point!

 

[Unk]

Reading about quad broadcasting in the 1970s reminded me of some experimental broadcasts where two stereo FM stations would team up to present a discrete four-channel presentation with one station transmitting the front channels and the other station the rear two. I know the Bay Area was a hotbed for such experimentation and I'm sure other areas did as well. I would be curious to hear of any recollections of these quad broadcasts. The complexity of both transmitting and receiving these programs made them a very special event.

 

[quadaholic]

Reading about quad broadcasting in the 1970s reminded me of some experimental broadcasts where two stereo FM stations would team up to present a discrete four-channel presentation with one station transmitting the front channels and the other station the rear two. I know the Bay Area was a hotbed for such experimentation and I'm sure other areas did as well. I would be curious to hear of any recollections of these quad broadcasts. The complexity of both transmitting and receiving these programs made them a very special event.

Unk,
If you haven't all ready, you should check out Mark Andersons quad discography page. He has some info regarding this as well as everything else quad. There were some broadcasts of the grateful dead that happened in San Francisco, but so far no complete tapes (i.e. both stations) have been put found. The Boston Symphony did similar stuff early on, and eventually went on to SQ (and even some QS, according to someone who works in their archive). Another Boston show that I could add to the rumor mill is a broadcast of the Chambers Brothers that was supposedly split between WBCN and one of the local public radio stations. This was related to me by someone who worked at BCN, but so far haven't found anything to back it up.

 

[Marcsten]

I guess the way I assumed the live 'quad' shows worked was that the producer would take a four track master and run it through an encoder to create the quad two track matrix master, which was then copied and distributed to the station to air. At the time I assumed they were on tape, but in the late 1970s I worked at a college radio station. We would get concerts to play on the air, and these were on 12" LPs in plain white sleeves, so by then someone was cutting them onto vinyl. The ones we got then were not quads, however. The two I recall was the Pretenders and the B-52s. Very much of 1979!

 

[gvl_guy]

The double FM broadcasts were a big deal back then. Companies couldn't own more than one AM and one FM in any market at the time. So it was two companies that had to team up for the broadcasts on two FM stations. In the case of classical, I wouldn't be surprised if one of the stations was non commercial. Public type stations will do that.

 

[quadaholic]

I guess the way I assumed the live 'quad' shows worked was that the producer would take a four track master and run it through an encoder to create the quad two track matrix master, which was then copied and distributed to the station to air. At the time I assumed they were on tape, but in the late 1970s I worked at a college radio station. We would get concerts to play on the air, and these were on 12" LPs in plain white sleeves, so by then someone was cutting them onto vinyl. The ones we got then were not quads, however. The two I recall was the Pretenders and the B-52s. Very much o

I guess the way I assumed the live 'quad' shows worked was that the producer would take a four track master and run it through an encoder to create the quad two track matrix master, which was then copied and distributed to the station to air. At the time I assumed they were on tape, but in the late 1970s I worked at a college radio station. We would get concerts to play on the air, and these were on 12" LPs in plain white sleeves, so by then someone was cutting them onto vinyl. The ones we got then were not quads, however. The two I recall was the Pretenders and the B-52s. Very much of 1979!

Marcsten,

Your initial assumption is pretty much the way it was always done. Almost all the quad that was sent out for syndication was encoded stereo. Even some of the Biscuit stuff was mixed to encoded stereo to start with, and no 4 track master would have ever existed. The early attempts using 2 radio stations must have been a thrill to hear, but expecting the average consumer to have 2 receivers and 2 sets of speakers would have never worked out. Rebroadcasts of earlier King Biscuit shows on vinyl would theoretically still be encoded, provided it was the same mix, but might have suffered a bit if the mastering guys weren't keeping the extra phase info in mind. I think mastering quad vinyl involved a little more care than a regular stereo disc, but I'm not the person to ask about that.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

I thought I'd update some quad F M info that I have gleaned from Billboard Magazine articles on various syndications and broadcasts relevant to this thread. Starting 1972 through 1976 .



