(UHQCD format x MQA technology). Disc's-DAC's-Streamers and Tidal

[4-earredwonder]

Yer like why people like <expletive deleted> Garden Gnomes!

If people like the sound of MQA that is great, and I don't have a problem with that, but MQA (even off a CD) is not as you would hear from an unprocessed Master tape.

For Cassette, Vinyl, CD, BDA, 24-bit FLACs etc. the measured difference is obvious but the difference people hear is not as great as the measurements would indicate. The reason is a mixture of the way our ears and brain perceive sound, plus good old bias. I personally like the 'sound' of vinyl, but it is not Master quality, listen to a BDA then an LP and you notice a 'difference' but after a while you're just listening to the music (or ought to be!). MQA is technically a lossy process, and dithering, upsampling, and all the complicated techniques deployed will not change that. Maybe the better sound is that the Mastering Engineer is taking more 'care'.

HDCD decoders used the data stream on the CD to bury the additional information used to add 4-bits to the already 16-bits on the disc, and my Joni Mitchell HDCD do 'sound' better than my standard CDs did. I for one was upset at its demise.

I would say that MQA are very good at marketing.

Agree the HDCD Joni Mitchell remasters sound great ... but my MQA~CD of Mitchell's BLUE sounds astonishing!

 

[marpow]

New MQA disc release.
Curated and compiled by John McLaughlin; a collection of his finest performances from 6 legendary concerts (5 concerts on the CD format) at the Montreux Jazz Festival between 1978 and 2016.
Release Date: 04/03/2022
https://themontreuxyears.tmstor.es/product/91071

 

[4-earredwonder]

New MQA disc release.
Curated and compiled by John McLaughlin; a collection of his finest performances from 6 legendary concerts (5 concerts on the CD format) at the Montreux Jazz Festival between 1978 and 2016.
Release Date: 04/03/2022
https://themontreuxyears.tmstor.es/product/91071

WOW, WOW, WOW Markie. Good find. IMO, all those Montreux MQA encoded CDs sound EXCEPTIONAL!

 

[marpow]

Totally agree Ralphie. I have them all. Highly recommend, they do not need to be listened to via MQA although I do. The music and quality of the recordings even on CD are superb. And this one is only $14.00.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Totally agree Ralphie. I have them all. Highly recommend, they do not need to be listened to via MQA although I do. The music and quality of the recordings even on CD are superb. And this one is only $14.00.

BTW, I was able to purchase ALL those Montreux MQA~CDs from US Vendor's ImportCD/Deep Discount in that luxury packaging for way less than ordering from that SWISS Website .....

John McLaughlin John Mclaughlin: The Montreux Years on ImportCDs [same price but s/h will be LESS]

 

[Robbio]

Here is my 2 cents on MQA-CD having had several of them.

Playing in an OPPO-205

• The OPPO-205 was created before it could decode MQA, Therefore there is no MQA indicator on the front panel, it displays on the screen as discussed
• The OPPO-205 does the full unfold of MQA

Playing in an Ordinary CD Player

• You can play an MQA-CD in an ordinary CD player via the analog outputs and will just be 16bit 44.1 khz
• Outputting via Toslink into an MQA renderer like the Blu-sound power-node etc will take the 16bit 44.1 khz signal and do the full MQA unfolding

Ripping an MQA-CD

• You can rip an MQA cd using a bit perfect method like Exact Audio Copy (There are others like XLD on a mac) to flac. Then you can use a program from MQA company called "MQA Tag Restorer" to inject the MQA tags into the file. You can then play back these files on an OPPO-205 in full MQA or any other MQA DAC.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Here is my 2 cents on MQA-CD having had several of them.

Playing in an OPPO-205

• The OPPO-205 was created before it could decode MQA, Therefore there is no MQA indicator on the front panel, it displays on the screen as discussed
• The OPPO-205 does the full unfold of MQA

Playing in an Ordinary CD Player

• You can play an MQA-CD in an ordinary CD player via the analog outputs and will just be 16bit 44.1 khz
• Outputting via Toslink into an MQA renderer like the Blu-sound power-node etc will take the 16bit 44.1 khz signal and do the full MQA unfolding

Ripping an MQA-CD

• You can rip an MQA cd using a bit perfect method like Exact Audio Copy (There are others like XLD on a mac) to flac. Then you can use a program from MQA company called "MQA Tag Restorer" to inject the MQA tags into the file. You can then play back these files on an OPPO-205 in full MQA or any other MQA DAC.

So far, I have about 60+ MQA discs and each and every one of them sound astonishing....compared to what, you ask? As many imply, could it just be better mastering. I suspect that is a factor but IMO, not the main factor. Poster Ricky [cbmmm3] implored me to get the 2 MQA~CD This Is The Moody Blues compilation and I was reluctant as I had all of the tracks on Multi~CH/Stereo SACD but fully MQA unfolded ...what an absolute REVELATION. If ONLY the multi~CH SACDs sounded this brilliant. MQA disc after disc is a revelation, whether classical, jazz, pop or rock from KISS to JONI MITCHELL to Leonard Bernstein conducting Beethoven's Ninth Symphony on the DGG label.

And to me the BIG BONUS ..... Taking a CD which is 44.1/16 bit and adding the MQA layer to expand it to 24 bit/88.2 and higher resolution. PERFECT SOUND FOREVER ....40 YEARS LATER⁉

Unless you've ACTUALLY experienced if for yourself ...forget what you've READ ......Try at least one MQA disc [EVOSOUND has quite a few for under $16] and see what the fuss is all about.

I'm a CONVERT. Nuff said!

HIGH OCTANE

 

[Perp]

That’s great Ralph! Listen to Ricky but not me. I told you to get that Moody Blues MQA disc and what did you say to me? Mind my own business. I have all the quad SACD’s and that’s all I need. But, no! You had to listen to Ricky. Why? Because you do what Ricky tells you to do. Would you jump off a cliff because Ricky asked you to do so?

Just pokin’ fun.

 

[Robbio]

It’s good that people still appreciate stereo too on this forum even though I am always on the hunt for quad.

just bought my self 3 Santana quad SACD from CD Japan.

By the way. My best most resolving MQA Cds are Steely Dan-Pretzel Logic and George Harrison-All things must pass.
Perfect examples.

 

[4-earredwonder]

That’s great Ralph! Listen to Ricky but not me. I told you to get that Moody Blues MQA disc and what did you say to me? Mind my own business. I have all the quad SACD’s and that’s all I need. But, no! You had to listen to Ricky. Why? Because you do what Ricky tells you to do. Would you jump off a cliff because Ricky asked you to do so?

Just pokin’ fun.

Yes, Ricky

 

[marpow]

Maybe others are watching this thread and we all can be helpful, so I will give my experience with MQA.
1. I completely agree with Ralphie. Even without unfolding the MQA the CD by itself is real good.
2. For me, I have acquired a fair amount of MQA discs. Many of the MQA discs sold have also been released as SHM SACD and SACD. I refuse to double dip between a MQA and a SACD.
3. I own a Luxman D-O3X for direct hard disc MQA play. They play and sound great through the Luxman unfolded completely.
4. I have ripped all my MQA discs into FLAC digital files. When I listen to them via my JRiver software they only play as 16/44.1 RBCD.
The Luxman has a driver where you can take your ripped digital (MQA) disc and add to the playlist of this Luxman driver, play the song/album and the Luxman unfolds the ripped MQA FLAC file for a quality sounding listen.
5. You can also run Tidal through the Luxman (@cbmmm3 knows how) for true Tidal Master Quality.
6. All MQA discs unfold at different rates, higher and lower.
7. My advice: If you are looking to spend your hard earned money on upgrading your audio situation, go in the direction of creating an Atmos listening situation, with the ability to playback Atmos in either hard discs, streaming, or ripped files.
MQA should be after that, and really only for the pure lover of stereo, which I am, I love stereo.
It would be also cheaper, which I have done also, is to be able to play Tidal from your phone, with AudioQuest Dragonfly DAC with MQA decoding, I have the Dragonfly RED DAC. This way you can have many more MQA releases than the hard discs available for purchase.
8. Hopefully this helps someone who has no experience with MQA so that you can decide for yourself whether MQA is a worthwhile experience and investment.
9. If you have no experience with MQA and you own no MQA equipment, please, we don't need to hear all the ramblings and science of what you think based on no personal experience, that never helps someone who is trying to weigh the decision for themselves.
I say this because I actually can't believe how many people on QQ comment about Atmos, who say I don't have Atmos, but listen to what I say,
really, just boring to me.

 

[mandrix]

Thanks for breaking that down to someone late to trying to figure this out. Very helpful, marpow.

 

[cbmmm3]

That’s great Ralph! Listen to Ricky but not me. I told you to get that Moody Blues MQA disc and what did you say to me? Mind my own business. I have all the quad SACD’s and that’s all I need. But, no! You had to listen to Ricky. Why? Because you do what Ricky tells you to do. Would you jump off a cliff because Ricky asked you to do so?