Feb 12 ,72 page 17 --a small article that mentions CHFI FM Toronto is testing a Discrete system .



That same issue mentions on page 16 and 17 :

ALTO FONIC Programing L .A.....produces studio material mixed down to 4 channel and encoded for syndication.
They use artists from both CBS and RCA (including Jack Lemmon , Jimmie Haskell , Ray Conniff , Hugo Montenegro , Henry Mancini , Johnny Mathis , Percy Faith , Lalo Schifrin ).
Program titles : S' Wonderful , S' Marvelous , It's Gershwin .
Broadcasting starts Jan 17 th and Rock programs are to follow .
They have 8 stations now with others pending.

The matrix format is not mentioned for ALTO FONIC until the first issue in May.......namely ;
(Billboard May 06 , 1972 page 61 )
"ALTO FONIC FM Syndication , is in QS , and now has 15 U. S. stations "



Also in the same May 06 ,72 issue on page 60 , is a Sansui Promo for WFMT Chicago broadcasts in QS.

 

[quadaholic]

Fiz

I thought I'd update some quad F M info that I have gleaned from Billboard Magazine articles on various syndications and broadcasts relevant to this thread. Starting 1972 through 1976 .



Feb 12 ,72 page 17 --a small article that mentions CHFI FM Toronto is testing a Discrete system .



That same issue mentions on page 16 and 17 :

ALTO FONIC Programing L .A.....produces studio material mixed down to 4 channel and encoded for syndication.
They use artists from both CBS and RCA (including Jack Lemmon , Jimmie Haskell , Ray Conniff , Hugo Montenegro , Henry Mancini , Johnny Mathis , Percy Faith , Lalo Schifrin ).
Program titles : S' Wonderful , S' Marvelous , It's Gershwin .
Broadcasting starts Jan 17 th and Rock programs are to follow .
They have 8 stations now with others pending.

The matrix format is not mentioned for ALTO FONIC until the first issue in May.......namely ;
(Billboard May 06 , 1972 page 61 )
"ALTO FONIC FM Syndication , is in QS , and now has 15 U. S. stations "



Also in the same May 06 ,72 issue on page 60 , is a Sansui Promo for WFMT Chicago broadcasts in QS.

Fizzy,
Thank you for continuing to find these little nuggets of lost documentation. It is always good to have more recordings to be on the look out for.
If you are able to look through Billboard articles from this time, I would like to add some Quad info from 1972 that I recently came across. While digging through someones tape collection, I came across some syndicated recordings made at the Shaeffer Music Festival in NYC. The recordings were sponsored by CBS/Sony, and had cue sheets in them specifically referencing SQ encoding. They were sent out for broadcast in the summer of 1972. Some of the bands I saw were ShaNaNa, Savoy Brown, Loggins and Messina, and a couple of others that I can't remember at the moment. I sent a message to Mr. Anderson about them a month or so back. I don't know what will happen with these reels, as there are some complicated ownership issues in play, but maybe there might other copies of these shows out there in trader land.
If you have the ability to look through old issues of Billboard, maybe you could look through spring and summer of 72 and see if you can find more documentation. Up until I came across these reels, I had never heard anything about these recordings.

 

[steelydave]

Sorry I wasn't able to find a larger version of the ad, but it did come with some partially-garbled OCR of the text which I've filled in the blanks for and transcribed below.

The Brewers of Schaefer Beer and Ron Delsener Productions are proud to present this radio first: Broadcasts of recent concerts at The Schaefer Music Festival in New York's Central Park in FM Stereo. Broadcasts can also be heard in Quadraphonic on SQ equipment. So be sure to tune in and catch the very best in Rock and Folk Music. It's the next best thing to being there.