Just pokin’ fun.

Ralph, Please get me another cup of coffee. Dont dawdle....

 

[cbmmm3]

my mind wanders. Ill get to my question una momento but I run my cd player analog into my Preamp. Said Preamp / DAC is also a Surround Processor with the ability to synthesize surround etc. Running a cd throught the Pre sounds like glorious 5.0
Running full unfold MQA through the processor sounds like some of the best 5.0 I have ever heard ( comparison - Songs From The Big Chair MQA CD synthesized to 5.0 blows away the actual 5.1 Wilson disc ! )

My question, has anyone run MQA through the Surround Master V3 yet ? I dont have a Surround Master so I am naive about the machine. My thought process is that it would sound awesome if it is possible to do this .. Anyone ? Chucky ?

 

[4-earredwonder]

my mind wanders. Ill get to my question una momento but I run my cd player analog into my Preamp. Said Preamp / DAC is also a Surround Processor with the ability to synthesize surround etc. Running a cd throught the Pre sounds like glorious 5.0 Running full unfold MQA through the processor sounds like some of the best 5.0 I have ever heard ( comparison - Songs From The Big Chair MQA CD synthesized to 5.0 blows away the actual 5.1 Wilson disc ! )

My question, has anyone run MQA through the Surround Master V3 yet ? I dont have a Surround Master so I am naive about the machine. My thought process is that it would sound awesome if it is possible to do this .. Anyone ? Chucky ?

Was thinking the same thing, Ricky. Have yet to purchase Chucky's amazing device but I cannot see why NOT. AFAIK, there is only one UHQ MQA~CD which 'retains' the original QS encoding [it was a single inventory QS encoded disc] and it sounds pretty amazing through a DOLBY PRO LOGIC II decoder:

{The titles above were released only in quad, no stereo version known} From Mark Anderson's QUADRAPHONIC DISCOGRAPHY

BTW, Am currently spinning Bob James fantastic MQA~CD [EVOSOUND] 'FEEL LIKE MAKING LIVE' which was included with the stunning BD~V disc.

 

[4-earredwonder]

Ralph, Please get me another cup of coffee. Dont dawdle....

 

[dadregga]

If Tidal Masters is MQA based and you do not have an MQA decoder than you are really not hearing anything better than Tidal's non masters?

Un-decoded MQA is strictly worse than no MQA at all - MQA works by encoding high frequency (stuff > 20khz which 44.1 PCM doesn't retain, because it's outside the range of human hearing) content into the digital noise floor, which practically reduces the available bit depth, so un-decoded MQA 44.1/16 PCM is actually more like 44.1/12 PCM - some of the normal 16 bit-depth is consumed by the encoded MQA content, which, without decoding, just gets you a PCM file with a higher-than-usual amount of low-level noise (which you probably can't hear).

That being said - The TIDAL app itself does a "first unfold" of the MQA content in software when it plays back/streams MQA files. However, if you listen to an MQA CD outside of TIDAL, you do not get the benefit of this "first unfold" unless you have a player or DAC that can do it - so you are getting worse-than-CD quality, from a math perspective.

TL;DR - undecoded MQA on a CD is literally, mathematically worse than regular CD Redbook PCM, so if you want to play back something with MQA encoding make sure you can decode it.

It's a lot like HDCD in this regard - undecoded it's worse than regular Redbook PCM, decoded it's better if you believe frequencies your ears cannot pick up can affect your hearing in ways people haven't been able to prove, and overall in no way better (and much more hassle than) standard high-res PCM.

 

[kfbkfb]

https://kaiserscience.wordpress.com/2016/07/21/the-new-hi-fi-debate-and-the-science-of-sound/
CD sound quality A/B testing results (nothing about MQA, this just seemed like useful info)


Kirk Bayne

 

[mandrix]

Do these Audioquest Dragonfly usb dac's only work with headphones? If not, would they work on a pc sound system where the dac is plugged into the pc itself (my pc sound AVR has no usb ports but is using the Asus motherboard's built in Realtek/analog out 3.5mm jacks)
Inquiring mind (or read as clueless individual) wants to know.

 

[cbmmm3]

Do these Audioquest Dragonfly usb dac's only work with headphones? If not, would they work on a pc sound system where the dac is plugged into the pc itself (my pc sound AVR has no usb ports but is using the Asus motherboard's built in Realtek/analog out 3.5mm jacks)
Inquiring mind (or read as clueless individual) wants to know.

dont take this as a 'fer sure' but I dont see any problem why it would not work