This Week

Tomorrow Night at 8:00 p.m.
Seatrain

Saturday, August 12, 8:00 p.m.
J.Geils Band

Saturday, August 19, 8:00 p.m.
Tom Rush

Saturday, August 26, 8:00 p.m.
Blood, Sweat & Tears

Saturday, September 2, 8:0 p.m.
Poco

Saturday, September 9, 8:00 p.m.
Billy Preston

 

[quadaholic]

Sorry I wasn't able to find a larger version of the ad, but it did come with some partially-garbled OCR of the text which I've filled in the blanks for and transcribed below.

View attachment 59777

The Brewers of Schaefer Beer and Ron Delsener Productions are proud to present this radio first: Broadcasts of recent concerts at The Schaefer Music Festival in New York's Central Park in FM Stereo. Broadcasts can also be heard in Quadraphonic on SQ equipment. So be sure to tune in and catch the very best in Rock and Folk Music. It's the next best thing to being there.

This Week

Tomorrow Night at 8:00 p.m.
Seatrain

Saturday, August 12, 8:00 p.m.
J.Geils Band

Saturday, August 19, 8:00 p.m.
Tom Rush

Saturday, August 26, 8:00 p.m.
Blood, Sweat & Tears

Saturday, September 2, 8:0 p.m.
Poco

Saturday, September 9, 8:00 p.m.
Billy Preston
[/QUOTE
Well there you

Sorry I wasn't able to find a larger version of the ad, but it did come with some partially-garbled OCR of the text which I've filled in the blanks for and transcribed below.

View attachment 59777

The Brewers of Schaefer Beer and Ron Delsener Productions are proud to present this radio first: Broadcasts of recent concerts at The Schaefer Music Festival in New York's Central Park in FM Stereo. Broadcasts can also be heard in Quadraphonic on SQ equipment. So be sure to tune in and catch the very best in Rock and Folk Music. It's the next best thing to being there.

This Week

Tomorrow Night at 8:00 p.m.
Seatrain

Saturday, August 12, 8:00 p.m.
J.Geils Band

Saturday, August 19, 8:00 p.m.
Tom Rush

Saturday, August 26, 8:00 p.m.
Blood, Sweat & Tears

Saturday, September 2, 8:0 p.m.
Poco

Saturday, September 9, 8:00 p.m.
Billy Preston

Well that was quick! It's kind of a shame to see that J.Geils was on the list, as that show was definitely not there. I love this newspaper clipping. I wish I could see it in higher res. Love those movie ads! Woot woot!

 

[steelydave]

If you (or anyone) has a subscription to newspapers.com it's available there:

https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/435522932/

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Fiz

Fizzy,
Thank you for continuing to find these little nuggets of lost documentation. It is always good to have more recordings to be on the look out for.
If you are able to look through Billboard articles from this time, I would like to add some Quad in
If you have the ability to look through old issues of Billboard, maybe you could look through spring and summer of 72 and see if you can find more documentation. Up until I came across these reels, I had never heard anything about these recordings.

Well the good news is that I do , so I will be reporting more from my notes from time to time. I have 100 pages of notes of various quad info (not just broadcasting) I gathered when I perused Billboard issues from 72-76 inclusive.
They are not all in exact chronological order so I will be reporting slowly in order that they are .

 

[fizzywiggs41]

Here's another ;

June 24, 1972 page 49.....

There was an SQ broadcast of the group "Mandrill"@ The Village Gate by WCBS on Monday June 12 . (Mandrill is on the Polydor label )

And from March 25 th 1972 page 26 ;

GRT Recording Studios supplied 20 Discrete Masters to K101 FM from the labels Chess/Checker , ABC , and Ranwood .



July 01 1972 page 48 ;

Dutch Radio "NOS" will have their first quad broadcast of The Royal Chamber Orchestra , Utrecht ...in August .
(No mention of format)

July 15th 1972 advert of Skitch Henderson in Minneapolis , MOR quad syndication show known as "Studio 4 ".
Sponsored by Telex Corp.
(no mention of format)


August 12 1972 (sorry I forgot to note page#);

"Agency Recording has spent the last 10 months recording live broadcasts for quad , for broadcast on WNCR FM (Cleveland).
By artists ; Brewer and Shipely , Jackson Browne , Carol Hall , Fanny , Brownsville Station , Tiny Alice , Alex Bevin ,
Ellen McIlwaine , Bull Angus , Buckwheat , and Bonnie Koloc all one hour live broadcasts."
(No mention of format)



September 16 th 1972 page 16+22 ;

ABC FM Stations are broadcasting in 4channel (QS) in the following U.S. cities ...Houston , Cleveland , Baltimore , and New Orleans . The broadcasts are usually 1-3 hours per day.



September 23 1972 page 27 ;

Skitch Henderson's "Studio 4", 4 channel show , produced out of Minneapolis contains 91 hours for syndication . Sponsored by Telex Corp.
(no mention of format )

 

[quadaholic]

If you (or anyone) has a subscription to newspapers.com it's available there:

https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/435522932/

Very very cool. Thank you. I think I was maybe in 2nd grade at the time. I didn't discover FM radio until 74. In addition to WBCN, there was a station called WVBF who had a couple of staff members that were central in the formation of WMMS.

 

[steelydave]

Well that was quick! It's kind of a shame to see that J.Geils was on the list, as that show was definitely not there. I love this newspaper clipping. I wish I could see it in higher res. Love those movie ads! Woot woot!

Found a couple more in the July 7, 1972 issue of the New York Daily News:

https://www.newspapers.com/newspage/464148979/

(Same text about it being a quad broadcast as the previous ad I posted)

Tomorrow Night at 8:00 PM (July 8)
Mandrill

Saturday, July 15. 8:00 PM
The Chambers Brothers

 

[quadaholic]

Here's another ;

June 24, 1972 page 49.....

There was an SQ broadcast of the group "Mandrill"@ The Village Gate by WCBS on Monday June 12 . (Mandrill is on the Polydor label )

And from March 25 th 1972 page 26 ;

GRT Recording Studios supplied 20 Discrete Masters to K101 FM from the labels Chess/Checker , ABC , and Ranwood .



July 01 1972 page 48 ;

Dutch Radio "NOS" will have their first quad broadcast of The Royal Chamber Orchestra , Utrecht ...in August .
(No mention of format)

July 15th 1972 advert of Skitch Henderson in Minneapolis , MOR quad syndication show known as "Studio 4 ".
Sponsored by Telex Corp.
(no mention of format)


August 12 1972 (sorry I forgot to note page#);

"Agency Recording has spent the last 10 months recording live broadcasts for quad , for broadcast on WNCR FM (Cleveland).
By artists ; Brewer and Shipely , Jackson Browne , Carol Hall , Fanny , Brownsville Station , Tiny Alice , Alex Bevin ,
Ellen McIlwaine , Bull Angus , Buckwheat , and Bonnie Koloc all one hour live broadcasts."
(No mention of format)



September 16 th 1972 page 16+22 ;

ABC FM Stations are broadcasting in 4channel (QS) in the following U.S. cities ...Houston , Cleveland , Baltimore , and New Orleans . The broadcasts are usually 1-3 hours per day.



September 23 1972 page 27 ;

Skitch Henderson's "Studio 4", 4 channel show , produced out of Minneapolis contains 91 hours for syndication . Sponsored by Telex Corp.
(no mention of format )

Incredible. Shudder to think where all these masters went off to. Hopefully not to Universal.

 

[fizzywiggs41]

December 30th 1972 has 2,

Firstly ; page 06
" FREE NY CONCERT PRODUCTIONS " a New York Concerts Company , will have quad P.A. and Broadcasting.
F M stations to be negotiated . (There is an advert on page 16.)
EGO LOSS CONCEPTS will start in February 1973 at the Riverside Plaza Hotel's Grand Ballroom.
(I believe Ego Loss and Free N Y are one in the same)(no mention of format)

Page 20 ;
SuperSound Studios , Programing Division , out of Philadelphia Pennsylvania are offering 40 hours of Quadraphonic Christmas Festival plus other quad matrix programming.
(no mention of format )